My fantasy. And a question for liberals

Caledvwlch

New member
I havent read his books so I can't speak for how entertaining they are to read. I can say that Bahnsen's Theonomy in Christian Ethics (which you've probably read) is profoundly interesting and not boring in the slightest :)

I haven't read that either. I was still a we lad when Bahnsen died, and by the time I was a teenager, I was into mystery and suspense novels. Although I vaguely remember him doing a guest sermon.
 

Granite

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Hall of Fame
I havent read his books so I can't speak for how entertaining they are to read. I can say that Bahnsen's Theonomy in Christian Ethics (which you've probably read) is profoundly interesting and not boring in the slightest :)

Yes, well, to lift a line from Dr. North himself: "Don't smoke in bed while reading this book" is my take on the late Bahnsen's work.
 

Jefferson

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I havent read his books so I can't speak for how entertaining they are to read.
VERY entertaining. Here's some of my favorite quotes from him:

Socialism is simply Communism for people without the testosterone to man the barricades.

... thou shall not steal, even by majority vote ...

The politics of envy is the politics of this commandment: "Thou shalt not steal, except by majority vote." It is the politics of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.

Karl Marx was the foremost hater and most incessant whiner in the history of Western Civilization. He was a spoiled, overeducated brat who never grew up; he just grew more shrill as he grew older. His lifelong hatred and whining have led to the deaths (so far) of perhaps a hundred million people, depending on how many people perished under Mao's tyranny. We will probably never know.

The primary social goal of both systems of political economy is for middle-aged men to attract good-looking younger women. Democratic capitalists believe that good-looking younger women are attracted mainly by money. Social democratic capitalists believe that they are attracted mainly by power.

Do you really believe that the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, plans to be a loser in history?

Words summarize the American philosophy of life: Live and let live; Let's make a deal. 8 words should summarize American foreign policy: We're better than you; Do it our way.

He who bets on governments and government money bets against 6,000 years of recorded human history.

The negative penalties of the Old Testament case laws were not harsh but just, not a threat to society but rather the necessary judicial foundation of civic freedom… the Old Testament was harsh on criminals because it was soft on victims.

The fifth and by far the most important reason is that stoning is literally a means of crushing the murderer's head by means of a rock, which is symbolic of God. This is analogous to the crushing of the head of the serpent in Genesis 3:15. This symbolism testifies to the final victory of God over all the hosts of Satan. Stoning is therefore integral to the commandment against murder.

The basis for building a Christian society is evangelism and missions that lead to a widespread Christian revival, so that the great mass of earth's inhabitants will place themselves under Christ's protection, and then voluntarily use his covenantal laws for self-government. Christian reconstruction begins with personal conversion to Christ and self-government under God's law; then it spreads to others through revival; and only later does it bring comprehensive changes in civil law, when the vast majority of voters voluntarily agree to live under biblical blueprints.

Grape juice at the communion table symbolizes the historical impotence of Christ’s blood, Christ’s gospel, Christ’s church, and Christ’s expanding kingdom. Grape juice stays ‘bottled up’, confined to the historical skins of Palestine.

This is God's world, not Satan's. Christians are the lawful heirs, not non-Christians.

The New Testament is a commentary on the Old Testament, in the light of the new revelation given by Christ and the Holy Spirit.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
#1 Novel of the 20th century

doesn't hold a candle to

Spoiler
Katzung.jpg
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
VERY entertaining. Here's some of my favorite quotes from him:

Socialism is simply Communism for people without the testosterone to man the barricades.

... thou shall not steal, even by majority vote ...

The politics of envy is the politics of this commandment: "Thou shalt not steal, except by majority vote." It is the politics of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.

Karl Marx was the foremost hater and most incessant whiner in the history of Western Civilization. He was a spoiled, overeducated brat who never grew up; he just grew more shrill as he grew older. His lifelong hatred and whining have led to the deaths (so far) of perhaps a hundred million people, depending on how many people perished under Mao's tyranny. We will probably never know.

The primary social goal of both systems of political economy is for middle-aged men to attract good-looking younger women. Democratic capitalists believe that good-looking younger women are attracted mainly by money. Social democratic capitalists believe that they are attracted mainly by power.

Do you really believe that the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, plans to be a loser in history?

Words summarize the American philosophy of life: Live and let live; Let's make a deal. 8 words should summarize American foreign policy: We're better than you; Do it our way.

He who bets on governments and government money bets against 6,000 years of recorded human history.

