ECT The Nation of Israel was not at the last supper

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SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

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Interplanner said:
I read your first line, and once again you refuse to see what the NT is saying. There is nothing of the sort in the last supper. It is for the forgiveness of sins of many. That's why it is commemorated over at the 'gentile' Corinthian church, ch 11. That's why the new covenant is a ministry that ANY believer can work in. That's why Heb 9-10 comment on ch 8 is that it is about salvation from the death sentence of sin and says nothing about Israel in 9:26 in the 2nd coming.

Why are not able to see that you default to OT passages to comment on OT passages instead of NT passages?

There was a previous covenant and if a person did not get circ'd 'they would be cut off from their people.' Now there is a new covenant, and if a person does not listen to Christ and become a missionary to the nations 'they will be cut off from their people.' Gen 17:14 cp with Acts 3:23.

This is not abstract. It (Acts 3:23) meant the event of the destruction of Israel. But the 'Israel' that ministers to the nations goes on and flourishes. It follows the pattern of Dan 9.

You can pour through the rest of Hebrews (you never comment on this) and see that there is nothing happening in the land of Israel with the nation of Israel as a separate program in the future. and that's in HEBREWS.
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Translation: unbelief
 
I

Interplanner

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Hey STP, "you" in the above post is someone else, so let me know where you have permission to speak for them.


"The New covenant was made with national Israel" is as much an interpretive lie as Hugh Ross denying normal days and denying that the waters of the cataclysm were violent.
 
jamie

jamie

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northwye said:
Are there verses in the New Testament about whether the Old Covenant goes on after the Cross or it ends?
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"Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, 'And to seeds,' as of many, but as of one, 'And to your Seed,' who is Christ. And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. For if the inheritance is of the law it is no longer of promise, but God gave it to Abraham by promise." (Galatians 3:16-18)

The promise God made to Abraham and Christ is not related to the covenants made through Moses.
 
I

Interplanner

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jamie said:
"Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, 'And to seeds,' as of many, but as of one, 'And to your Seed,' who is Christ. And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. For if the inheritance is of the law it is no longer of promise, but God gave it to Abraham by promise." (Galatians 3:16-18)

The promise God made to Abraham and Christ is not related to the covenants made through Moses.
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The POV has to be sorted out here, Jamie. That's Paul, raised in IT Judaism, saying that the way the Law was handled by his leaders and teachers was replacement theology. They replaced the Promise.

So the Law is 'not related' as long as you mean it was not to replace the Promised Gospel. Judaism, however, did replace it. And it's step-child D'ism does today.

It is amazing how much Paul can discuss these things and never show a concern about Judea, but instead with 'the world to come', the NHNE.
 
D

Danoh

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jamie said:
Was this commission given before the separation between Jew and Gentile was eliminated?

Was this why Peter never went to Cornelius?
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My understanding on that is that it was given but then interrupted (as the passage even asserts; it will continue only after His return).

It's having been interrupted was why they were so thrown when God began to deal with the Gentiles absent of Israel's Prophesied rise FIRST.

In that aspect of God's Two-Fold Purpose: Prophecy and Mystery; the Prophesied aspect - Gentiles are considered unclean as is.

Acts 11:2 And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him, 11:3 Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them. 11:4 But Peter rehearsed the matter from the beginning, and expounded it by order unto them, saying, 11:5 I was in the city of Joppa praying: and in a trance I saw a vision, A certain vessel descend, as it had been a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came even to me: 11:6 Upon the which when I had fastened mine eyes, I considered, and saw fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. 11:7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat. 11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth. 11:9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. 11:10 And this was done three times: and all were drawn up again into heaven. 11:11 And, behold, immediately there were three men already come unto the house where I was, sent from Caesarea unto me. 11:12 And the Spirit bade me go with them, nothing doubting. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered into the man's house: 11:13 And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter; 11:14 Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved. 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life. 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.

Note that last passage; which takes up where some things left off in...

Acts 8:1 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles. 8:2 And devout men carried Stephen to his burial, and made great lamentation over him. 8:3 As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison. 8:4 Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.

Distinctions within those passages, for example; make it evident that any Gentiles at Pentecost were circumcised and keeping the Law of Moses.

And this is not even the tip of the iceberg on these kinds of distinctions, or things that differ in Scripture, as a governing, or guiding principle, not merely in Bible study, but in all areas of life.

Rom. 5:8
Acts 17:11,12
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Nang said:
The New Covenant is the promise of Grace from God which would be provided in His Saviour.

Noah found and was saved by this new promise of grace, and was spared judgment/destruction/death according to that very promise.

And you cannot find that same New Covenant of Promise in the NT?

C'mon! . . . tsk, tsk
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:french:

You are a cornucopia of confusion.
 
Nang

Nang

TOL Subscriber
SaulToPaul said:
At the time Hebrews was written, it still had not passed away, according to the Author.
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Any soul existent outside of the New Covenant, is still obligated and condemned under the Old Covenant.

Every living person is existing either under one, or the other.
 
Nang

Nang

TOL Subscriber
Interplanner said:
The new covenant was embraced at the last supper. It is Christ's sacrifice on behalf of mankind, and his followers become party to it by being in Him, and by proclaiming it.

It was not with the nation of Israel, nor meant to be. It looks that way in some OT passages but all things were meant to find their fulfillment in Christ and even then it would take the Spirit's work to guide the disciples into all truth.

But this is why Heb 8-10 has nothing about the land promise of Israel as such. Everything exposited about the new covenant there is about his 'the sacrifice of himself' and unless the MAD/D'ist gang here is out to fracture the Bible once again, that sacrifice is one and the same for all those who believe from among all nations.
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Bears repeating and emphasizing!

MAD is blind to this truth. They are not Christ centered, so I doubt any of them have ever paid much attention to the details and dialogue that occurred at the last supper, let alone appreciate the spiritual depths of the event.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Nang said:
You consistently reveal you are NOT Christ centered or Christ focused. Which means you continue to function under the Old Covenant that condemns.
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Not true. Your judgment is tainted and wrong.

You just continue to tell your fairy tale that is NOT contained within scripture.

You choose ransom verses to try to substantiation your story, but it does not.
 
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