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False doctrine always leads to this sort of foolish and illogical "thought".
Pops refutes the biblical concept of the Trinity
- Thread starter musterion
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It is not logical, even the gospel of John asserts exactly what I said,
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (John 1:1 [NIV])
Yeshua was WITH God, meaning he was with the Father, and he is ALSO God, meaning he was appointed to be God in creation by the Father. Why is it so difficult for you to come to understanding of this distinction between the two?
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That is not a lie, that is what the scriptures teach, Yeshua was made in the representation of God, in the beginning, and that is why he was WITH GOD, yet ALSO GOD,
“You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. (John 14:28 [NIV])
“The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old; I was formed long ages ago, at the very beginning, when the world came to be. When there were no watery depths, I was given birth, when there were no springs overflowing with water; before the mountains were settled in place, before the hills, I was given birth,
(Proverbs 8:22-25 [NIV])
But out of Him, you are in Christ Jesus, who has been made unto us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification and redemption,(1 Corinthians 1:30 [BLB])
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15 [ESV])
I will tell of the decree: The LORD said to me, “You are my Son; today I have begotten you. (Psalm 2:7 [ESV])
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Indeed He was GOD and NOT "appointed to be God".
(I see that you are one of those that has to "Bible version shop" to find what you "need").
He was APPOINTED to be God, because before the beginning Christ did not exist, he was brought into existence by the Father and appointed to be the visible representation of the Father in creation, "God". The scriptures PROVE this, which is why Christ is called the "firstborn of creation", because he was the first to be brought into existence, and then THROUGH Christ everyone else was brought into existence. And that is why he is also called "only son", because he is the only one who was brought into existence directly by the Father. And he is also called "son" because a son comes after a Father in time, further proving Christ was created in the beginning. Again, stop being so obtuse and stop believing the lies you have been taught in your churches. They will only lead to your perdition.
http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2016/10/0...n-who-was-first-to-be-birthed-into-existence/
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Complete HOGWASH.
Christ was always and will always BE GOD.... He was NOT "appointed to be God".
That is just something that your cult made up and you bought the LIE.
That is not what the scriptures teach. The FATHER IS GREATER THAN YESHUA. Those are HIS OWN WORDS. Because of the reasons I explained. Stop being stupid and understand.
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THAT scripture refers to Christ's HUMBLED POSITION AS A MAN ON EARTH.
Jesus was GOD MADE FLESH. John 1:1 & 14
Apple7
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'Greater' in what aspect?
Perhaps you have failed to read Romans 9. Your ignorance is significant.
Romans 9:4-8
[4]They are the people of Israel, chosen to be God’s adopted children. God revealed his glory to them. He made covenants with them and gave them his law. He gave them the privilege of worshiping him and receiving his wonderful promises.
[5]Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are their ancestors, and Christ himself was an Israelite as far as his human nature is concerned. And he is God, the one who rules over everything and is worthy of eternal praise! Amen.
[6]Well then, has God failed to fulfill his promise to Israel? No, for not all who are born into the nation of Israel are truly members of God’s people!
[7]Being descendants of Abraham doesn’t make them truly Abraham’s children. For the Scriptures say, “Isaac is the son through whom your descendants will be counted,” though Abraham had other children, too.
[8]This means that Abraham’s physical descendants are not necessarily children of God. Only the children of the promise are considered to be Abraham’s children.
The elect are the children of the promise. The elect are given the gift of faith.
Your heresy is great. You are dead in your trespasses and sins.
popsthebuilder
New member
No. you did not address my last round of questions about GOD being a blood sacrifice to GOD.
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Jesus says he is the "I AM." He says he is God. In Romans 3 we read what Jesus, God, has done.
Romans 3:20-30
[20]For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are.
[21]But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law, as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago.
[22]We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are.
[23]For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard.
[24]Yet God freely and graciously declares that we are righteous. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins.
[25]For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past,
[26]for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he declares sinners to be right in his sight when they believe in Jesus.
[27]Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith.
[28]So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law.
[29]After all, is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Of course he is.