The negative penalties of the Old Testament case laws were not harsh but just, not a threat to society but rather the necessary judicial foundation of civic freedom… the Old Testament was harsh on criminals because it was soft on victims.

The fifth and by far the most important reason is that stoning is literally a means of crushing the murderer's head by means of a rock, which is symbolic of God. This is analogous to the crushing of the head of the serpent in Genesis 3:15. This symbolism testifies to the final victory of God over all the hosts of Satan. Stoning is therefore integral to the commandment against murder.

The basis for building a Christian society is evangelism and missions that lead to a widespread Christian revival, so that the great mass of earth's inhabitants will place themselves under Christ's protection, and then voluntarily use his covenantal laws for self-government. Christian reconstruction begins with personal conversion to Christ and self-government under God's law; then it spreads to others through revival; and only later does it bring comprehensive changes in civil law, when the vast majority of voters voluntarily agree to live under biblical blueprints.

Grape juice at the communion table symbolizes the historical impotence of Christ’s blood, Christ’s gospel, Christ’s church, and Christ’s expanding kingdom. Grape juice stays ‘bottled up’, confined to the historical skins of Palestine.

This is God's world, not Satan's. Christians are the lawful heirs, not non-Christians.

The New Testament is a commentary on the Old Testament, in the light of the new revelation given by Christ and the Holy Spirit.

He also referred to God as the "Cosmic Torturer" in one of his newsletters. Gary's a hoot.
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
http://press-pubs.uchicago.edu/founders/tocs/a6_2.html

So the "People" don't have the authority as you previously stated, but according to your interpretation of the above we're at the whim of left-wing judicial activist judges?


Right wing activist judges as well.

Do you think that it was the original intent of the Founding Fathers to allow activist judges to overrule the will of the people?

For example: would they have approved of a liberal activist judge overruling the State Constitution of Kentucky where 75% of the voters stated that marriage is between one man and one woman?
 

WizardofOz

New member
Of course not, why would you or anyone else use that word and try to associate it with righteous laws that have a biblical foundation?

:doh: You can't even follow the conversation that you invited yourself into.

Thanks for acknowledging that you used typical left-wing scare mongering tactics when it came to the recriminalization of homosexuality.

I acknowledged no such thing.

You're the one who was claiming that Islam and Secular Humanism/Atheism can work alongside Jews and Christians, I simply pointed out via the headlines of an article that I linked that the leading political Muslim group in the US doesn't agree with you.

Regarding your latest fixation (a paragraph from the article that I posted) :


Islamic ideology throughout the Arab world blends mosque and state, and views any criticism of Islam’s status or commandments as a violation of the fundamental law of the state. That’s not true in the United States, where morality and religion are kept distinct from law, and where politicians are expected to praise and criticize popular and unpopular ideas that are shielded by the Constitution from government hostility.

Do you agree with your source that religion is kept distinct from the law? Notice they're asserting that this is a good thing as opposed to Muslim nations where the religion and the law are "blended".

As I've pointed out numerous times in the threads that I've started and posts that I've written (including this one) :

Our laws are based on someone's moral worldview which comes from religion. Currently the religion of Secular Humanism/Atheism is ruling.

Would you agree or disagree with my last statement Aaron?

No. Our current laws are not based on religion. You're living the David Barton revisionist fantasy.
 

The Horn

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On the conservative side, everybody would be jobless, homeless and starving on the streets . Including children and infants . The whole economy would collapse . It wouldn't be pretty !
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Of course not, why would you or anyone else use that word [theocracy] and try to associate it with righteous laws that have a biblical foundation?

You can't even follow the conversation that you invited yourself into.

It's interesting how you implied that the subject of this thread is that TOL moderator Jefferson would like to have a theocracy here in the United States, yet in his OP he said nothing about the Christian Church running the government or outlawing other religions (Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.) besides Islam.

Do you care to retract your earlier statement about this thread's subject being about theocracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WizardofOz
I know you're a bit slow but we were discussing theocracy. Is that what our founders intended?

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4461680&postcount=93


Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
Thanks for acknowledging that you used typical left-wing scare mongering tactics when it came to the recriminalization of homosexuality.

I acknowledged no such thing.

So which is it: A nation can legislate laws against things like homosexuality, pornography and abortion without being a theocracy or it can't?


Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
You're the one who was claiming that Islam and Secular Humanism/Atheism can work alongside Jews and Christians, I simply pointed out via the headlines of an article that I linked that the leading political Muslim group in the US doesn't agree with you.

