ECT WOOD, HAY, AND JERRY

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
According to "Arnold what's his name" it was "Paul who uniquely received the revelation concerning the dispensation of grace."

But then he turns reason on its head and says that the dispensation of grace began at Acts 2, which was years before Paul was converted!

How can you take this guy seriously?
 

intojoy

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You can't close your eyes to the truth forever, can you?

Arnold would be very disappointed with you if you wouldn't at least try to defend his ideas!

No he doesn't need his disciples to do anything on his behalf because he is totally convinced of his positions. He doesn't need to write them out on a forum. That's what happens when you have the truth.


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Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
No he doesn't need his disciples to do anything on his behalf because he is totally convinced of his positions.

In other words, you will not even attempt to defend Arnold's teaching even though you started this thread in the hope you could show Arnold's superior knowledge. Now you see how badly he blundered!
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member

Your friend Arnold thinks he is such an expert on things Jewish but he cannot even recognize that the "church" spoken of at Acts 2 is the Jewish assembly and not the Body of Christ.

How could he possibly make such a huge blunder?

Perhaps he is not really Jewish?
 

intojoy

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Your friend Arnold thinks he is such an expert on things Jewish but he cannot even recognize that the "church" spoken of at Acts 2 is the Jewish assembly and not the Body of Christ.

How could he possibly make such a huge blunder?

Perhaps he is not really Jewish?

Contempt


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intojoy

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intojoy

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STUDY OF THE MINOR PROPHETS
In the Hebrew bible all 12 minor prophets are counted as one book and are simply called "The Twelve."

Term minor prophets first used by Augustine because of their small size.

Chronological Sequence and Geographic Area

Obadiah 845 southern kingdom
Joel 835 southern kingdom
Amos 810-783 northern kingdom
Jonah 824-783 Assyria
Hosea 790-725 northern kingdom
Micah 758-710 southern kingdom
Nahum 710-664 southern kingdom
Habakkuk 650-622 southern kingdom
Zephaniah 640-610 southern kingdom
Haggai 520 to the Jews of the Restoration
Zachariah 520 to the Jews of the Restoration
Malachi 433-424 to the Jews of the Restoration

Main Themes:

1. Basic spiritual principles concerning God and man.
2. Strong condemnation of sin.
3. Provide comfort to the believing Remnant.
4. Prophecy things both near and far.
5. Prophetic Periods: (1) their own times socially and politically (2) the Babylonian and Assyrian captivities and restoration from the Babylonian and Assyrian captivities (3) first coming of Messiah (4) coming of the Great Tribulation (5) second coming prophecies (6) elements of the Messianic Kingdom.

OBADIAH The First One

Vs 1: introduction - the vision
Timing:
* name means the servant of Jehovah
* no mention of king reigning
* Jeremiah quotes vs 1-4 in 49:14-16 and vs 5-6 in 49:9-10 and vs 8-9 in 49:7,22
*Joel quotes vs 17 in 2:32
Therefore Obadiah precedes Jeremiah's prophecies.
*10-14 describes a sacking of Jerusalem but which one? King Jehoram 845 BC Jerusalem sacked by the philistines, arabs and Edom likely the sacking described by Obadiah.

Locale: Judah
Historical Setting: The sacking of Jerusalem of 845 BC
Major Points: (1) God will avenge Israel (2) God will restore Israel
Theme: The doom of Edom
*edom had a brotherhood relationship with Israel even closer than Moab and Ammon but Edom was the most antagonistic against Israel that is why the prophets are more severe in their dealings with Edom.
Prophetic Vision: Not all prophecies came by means of visions but this one did come that way where a video is played out for the prophet and what is seen is written down.

Coming Total Destruction of Edom
Vs 1b: call goes out with an ambassador sent out. Possibly an angel is sent out to stir up the nations against Edom. Whether in the angelic or human realm something is going on.

Vs 2: Edom population reduction.

Vs 3: Edom's pride and security will be of no avail.

Vs 4: Edom's defensive heights seem impenetrable but they are not.

Vs 5: Description of the destruction seen in contrast of robbers and gatherers of the field. No one is ever capable of robbing every little item. But this destruction will leave nothing behind.

Vs 6: None of her allies will help Edom.

Vs 7: her allies will turn against her.

Vs 8: the counsel of her wisemen shall fail.

Vs 9: everyone cutoff no descendants left alive.

Reason for Edom's Destruction

Vs 10: For sinning against her twin brother.

Vs 11: For failing to come to the aid of Israel under duress.

Vs 12: For exercising glee over Israel's distress.

Vs 13: Edom followed after the invading armies and took what was left in Israel.

Vs 14: Edom blocked escapees from making it out.

And delivered those who they captured over to the enemy.

Ezekiel 35:1-5: Edom has had a perpetual hatred for Israel. Began in Numbers 14 twice Edom refused passage of the Jews thru their land even tho Moses made the request based upon blood relationships.

Timing of the Fulfillment of the Prophecy in the Day of Jehovah aka The Tribulation



Vs 15: The most common name for the seven years of future judgement is not the Tribulation but the Day of Jehovah.

Vs 16: Another reason why this will happen to them is because when they arrived on the mount the got drunk. Now they are to be swallowed up.

Vs 17: Israel will survive it. Those that escaped are known as the Remnant of Israel.

Vs 18: While Israel will have a Remnant, Edom will not. Ezekiel 25:12-14 - same point made. Esau to have no descendants in the Messianic Kingdom. Other prophets reveal that while the rest of the earth blossoms during the kingdom, Edom will be a land of smoke and Edom to be a confinement of demons.

Vs 19: Possession of land by the Jews.

