The Trinity

The Trinity


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Bright Raven

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Disreguarding? NO.

But questioning your understanding of it.

Answer the question, why is he returning for us if we are already in Heaven????

When we die we do not go directly to Heaven.

Its not a trick question friend.

From Gotquestions.org

First, for the believer in Jesus Christ, the Bible tells us that after death believers’ souls/spirits are taken to heaven, because their sins are forgiven by having received Christ as Savior (John 3:16, 18, 36). For believers, death is to be “away from the body and at home with the Lord” (2 Corinthians 5:6-8; Philippians 1:23). However, passages such as 1 Corinthians 15:50-54 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 describe believers being resurrected and given glorified bodies. If believers go to be with Christ immediately after death, what is the purpose of this resurrection? It seems that while the souls/spirits of believers go to be with Christ immediately after death, the physical body remains in the grave “sleeping.” At the resurrection of believers, the physical body is resurrected, glorified, and then reunited with the soul/spirit. This reunited and glorified body-soul-spirit will be the possession of believers for eternity in the new heavens and new earth (Revelation 21-22).
 

keypurr

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Or perhaps the translators were smarter than you were and knew what they were doing, how to translate, and correctly translated it?

Just saying...

I am not to smart at all JR, but God has given me some light.

Could he have been speaking to the things of the world and the spiritual things?
 

keypurr

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From Gotquestions.org

First, for the believer in Jesus Christ, the Bible tells us that after death believers’ souls/spirits are taken to heaven, because their sins are forgiven by having received Christ as Savior (John 3:16, 18, 36). For believers, death is to be “away from the body and at home with the Lord” (2 Corinthians 5:6-8; Philippians 1:23). However, passages such as 1 Corinthians 15:50-54 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 describe believers being resurrected and given glorified bodies. If believers go to be with Christ immediately after death, what is the purpose of this resurrection? It seems that while the souls/spirits of believers go to be with Christ immediately after death, the physical body remains in the grave “sleeping.” At the resurrection of believers, the physical body is resurrected, glorified, and then reunited with the soul/spirit. This reunited and glorified body-soul-spirit will be the possession of believers for eternity in the new heavens and new earth (Revelation 21-22).


I strongly disagree with that friend.

No verse says we go to heaven at death.



What is the state of the Dead?


Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.

Psa 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

All will be raised

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurre2ction of damnation.
 

JudgeRightly

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You sure come out with some bizarre assertions . . .
Only bizarre if you're logic is faulty.

Time is a prerequisite of creation, because creating something means that it has a "before it was created" and "after it was created," a sequence of events.

Go read through kgov.com/time. You may learn something.
 

Nang

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Only bizarre if you're logic is faulty.

Time is a prerequisite of creation, because creating something means that it has a "before it was created" and "after it was created," a sequence of events.

Go read through kgov.com/time. You may learn something.

Amusing.

Enyart is not a philosopher, a logician, nor a theologian.
 

JudgeRightly

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I strongly disagree with that friend.

No verse says we go to heaven at death.

To be absent from the body....

Keypurr, where does the Lord reside?


What is the state of the Dead?


Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.

Psa 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

All will be raised

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurre2ction of damnation.

Keypurr, can someone's spirit die? Not their body, their spirit?
 

Bright Raven

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I strongly disagree with that friend.

No verse says we go to heaven at death.



What is the state of the Dead?


Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.

Psa 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

All will be raised

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurre2ction of damnation.

Then what is you hope?
 

steko

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Those that gratuitously believe that all there is to a person is the physical body cannot fathom the Scriptural implications that the body is a tent/tabernacle/house/dwelling for the person/spirit/soul.
They are at a loss as to what the Bible teaches regarding the believer upon the death of the body going to be in the presence of the Lord, awaiting the future day of the resurrection of the body.
This lack of understanding necessarily determines their faulty perception regarding the death of the GOD/man on the cross, the nature of GOD, Trinitarian understanding and so on.
 

marhig

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Jesus Christ is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the World. How does that happen? Through His death. The death of the sacrifice is paramount to the forgiveness of sin.

Or through the gospel? By preaching the word of God? And then those who believe on him will be saved and we are then forgiven of our sins, as it says in the Bible. And once we believe and we are born of God, the Holy Spirit will help us to overcome our flesh daily, helping us to turn from sin. Thus the lamb of God, pure, without spot or blemish, who came as a living sacrifice, preaching the ministry of reconciliation, takes away the sins of the world through the preaching of the gospel, by the word of God

Jesus was taking away sins before he died on the cross, through the word of God and by his life! He had the power to take away sins without being crucified!

Luke 7:47 Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.

John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

John 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

Matthew 9:2 And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee.

Matthew 9:6 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house.

Mark 4:12 That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

Luke 7:49 And they that sat at meat with him began to say within themselves, Who is this that forgiveth sins also?

Acts 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

We are saved by the grace of God through faith!
 

marhig

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The gospel is that Jesus died for our sins and we enter the covenant of his blood when we believe and obey him; when we believe that his blood washes away our sins and that he reconciles us to God.



Isaiah 53:7 says, "He was oppressed and afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; he was led like a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth."

Isaiah 53:8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

Isaiah 53:12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he has poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
Where does it say there that we are saved by his death? Death doesn't save, life saves!

Baring the sins of many isn't salvation, he bore sin by suffering at the hands of flesh, and showed love and mercy and forgiveness in return. I believe that God is love, and there was no love in the scourging and murdering of the Prince of life. Yet he was full of the love of God. To look at Jesus, is to see the love that God has for us, because he is in the express image of the father.

