New experience for a muslim

lifeisgood

New member
That comment made me laugh for almost 5 minutes, We means Allah (God), and in Arabic pluralism means glorification, and this is used all over the Quran, but so nice of you to be so Logical.

I am happy I could make you laugh. I do not see many Muslims laughing. All Muslims I know (a couple) are always with a frown. I do not think I have seen them laugh not even one time. I did not say they do not laugh. I said I have not seen them laugh.

Aaron in the verse is not Aaron brother of Moses, but another Aaron (named after him), if I name my son Aaron and my Daughter Maryam, would that mean that my daughter is the sister of Moses the prophet?

Oh, I see. The Qur'an does not say what it says. I got it.

Lousy Fallacy. I hope you said it for jokes.

You can take it any way you want it.

Are you sure you read what I said, I said that Mary the mother of Jesus IS NOT THE SISTER OF MOSES THE PROPHET. got it?

I got it. However, the Qur'an does not say that, at least the one I quoted from. Well, I guess I can pick another and it will say what you say it says.

And we are NOT prohibited to read Bible or Atheists books, but you will need more than READING to understand these books, because so simply We means Allah not Muslims...!!! Something a 2 years old Arab child would notify you of easily.

I wanted to see what you would say. No different than the answer I received from someone else.

I will be sure to incorporate that to my hobbies.

It will set you free because, if you do, you will know the truth and the truth will set you free. The Truth is a person. His name is Jesus Christ.

“For God so loved the world [that includes every single Muslim also], that God the Father gave his only begotten Son (Jesus Christ), that whosoever believeth in him (Jesus Christ) should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16).
 

xAvarice

BANNED
Banned
I am writing a summary for reproduction in Planaria/Insects/Frogs/Humans, so I feel like a teacher all together right now.

So take it as the marks given by a lousy teacher you can knock off his head anytime you want, and he surely is waiting.

(I am sorry for giving so much "right"s and "wrong"s but I meant my opinion in them. I am really not making an effort in re-checking what I say, thats why I have to edit my posts again and again).

I have to say, I don't seem to agree with you whatsoever, but you're doing a fine job of responding to so many points in a serious manner.

I admire your ability to sustain this... soiree.
 

lifeisgood

New member
This caught my attention. The verse from the Bible mentioned here is naming the 12 sons of Ishmael. I don't understand where the count of 8 for Abraham is coming from.

Sorry about that. Thank you for checking me out.

Ishmael, Isaac, Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah.

Genesis 16:15
And Hagar bare Abraham a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael.

Genesis 21:2-3
For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son is his old age .... And Abraham called him Isaac.

Genesis 25:1-2
Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah.
 

Jacob

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Banned
Sorry about that. Thank you for checking me out.

Ishmael, Isaac, Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah.

Genesis 16:15
And Hagar bare Abraham a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael.

Genesis 21:2-3
For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son is his old age .... And Abraham called him Isaac.

Genesis 25:1-2
Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah.
Thank you and you have provided more information. The references are helpful.
 

Mulla Sadra

Member
Imagine, if you have been into ALL these things at the age of 16, all you will have accomplished when you are the age of Mohammed when he died.

He didn't have internet, which makes him exceptional. the ex-buddhist is exaggeration BTW :)

Since both positions cannot be reconciled, we can clearly see that the Jesus of the Bible and the Esa of the Quran, cannot both be the same person. The differences can be clearly seen by those who want to see the differences when they place the Qur'an and the Bible side-by-side and read them together.

Yes we have a different view of the same person.

Like you I do not have time to type all that they said in the video.

Thats why I was accurate in adding "main" to my sentence

You expect me to accept ALL that YOU have said without questioning anything. :think:

my words not cut : Thirdly, I still firmly say, that you if not already stopped talking, is stopping to talk, that's only if you accept all what I said in the last comment, and think that woman have a hand in the procedure of Divorce in Islam, that Pope Urban II was imperialist***, that Islam doesn't order to kill infidels only if they stage war against Islam and that you are wrong about the "strike necks" verse and it is not about what you said, which then make me tell you (also firmly), do you have any other thing to say about Islam ?

meaning, if you accept these things ask me about another, if you do. the IF is there, go check.


