Sorry about the lateness of this, Lon. We had very bad weather here and I've lost a couple of responses that couldn't be executed and, because they were written here and without a back up, were lost. I'll give you the shorter version.
I'm not sure of your point on this one so I'll have to ask for clarification.
Whoever the two consenting adults, both of their parents are touched by the inevitable early death, the shame (and I'm meaning societal, if not spiritual, emotional, but those too) of it. They lobbied for this, but all of them know they are harming their extended families. Because of that, as representatives and only empowered as much as they serve the needs of all the people, the law has harmed society. There is no question. The law needs to be changed away from full and impartial acceptance. We never 'legalized' adultery for example. The law just rightly left it alone. They should have done the same, despite lobbying and lawsuits. Sadly, the SCOTUS didn't care to listen. They are operating without any balance and check. I would, that all SCOTUS rulings would necessarily have to pass through the House and Senate, just as the President's. There is no way a good many of their mandates and socialism would pass. It is just wishful thinking, but the majority of big decisions by them have demanded a jury of peers. We didn't even get that, and are serving the sentence. It is really that bad, I think.
There is a long list of sins covered by that same description which are both perfectly legal and receive nary an outcry from the faithful. The question is then do we want to attempt to recreate the law that condemned us or do we want to continue the work of grace, set the example in our walk and proclaim the way out of bondage.
As I said above, I 'wish' all SCOTUS rulings would have to pass through the house and senate before getting to rule all states. The SCOTUS often rules unfairly. We all know it, and it is why there is such an outcry during every appointment to that group. Something is wrong, in balance, when we all realize whoever gets in, is the way to get our agendas accomplished.
In a nutshell, imho, justice cannot be 'blind' less it hurts the whole, it is trying to serve. Some things are just 'right' BUT because we disagree on which is 'right' justice will never be blind. We are responsible for holding up and defending what we know to be right. Right now in America, there is not much the average joe can do to affect or protest. We march by the millions at the Capitol - Nothing. The system imho, doesn't work any more. My paradigm: You CANNOT attack your base, without ruining your country. They rightly need the most consideration. The government as a whole, is dysfunctional, because they reject this paradigm. Imho, that is the political and economic reason we are in the state we are in. The only way to 'make America great again' is to foster the base of a country: Families. All this overt attention to minority views and needs is not all bad, but the pendulum has to swing back or there is going to be a revolution, and I honestly believe, SCOTUS is has a huge hand.
They are serving minority interest 'against' their base. They are no longer serving all of America, but interest groups. Whenever we do so, it is a necessary evil that we attack something of the whole. I think some needed, but again, it is so far on the pendulum swing, it is actually hurting us. We can only absorb so much at a time and 'need' attention and support of families. The SCOTUS rulings affect corporations, thus every ruling carries adverse affects, all the way down.
Our Republic protects the right of the faithful to act in accord with their conscience and leaves most of that between the individual and God. It does not advance any particular faith in this protection. The law balances right between parties and the state. And because of this we haven't had religious purges and associated violence of the sort that destroyed so much of Europe, as Christian slew Christian over thin dogmatic distinctions, to say nothing of those outside of the faith and those advancing other faiths.
I'm saying that is the wrong take of separation and state. It 'used' to be illegal to commit adultery. It is still illegal to be polygamous.
I don't believe that's true given the wide assortment of harmful sins available in most of those societies throughout history. I think its more an intersection of sin and natural inclination, social taboo and our inherent response to the other.
I believe you believe this. I 'think' some of your education has harmed you and must be eschewed. I think politics have indeed crept into the justice system and it is not blind, if it ever was. I also don't think it 'can' be blind. It genuinely needs to serve the greater public, not just the litigants. I think they give a cursory nod, like they did to Franklin Graham, but then that justice is on record as casting an 'angry' vote. That's not justice nor was it blind, it was ignorant and purposefully so. You and I, in a short conversation came up with the correct rule "Civil Union." Nobody asked us, and so the damage is done.
It's an actual assault on your person, does damage to you. It should be outlawed altogether for anyone who has children and in any public place.
