jsanford108
New member
First, I was simply going to make the praise comment, then leave it be. However, you and Truster just had to make a comment about my direct praise to GT, thus, it is aggravating circumstances which brought me into this conversation.
Second, I have never seen GT say that "obeying saves." Thus, my comment that GT has never said such a thing.
Third, to address your points that mitigate my own. Let us work through your quote.
"you, jsanford108, are saying that your WORKS (obedience) will result in your salvation:" This is not what I said. This is a false application that you are claiming I made. I said that "faith needs works to sustain it." Faith must come first. However, it is our works that sustain that faith (James 2). By making a false conclusion (Straw Man) you are easily able to demolish it, however, examining the conversation easily reveals that that is nothing close to what I claimed.
"contrary to what God (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) declares. Jesus said, ‘It is finished’. His finished work does not need your works to save you. He can save anyone all by Himself.:" This is actually false as well. Christ, Himself, said to keep His commandments (John 14). Christ also discussed works and "fruits" (which are works; no reputable biblical scholar would disagree) many times, as illustrated in Matthew 28:20, John 8:51-52, as well as John 14 through 15. To also demonstrate the Holy Spirit declaring the same, through the Epistle writers, we can read James, 1 John, and 2 John. So, no, I simply stated what God had already declared. You simply argued against it.
"No OBEDIENCE needed TO BE SAVED only and exclusively BELIEVE. Only believe in Jesus Christ and His finished/completed work on the Cross of Calvary TO BE SAVED:" As demonstrated above, utilizing Scripture, this is false. If all we had to do was believe, why did Christ give us commandments and tell us to keep them? Why would He give us the parables of the fruits? After all, both bearers of bad fruits, as well as no fruits, are cast out. This further shows that this statement, made by you, is not based in Scripture.
In conclusion, the "faith alone" doctrine is quite contrary to Scripture; specifically the teachings of Christ and His Apostles. I have defended "faith sustained by works" salvation, not "works alone" salvation. I have defended my claim, effectively utilizing Scripture to demonstrate my claim and how it is based solely on the Teachings of Christ and His Apostles. Lastly, a faith+works doctrine does not deny the Trinity, in fact, it relies solely on it. Without the Trinity, there can be no Salvation or imparting of grace. It is grace alone that saves us. It is by our faith we know Christ, and through works, we sustain this faith, in order to keep us close with Him, until we are united with Him eternally.