It is always, I, the Muslim, am the only one that is right and everybody else in the world is wrong. I, the Muslim, say that what you (infidel/unbeliever) read in the Qur'an is not what it says at all. I, the Muslim, said it and you (infidel/unbeliever) has to accept what I say.

What can I do if you don't know something as simple as (We means Allah) ?

The land belongs to the Jews, that I, or we, or you, or whomever accepts that or not is irrelevant. The Bible says that the land belongs to the Jews.

No it is relevant, because we are talking about a historical standing where Jews/Muslims were against Christians, and as it is Jewish land (as you suppose and I don't admit) then the imperial Pope Urban II was trying to conquer a land he had no right in, for imperial purposes, and then there's no meaning of you defending the crusades.


There is no such a thing as Arab Jews or Arab Christians or Arab Muslims.

There are Jews, Christians, and Muslims.

No, there's, just like there's a Jewish German and a Christian German, go read Sociology. And thankfully in the sixties the Arabs, Christians and Muslims, stood against the ATHEIST Zionists, and was known the great singer Fairouz (Link), who was an embodiment of the great Arab fight against Zionists.

It is both.

Jewish because the Bible says it is theirs. King David took it and made it the capital of his kingdom. You can read it in 2 Samuel 5.

Christian because our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ died in Jerusalem.

Jews because of Kind David (which we say it is HIS kingdom, and God gave HIM the land as a great righteous man, but with him ends the right), and because Jesus died in Jerusalem, and I ask you, do Jews (as in Jews, not Jewish Christians) accept that a prophet called Jesus dying in Jerusalem ? if you say they accept, then why are they still Jews ? and if you say they don't accept, then I say that we say Muhammad was sent to heaven from Jerusalem, and it is our second Qibla, which gives us the same (if not better, because we believe in Jesus) right as Jews. You either give right to Jews and us, or just give the right to yourself, which you choose ?

Praise be to Jehovah the God of Israel, and to His Prophet Jesus Christ, my Lord and my Savior.
Praise be to God of All, who said (O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another. Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. Indeed, Allah is Knowing and Acquainted.) a none racial God.
 
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Mulla Sadra

Member
I am happy I could make you laugh. I do not see many Muslims laughing. All Muslims I know (a couple) are always with a frown. I do not think I have seen them laugh not even one time. I did not say they do not laugh. I said I have not seen them laugh.

"I did not say they do not laugh." They as in the couple of Muslims or as in Muslims in general ? I hope you are not judging 1.6 Billion by two.

Oh, I see. The Qur'an does not say what it says. I got it.

Quran say what it says in the whole 6236 verse, not you take one and try to twist it, it says sister of Aaron, and doesn't specify, and other verses ELIMINATE such a possibility, but I guess Tafsir is a hard science for you.

You can take it any way you want it.

I leave to those who read.

I got it. However, the Qur'an does not say that, at least the one I quoted from. Well, I guess I can pick another and it will say what you say it says.

You quoted one verse that is explained in other verses and Hadeeth, thats why there are clerics, and ignorants.

I wanted to see what you would say. No different than the answer I received from someone else.

I am sure you took the advice from me and that someone else, and didn't go after people who hate us to know what they don't know.

It will set you free because, if you do, you will know the truth and the truth will set you free. The Truth is a person. His name is Jesus Christ.

Truth is something to be went after, I am not doubtful but you asking me to check the bible is enough, because I am now because of you committed to, so shall not in day of Judgement Allah tell me "Why didn't you check what he said, and the right might be with him ?"
 

Mulla Sadra

Member
I have to say, I don't seem to agree with you whatsoever, but you're doing a fine job of responding to so many points in a serious manner.

I admire your ability to sustain this... soiree.

I usually stay the night, thanks for asking.

I am not that serious in reality.
 