I'll love him always and I'm forever grateful to God for even looking at me, a nobody, and I'm forever grateful to Christ Jesus for giving his life to bring us the truth, mercy and forgiveness. And showing us the way. His way is the only way, he is the way, the truth and the life.
 

marhig

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God commanded the people to use the blood of animals to atone for their sins.

It was a teaching tool about what was coming, Jesus Christ.

It was a shadow of Jesus.

Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.

Leviticus 17:11 For the life of a creature is in the blood, and I have given it to you to make atonement for yourselves on the altar; it is the blood that makes atonement for one's life.

Exodus 29:38 “This is what you are to offer on the altar regularly each day: two lambs a year old. 39 Offer one in the morning and the other at twilight. 40 With the first lamb offer a tenth of an ephah of the finest flour mixed with a quarter of a hin of oil from pressed olives, and a quarter of a hin of wine as a drink offering. 41 Sacrifice the other lamb at twilight with the same grain offering and its drink offering as in the morning—a pleasing aroma, a food offering presented to the Lord.

42 “For the generations to come this burnt offering is to be made regularly at the entrance to the tent of meeting, before the Lord. There I will meet you and speak to you;

John 1:29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!

Hebrews 9:22 According to the Law, in fact, nearly everything must be purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

Acts 8:32 This is the passage of Scripture the eunuch was reading: “He was led like a sheep to the slaughter, and as a lamb before its shearer is silent, so he did not open his mouth.

1 Corinthians 5:7 Get rid of the old yeast, so that you may be a new unleavened batch—as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.

1 Peter 1:19 but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect.
Revelation 5:1 [ The Scroll and the Lamb ] Then I saw in the right hand of him who sat on the throne a scroll with writing on both sides and sealed with seven seals.

Revelation 5:6 Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing at the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. The Lamb had seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth.

Revelation 5:8 And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of God’s people.

Revelation 5:12 In a loud voice they were saying: “Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!”

Revelation 5:13 Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, saying: “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!”

Revelation 6:1 [ The Seals ] I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, “Come!”

Revelation 6:3 When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, “Come!”

Revelation 6:5 When the Lamb opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come!” I looked, and there before me was a black horse! Its rider was holding a pair of scales in his hand.

Revelation 6:7 When the Lamb opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!”

Revelation 6:16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb!

Revelation 7:9 [ The Great Multitude in White Robes ] After this I looked, and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and before the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands.

Revelation 7:10 And they cried out in a loud voice: “Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.”

Revelation 7:14 I answered, “Sir, you know.” And he said, “These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Revelation 7:17 For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; ‘he will lead them to springs of living water.’ ‘And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.’”

Revelation 12:11 They triumphed over him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death.

Revelation 13:8 All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life, the Lamb who was slain from the creation of the world.



Good night.
Jesus was dead before he went on the cross, he was dead to this world and sin, he'd already sacrificed his life by his blood.

He came by water and by blood, by the word of God and by his poured out life.

Do you really think that God needs the human sacrifice of himself to save us from his own wrath and to forgive us of our sins?

Isn't it more likely that Jesus was a living sacrifice, who saved us by the word of God, through preaching the gospel and through his life? and those who truly believe on him repent, and their sins are forgiven through faith by the grace of God? and then we are to turn from this world, and by the power of the Spirit turn from and overcome sin, and then we are saved from the wrath of God?
 

Lazy afternoon

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Wrong! He said he would be with Him in paradise that day. Luke 23:43

No.

The question was--

Luk 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.

and Jesus was in the rave that day, not in any way capable of remembering the thief.

How is it that you only know the words of the world who do not research the text and just parrot what most think?

LA
 

Lazy afternoon

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Where does it say there that we are saved by his death? Death doesn't save, life saves!

Baring the sins of many isn't salvation, he bore sin by suffering at the hands of flesh, and showed love and mercy and forgiveness in return. I believe that God is love, and there was no love in the scourging and murdering of the Prince of life. Yet he was full of the love of God. To look at Jesus, is to see the love that God has for us, because he is in the express image of the father.

I'll love him always and I'm forever grateful to God for even looking at me, a nobody, and I'm forever grateful to Christ Jesus for giving his life to bring us the truth, mercy and forgiveness. And showing us the way. His way is the only way, he is the way, the truth and the life.

You miss--

Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
 

marhig

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I'm referencing the end times Mrs. Mary.

peace

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Thank you pops, but I believe that for those born of God, the end of the world has already come. Once we walk in the Spirit then this world should mean nothing to us.

1 John 2

Love not the world, neither the things*that are*in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him

1 Corinthians 10

Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come

The end of this world has already happened for me, it means nothing to me, I only care for the people in it, and I have hope for the salvation of as many who will believe on the word of God though Christ Jesus.

John 15

If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

James 1:27

Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

The end of the world should have already come for us.
 

marhig

Well-known member
You miss--

Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Jesus was dead before he went to the cross LA, he was completely dead to self and he was alive in God. He bore his cross and we are to bare ours once we follow him. He laid down his life long before his natural death to do the will of God and bare witness to the truth, to save a many as would believe on him.

He didn't live to please himself, but to please the living God and he gave his whole life for us, preaching the gospel and baring witness to the truth.

He shed his blood every day of his life, he poured out his life for others, and we need his life within our hearts, his blood covering us, to save daily us from being destroyed.

His life is the life that saves, and the only way to the father is through the son of God, the Christ, the son of the living God!

2 Thessalonians 2:13

But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
 
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