Vs 20: The Jews captured anywhere else will be returned to the land and Zerapath which is Lebanon will be their possession.

Vs 21: The Jews will establish the Kingdom.

Obadiah is the first of the minor prophets and he sets the motif.

JOEL

Name: means Jehovah is God
Date:
* no kingship mentioned
* Joel 3:16 quoted by Amos in 1:2 & 3:18 in Amos 9:13 thus putting his prophecy before Amos.
* he does not rail against idolatry like Amos
* Probably prophesied during the reign of Joash a good king in 835 BC
Locale: Judah probably Jerusalem
Historical Setting: a locust invasion that set the stage for two future invasions one demonic and one an army.
Two Major Points: (1) God controls world events (2) God always responds to repentance
Theme: The Day of Jehovah 1:15,2:1,11,31,3:14.
NT Quotes: 2:28-32 in Acts 2:17-21, and 2:32 in Rom 10:13.

Historical Locust Invasion 2-14

Vs 2: This invasion unique to all past history. The old men could not recall anything to compare it to.

Vs 3: Elders are told to tell of it to four generations.

Vs 4: Four stages of devastation: Four successive swarms. In the Old Testament the number four sometimes represents totality of destruction (Jer 15:3, Ez 14:21). Again by the time Joel writes these words this is not a prophecy but already history. But it will become the background for something prophetic.

Vs 5: The drunks are called to awake after their last binge and to weep and wail for there wine is to be cut off.

Vs 6: These things are destroyed by an army of locusts which symbolizes an army as in Pr 30:25,27.

Vs 7: The branches are made white meaning the bark itself has been eaten up. Not only are the drunks to mourn but also the rest of the population.

Vs 8: Those to lament (Hebrew word for lament "Betulah" used only here and nowhere else in the OT it's a feminine imperative because it pictures the whole nation as the virgin daughter of Zion).

Vs 9: Priesthood called to repent now because the things that sustained them from the tithes is now gone.

Vs 10 - 12a: Again emphasis on what has been lost.

Vs 12b: No Feast of First Fruits.

Vs 13: Refers to the priesthood as the ministers of the altar because they were responsible for the offering and as ministers of my God because they were responsible for representing God. They're told to keep the sackcloth normally worn only at day are to keep it on even in their sleep.

There is a real danger of massive starvation.

Vs 14: Joel calls upon all people to fast which would be a sign (Judges 20:26, Neh 1:4) of outward national grief and repentance. And to cry unto the Lord showing the inward repentance.

The Prophetic Invasion, Joel Shoots Forward to the Day of Jehovah

Vs 15: Begins with an announcement: (Joel's theme) The Day of Jehovah is at hand.

Vs 16: In this day also sustenance cut off from the temple as in the locust invasion.

Vs 17: In the preceding invasion things were destroyed by things eating them but here these things will be destroyed by fire.

Vs 18:






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northwye

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Christian Zionists on TOl appear to want to avoid defining their theology clearly and they want to avoid clearly giving their interpretation of the meanings of key scriptures that talk about the Biblical doctrines that might be relevant to Christian Zionism.

To say that the ekklesia in Acts 25-42 is a Jewish assembly rather than being the Body of Christ is defining a part of Christian Zionist doctrine.

What are the New Testament doctrines relevant to who is the ekklesia and who is the Body of Christ. Romans 10; 12 and Galatians 3: 28 are relevant to this issue.

But the New Testament does make a distinction between the saved and the not saved, and Galatians 3 explains that the physical bloodline does not determine who is saved and who is not saved.

Those of the physical bloodline in Acts 2 who were saved are part of the remnant in Romans 11: 1-5, who began the New Covenant elect of Christ. To claim they are still Old Covenant Israel is false. They are of the Body of Christ and can be called the assembly, from ekklesia, but eklessia is a common noun, while Israel is a unique group, a proper noun. Here is an issue, that can be part of the controversy of Sion or Zion - Isaiah 34: 8.

The saved people of the physical bloodline in Acts 2 are of the Body of Christ, but to say they are also the Israel of God (Galatians 6: 16) brings up a controversy with Christian Zionism. when you admit that saved Gentiles are also the Israel of God. To appear to win the argument, Christian Zionists have to obscure this issue in some way.
 

intojoy

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Christian Zionists on TOl appear to want to avoid defining their theology clearly and they want to avoid clearly giving their interpretation of the meanings of key scriptures that talk about the Biblical doctrines that might be relevant to Christian Zionism.

To say that the ekklesia in Acts 25-42 is a Jewish assembly rather than being the Body of Christ is defining a part of Christian Zionist doctrine.

What are the New Testament doctrines relevant to who is the ekklesia and who is the Body of Christ. Romans 10; 12 and Galatians 3: 28 are relevant to this issue.

But the New Testament does make a distinction between the saved and the not saved, and Galatians 3 explains that the physical bloodline does not determine who is saved and who is not saved.

Those of the physical bloodline in Acts 2 who were saved are part of the remnant in Romans 11: 1-5, who began the New Covenant elect of Christ. To claim they are still Old Covenant Israel is false. They are of the Body of Christ and can be called the assembly, from ekklesia, but eklessia is a common noun, while Israel is a unique group, a proper noun. Here is an issue, that can be part of the controversy of Sion or Zion - Isaiah 34: 8.

The saved people of the physical bloodline in Acts 2 are of the Body of Christ, but to say they are also the Israel of God (Galatians 6: 16) brings up a controversy with Christian Zionism. when you admit that saved Gentiles are also the Israel of God. To appear to win the argument, Christian Zionists have to obscure this issue in some way.

GOBLYGOOK


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