Mulla Sadra

Member
It truly is depressing to watch surreptitious proselytisation.

Would that mean me ?

Because his proselytisation is not surreptitious.

And I again tell you I am not here to convert anyone, firstly it is not my ideology in life, secondly I am unable to lift such a burden, that would haunt me in this life and afterlife.
 

Angel4Truth

New member
Hall of Fame
Would that mean me ?

Because his proselytisation is not surreptitious.

And I again tell you I am not here to convert anyone, firstly it is not my ideology in life, secondly I am unable to lift such a burden, that would haunt me in this life and afterlife.

Thats good because its really doubtful you would be able to convert anyone here at this board into Islam.
 

xAvarice

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Banned
Would that mean me ?

Because his proselytisation is not surreptitious.

And I again tell you I am not here to convert anyone, firstly it is not my ideology in life, secondly I am unable to lift such a burden, that would haunt me in this life and afterlife.

And neither am I, unfortunately for some.
 

Mulla Sadra

Member
I never claimed that someone was trying to convert me.

Thankfully, you between all who might have thought that, didn't.

But, I must tell you, I've befriended many Christians, and never I saw someone like you with limited sense of humor.

(Don't worry, I am going to answer your gigantic comment soon enough).
 

Krsto

Well-known member
I hope I wasn't Instructive.

I read into your words that you are looking for certainty in matters of truth and want to know how that is attained. Am I correct? If so, then you are a typical candidate for cult membership because cults like Catholicism and Islam not only provide that but guarantee infallibility.

Protestants, who are not in a cult like the Mormon Church, Jehovah's Witnesses, some Reformed Churches, to name a few, are happy to be seekers of truth and teach others what we have found but do not expect everybody to see it our way. We recognize our own fallibility and the fallibility of churches and recognize that God didn't provide a sure-fire way to prevent it or restore truth. We believe that the Holy Spirit guides us directly, and anyone else who comes to God through Christ, even those on their way to Christ who haven't found him yet. We don't believe we have a "special line to God," it's just that we understand our conclusions are our own yet God teaches us along the way. We are not looking for infallibility, just looking to learn as we go.
 

Mulla Sadra

Member
I read into your words that you are looking for certainty in matters of truth and want to know how that is attained. Am I correct? If so, then you are a typical candidate for cult membership because cults like Catholicism and Islam not only provide that but guarantee infallibility.

Protestants, who are not in a cult like the Mormon Church, Jehovah's Witnesses, some Reformed Churches, to name a few, are happy to be seekers of truth and teach others what we have found but do not expect everybody to see it our way. We recognize our own fallibility and the fallibility of churches and recognize that God didn't provide a sure-fire way to prevent it or restore truth. We believe that the Holy Spirit guides us directly, and anyone else who comes to God through Christ, even those on their way to Christ who haven't found him yet. We don't believe we have a "special line to God," it's just that we understand our conclusions are our own yet God teaches us along the way. We are not looking for infallibility, just looking to learn as we go.

You being part of a no-cult cult, surely have a good habit in reading into people's words.

Surely the The Kingdom (Malakoot) is an absolute one, because it is not govern by people's relativism, but is governed by Allah (God, whatever you love to use as a name) who's one essence unchangeable.
But ways into Malakoot are humane (Remember, We are the ones who say that prophets are people not Gods), and because they are humane, they are several.

It is one truth that got many straight paths to, we attend the idea as Muslims (and surely the other cults and no-cult cults think themselves are) that Islam is the most straight way to Allah.

the only idea you have means that the others aren't finding Jesus the right way they should be, which makes you a cult too.

Your ideas look like Sunni ideas, is this what the protestant church wholly pertain ? or just your personal idea ?
 

lifeisgood

New member
Quote:
He didn't have internet, which makes him exceptional. the ex-buddhist is exaggeration BTW

:)

Yes we have a different view of the same person.