[30]There is only one God, and he makes people right with himself only by faith, whether they are Jews or Gentiles.
God paid for my sins by condescending to earth and dying as a perfect sacrifice.
Philippians 2:6-11
[6]Though he was God, he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to.
[7]Instead, he gave up his divine privileges; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form,
[8]he humbled himself in obedience to God and died a criminal’s death on a cross.
[9]Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor and gave him the name above all other names,
[10]that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
[11]and every tongue declare that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
No matter how you fight against the bit, pops, Jesus is God and He is also the propitiation for my sins.
You, pops, are still dead in your trespasses and sins.
popsthebuilder
New member
Do you presume that GOD bow to the name Jesus?
11]and every tongue declare that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
The Son is subservient to the FATHER alone.
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LOL heresy.... LOL
Mine is not ignorance, but yours is. The irony is funny.
Read the entire passage you nincompoop.
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: 7 neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. 9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sara shall have a son. 10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac; 11 (for the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
12 it was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. 13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.God's election of His people on the earth was NOT simply though Abraham, but was to go through ISAAC and JACOB (ISRAEL).
No it does not, because even in an exalted state the Father is still GREATER than Christ, for the scriptures declares,
But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, (Hebrews 10:12 [NIV])
To sit at the right hand of someone implies HAVING FULL AUTHORITY UNDER SOMEONE'S AUTHORITY. Which is why Christ declares elsewhere, "authority is GIVEN UNTO ME",
Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. (Matthew 28:18 [NIV])
Christ didn't always have this authority. It was GIVEN unto him. You can only receive authority by someone who has GREATER AUTHORITY TO GIVE YOU AUTHORITY. Christ was GIVEN authority by the Father, because the Father is GREATER than Christ.
Again, stop being stupid and understand. You're stubborn and want to refuse to understand the obvious. Even a child can be taught these basic precepts of scripture. But boy oh boy, is it very difficult to teach someone who has been taught lies and is seared shut in those lies.
Greater in every aspect I demonstrated with other scriptures,
1. Greater in time of existence. The Father never had a beginning, Christ had a beginning.
2. Greater in authority. The Father has always and will always have all authority. Christ was GIVEN authority over all things.
3. Greater in knowledge. The Father has knowledge of absolutely every little detail of creation, such as the number of everyone's hairs on everyone's heads, Christ does not, for he does not even know the hour of his own coming. There is limitation of knowledge, because he is created and finite, the Father, on the other hand, is infinite and never created.
4. Predestination. The Father alone predestines all things, Christ does not predestine, for predestination is an ability that only the Father has. The Father can predestine what the outcome of a roll of a dice will be thousands of years later, Christ, nor any finite being, cannot do that by the mere virtue of being a finite person.
This is what it means the Father is GREATER. There is a big difference between the two, which the teaching of the trinity distorts, because it is based on ignorance and stupidity, not understanding the difference between God and the representation of God.
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You have SILLY, HERETICAL and UNBIBLICAL (actually ANTI-BIBLICAL) beliefs.
You should leave this CHRISTIAN site and go to some CULT site to suit your false beliefs.
No, I have anti-catholic beliefs, of which your teachings are based on. My teachings are based on scripture, on what the apostles taught, on what Christ taught, and what the prophets and Moses taught. The doctrine of the trinity is a catholic invention that was never taught in the scriptures, which is a teaching that originated from ancient Babylonian and Egyptian religion that the catholic church then borrowed and promulgated throughout the world. This is why the "trinity" verses only exist in later manuscripts, hundreds of years later, because they are forgeries pushing a lie. And even prior men, such as Eusebius, quoted one of the two trinity verses in its original form, "in my name", which coincides with all other scriptures to do things in the name of Yeshua only. Again, stop believing the lies taught in your churches. It will cost you your own soul believing those lies. I have said enough, believe, or do not believe. My study on why the doctrine of the trinity is a lie, along with manuscript evidence can be found here http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2017/02/07/the-deception-of-the-teaching-of-the-trinity/ .
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You are simply wrong and have earned a coveted place on my ignore list.