Regarding your latest fixation (a paragraph from the article that I posted) :


Islamic ideology throughout the Arab world blends mosque and state, and views any criticism of Islam’s status or commandments as a violation of the fundamental law of the state. That’s not true in the United States, where morality and religion are kept distinct from law, and where politicians are expected to praise and criticize popular and unpopular ideas that are shielded by the Constitution from government hostility.

Do you agree with your source that religion is kept distinct from the law? Notice they're asserting that this is a good thing as opposed to Muslim nations where the religion and the law are "blended".

Of course not because as I mentioned many times before (and below) : someone's moral worldview (Judeo-Christian, Islam, Secular Humanism) is going to be the source of a nation's laws.

Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
As I've pointed out numerous times in the threads that I've started and posts that I've written (including this one) :

Our laws are based on someone's moral worldview which comes from religion. Currently the religion of Secular Humanism/Atheism is ruling.

Would you agree or disagree with my last statement Aaron?

No. Our current laws are not based on religion. You're living the David Barton revisionist fantasy.

Key words "current laws". Gee Aaron, what gave it away that our current laws ( more like judicial activist rulings) that legalized abortion, homosexuality, pornography and other godless behaviors aren't based on one of the world's major religions? (they're based on the religion of secular humanism).
 

fool

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Well generally, totalitarian regimes don't do so well in the prosperity department, so...

Hmmmm....
On the east side, abortion would be a capital crime. There would be no expensive prison system needed because crime would be punished by financial restitution, flogging, or capital punishment. Everyone above the age of 20 would be required to own a handgun. Islam (a religion that advocates murder) would be illegal. There would be no mandatory health insurance, no social security, no Medicare, no Medicaid, no "free" government indocrina...err...education, no welfare checks, no food stamps, etc. Also, everyone will pay the same percentage of income tax no matter how much they make and those taxes will be below 10%.

Where's the totalitarianism in that^?
 

Christian Liberty

Well-known member
I haven't read that either. I was still a we lad when Bahnsen died, and by the time I was a teenager, I was into mystery and suspense novels. Although I vaguely remember him doing a guest sermon.

I am so jealous.... I know you don't care though... Bahnsen died shortly after I was born :(

VERY entertaining. Here's some of my favorite quotes from him:

Socialism is simply Communism for people without the testosterone to man the barricades.

... thou shall not steal, even by majority vote ...

The politics of envy is the politics of this commandment: "Thou shalt not steal, except by majority vote." It is the politics of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.

Karl Marx was the foremost hater and most incessant whiner in the history of Western Civilization. He was a spoiled, overeducated brat who never grew up; he just grew more shrill as he grew older. His lifelong hatred and whining have led to the deaths (so far) of perhaps a hundred million people, depending on how many people perished under Mao's tyranny. We will probably never know.

The primary social goal of both systems of political economy is for middle-aged men to attract good-looking younger women. Democratic capitalists believe that good-looking younger women are attracted mainly by money. Social democratic capitalists believe that they are attracted mainly by power.

Do you really believe that the Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, plans to be a loser in history?

Words summarize the American philosophy of life: Live and let live; Let's make a deal. 8 words should summarize American foreign policy: We're better than you; Do it our way.

He who bets on governments and government money bets against 6,000 years of recorded human history.

The negative penalties of the Old Testament case laws were not harsh but just, not a threat to society but rather the necessary judicial foundation of civic freedom… the Old Testament was harsh on criminals because it was soft on victims.

The fifth and by far the most important reason is that stoning is literally a means of crushing the murderer's head by means of a rock, which is symbolic of God. This is analogous to the crushing of the head of the serpent in Genesis 3:15. This symbolism testifies to the final victory of God over all the hosts of Satan. Stoning is therefore integral to the commandment against murder.

The basis for building a Christian society is evangelism and missions that lead to a widespread Christian revival, so that the great mass of earth's inhabitants will place themselves under Christ's protection, and then voluntarily use his covenantal laws for self-government. Christian reconstruction begins with personal conversion to Christ and self-government under God's law; then it spreads to others through revival; and only later does it bring comprehensive changes in civil law, when the vast majority of voters voluntarily agree to live under biblical blueprints.

Grape juice at the communion table symbolizes the historical impotence of Christ’s blood, Christ’s gospel, Christ’s church, and Christ’s expanding kingdom. Grape juice stays ‘bottled up’, confined to the historical skins of Palestine.

This is God's world, not Satan's. Christians are the lawful heirs, not non-Christians.

The New Testament is a commentary on the Old Testament, in the light of the new revelation given by Christ and the Holy Spirit.

AWESOME stuff :)
 
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