Like I said, whoever wants to see the differerences can. God obligates no one to see them. Neither do I have the power to do so NOR do I want that power. Freedom is something I value dearly.

my words not cut : Thirdly, I still firmly say, that you if not already stopped talking, is stopping to talk, that's only if you accept all what I said in the last comment, and think that woman have a hand in the procedure of Divorce in Islam, that Pope Urban II was imperialist***, that Islam doesn't order to kill infidels only if they stage war against Islam and that you are wrong about the "strike necks" verse and it is not about what you said, which then make me tell you (also firmly), do you have any other thing to say about Islam ?

meaning, if you accept these things ask me about another, if you do. the IF is there, go check.

No, I have not accepted that a woman does not have the right to decide for herself if she wants or do not want a divorce. I do not know if Pope Urban II was imperialist as I have not studied that in depth. I do believe that Islam does order infidels to be killed NOT only in war, etc., etc. When something else comes to mind I'll definitely ask. Thank you.

What can I do if you don't know something as simple as (We means Allah)?

Absolutely nothing.

No it is relevant, because we are talking about a historical standing where Jews/Muslims were against Christians, and as it is Jewish land (as you suppose and I don't admit) then the imperial Pope Urban II was trying to conquer a land he had no right in, for imperial purposes, and then there's no meaning of you defending the crusades.

I do not defend the crusades. I said that they got tired of all the things the Muslims were causing to them and their iconography, pilgrims, churches, etc.

But giving it another thought, if someone is coming into what is mine I will defend it. So, I guess that’s what they were doing. That I agree with it or not is irrelevant.

No, there's, just like there's a Jewish German and a Christian German, go read Sociology. And thankfully in the sixties the Arabs, Christians and Muslims, stood against the ATHEIST Zionists, and was known the great singer Fairouz (Link), who was an embodiment of the great Arab fight against Zionists.

There is no such a thing as a Jewish German or a Christian German, Sociology, notwithstanding. There are Germans who are Jewish; there are Germans who are Christians; there are Germans who are atheists; there are Arabs who are Muslims; there are Arabs who are Christians, there are Muslims who are atheists, etc.

Jews because of Kind David (which we say it is HIS kingdom, and God gave HIM the land as a great righteous man, but with him ends the right), and because Jesus died in Jerusalem, and I ask you, do Jews (as in Jews, not Jewish Christians) accept that a prophet called Jesus dying in Jerusalem?

No. However, the Covenant is God’s and it does not depend on the Jews’ belief. God said that the land belongs to them. God will keep His Covenant made to His people.

God did not say to Abraham, if you BELIEVE, I’ll give. No, God said,

"On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying: 'To your descendants I have given this land..."' (Genesis 15:18).

Interesting to note how the verb natati is in the past tense, implying that God had ALREADY given the land to the Jews at some earlier time, although this is the first time that such a promise has been recorded.

I believe that God had set aside the land of Israel for His people already at the time of Creation. Can I prove what I believe at this time? No, so you do not have to ask for any proof of my belief. That’s what I believe though.

In other words, the Jewish rights to the land were always part of the very fabric of Creation. They are eternal and unconditional. God promised Abraham, "I will give to you, and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojourning, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession."

God also covenanted with Ishmael, regarded as the father of the Arab people. However, that promise was for nationhood, not land. But the land of Israel was not just a Divine promise. It was also the home of our forefathers, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and their wives, Sarah, Rebekah, Rachel and Leah.

if you say they accept, then why are they still Jews ? and if you say they don't accept, then I say that we say Muhammad was sent to heaven from Jerusalem, and it is our second Qibla, which gives us the same (if not better, because we believe in Jesus) right as Jews. You either give right to Jews and us, or just give the right to yourself, which you choose ?

The Jesus (Esa/Isa) of the Qur'an is not the Jesus of the Bible. My Bible does talk about another gospel, another Jesus, another spirit though.

Praise be to God of All, who said (O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another. Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. Indeed, Allah is Knowing and Acquainted.) a none racial God.

Praise be to Jehovah God who said, “Let us (plural) make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth” (Gen. 1:26).

Racial issues are man-made, not God's.
 
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