No, it is the same reason it is illegal to harm a child, at least as far as parents are concerned. Kids cannot get married until they are 18 or older. If enough kids lobbied and marched for 10 years, they could get it lowered, simply because justice is (or isn't), blind. As I see it, because of the way SCOTUS operates, such would inevitably happen, despite parent's protest. Why? Because 'they aren't loud enough.' Such, isn't justice imho.
What I was getting to is that you cannot argue people out of a position that was not arrived at by reason, a thing I note from time to time around here. True of many positions. The problem comes, for me, when I see those people ignoring their own sin to heap coals on the head of an easier target and when they attempt to do what so many do who raise the pedophile and homosexual in the same sentence. Yes, they're both sins and yes all sin is a perversion, but it's interesting how that word perversion is only really used against the other fellow, against the homosexual and for the same reason that he/she is lumped with the pedophile, because it degrades and offends and removes them from us, from the rest of the sinners. There is a hypocrisy buried in it that offends me and in that offense I've been a little careless and hard.
No worries. There are times I think 'they are right, but harsh.' Other times "wrong AND harsh." I 'think' some of this due to the SCOTUS mandates and out-of-balance as I've suggested. People, who feel deeply about a law or ruling, are being trampled. I happened with Black rights too. Some of it is expected, but as I said, we as a society can only handle so much, because 'people' can only handle so much. Worse, I think we'd be seeing incredible violence if old people were capable of rioting. I think I could muster enough energy, but my parents? :nono: Some change is not good and should be resisted only for this fact: All laws are supposed to serve all, not show favoritism. This is a huge reason I didn't like Obama either. He was a minority and catered to all minorities, and did very little for in the way of concern for the middle working class. The laws he pressed 'shook' that house. Whatever he might have done, is negligible compared to what concessions he demanded. There is no placating and it will be a large reason he is ever seen as the worst president in the last 70 years.
But we do, Lon. And we will, in any number of ways. It's part of the nature of us, of our condition and our struggle.
I disagree, you could argue the same by drug use. It is illegal to commit suicide. Our laws do not 'stop' these activities. We don't always enforce our laws, but are on record as a nation, believing it wrong. Regan was on record believing abortion wrong. It was the 'hope' that doctors would carry our values and aversion. We were trying to leave it in doctor's hands. Remember that? It twisted and became something ugly. We weren't trying to be foolish or open the floodgates. The Legal system 'should' have better protected us, and our interests. They knew better than we (or should have) what opening or closing doors does to all of society. They are not supposed to be blind to needs, just blind so that people can get right rulings.
Ok Doser, No, that's just your proud, wrathful and false witness.
Your anger isn't righteous, it's personal. It's why you followed Rusha about telling her how you were looking forward to her suffering. It's why you're about to smile at the end of your last sentence. It's why I know you have no real understanding of grace beyond, I hope, accepting it for yourself.
Not to me, but 1) I think even he'd recognize posturing. We have a tendency to make the other guy the enemy. Whenever we see inconsistencies between what one believes and what we think they 'ought' to believe, reactionary. For me, people are more important (inconsistently, I've less patience for agnostics and atheists and heretics, some biblical, some personal). I am working on that latter as well, we need to love our enemies and do good to them. I have never doubted your love for Christ, or for me, or for those who are in sin. I have disagreed with you, and I 'think' some of your hang-on's are due to accepting legal paradigms THEN becoming a Christian. That, and because you are moderate, you are political anathema. I think the pendulum swing of that is coming back to balance. Parties cannot, or nearly cannot be separated by Christian principles any more, because both parties trample our values any more. I used to vote republican for abortion alone, not caring as much about wage loss. Now, I believe we are betrayed. Hopefully, that equates to fundamentalist Christians reaching across in fellowship to their Democratic counter-parts.
Rather, Ok Doser, God in his love and by His grace has released me from the bondage of sin and death. I hope He does the same for you or gives you enough misery to break whatever it is in you that keeps you from the joy you should have inherited.
A wonderful prayer. For all of us. I accept it as my own, even if to another
