Jesus IS the Father and He says the same to you as He did to Philip.
“Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.
Don't you know Him meshak?
Jesus is God
- Thread starter Bright Raven
- Start date
Jesus IS the Father and He says the same to you as He did to Philip.
“Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.
Don't you know Him meshak?
You've been shown time and time again that He does, so obviously the problem with interpretation, actually just plain reading, is YOURS.
keypurr
Well-known member
You need to study John 17 GT. Read it slow and see what your Lord says about his God.
God sent his son to be with us, not himself. Your not seeing that. Christ said if you believe in God, believe in me also. Jesus is telling you that he is not God. He said that his Father is greater than ALL. god, the Father, elevated Christ to Lord of all creation. God and Christ are two separate beings. One is God and one is Lord. You will not learn that in church but it is in scripture.
keypurr
Well-known member
Not so BR, I have been blessed with the understanding that I prayed to get for many years. God has shown me where the missing pieces were hiding. I know you do not understand me or you would never call me lost.
NO but I do agree you got what you wanted.
keypurr
Well-known member
No, Jesus is not the Father.
Did he not say if you believe in God believe in me also?
Does that ring a bell for you?
When he prayed to his Father was he praying to himself?
Do you think at all Stan?
I have to agree with you here Keypurr. Jesus is not the Father, He is the Son.
keypurr
Well-known member
No you have told me that he said he was God but you can not show me where he said it.
Back up your statement with scripture, if not, maybe you should sit and learn.
keypurr
Well-known member
Amen my friend. I wish with all my heart you could see what God has given me to share. I understand how hard it is to change your traditions that have meant so much to you for so long. I went through that myself. God became first in my life, that brought tears to and from my loved ones who could not agree with what I had to do. But to be honest with myself, I needed to follow my Lord in the way I thought best. My love for God, Christ and mankind will follow me to my grave. I will not promote hatred to blend on with this world. God is love, not greed.
BR we disagree but that is OK, you do what you have to do.
Yes we do and it is OK for me. Seek Him with all of your heart and you will find Him.
keypurr
Well-known member
Done BR. I found him waiting for me get off my butt and tell folks what he has intrusted me to share.
That you fail to understand who the Bible says Jesus IS and who He also says He is, has been clearly established for a long time now keypurr.
That you cannot see the context of when Jesus the Man, the only begotten Son of God speaks and when Jesus as God incarnate speaks is your problem. Is 9:6 (NIV) John 8:58 (NIV)
keypurr
Well-known member
The Bible says that Jesus is the son of God.
You say he is God.
Who should I believe?
Stan or Jesus?
You fail again Stan.
God sent his SON, not himself.
CHR_Iam_IST
Member
If John 17 was all there is to THE WORD of GOD (Scripture), you'd have this debate wrapped up in your favor . . . but let's look as some other passages, and see what else Scripture teaches about JESUS CHRIST being GOD!
It is easy to understand how JESUS CHRIST is GOD if one first answer the question(s), "What [part] of GOD [THE FATHER] is not GOD?"
Is not GOD'S WORD (JESUS CHRIST - John 1:1-3, 14; John 8:58) as much GOD as GOD IS GOD?
Is not GOD'S POWER (THE HOLY GHOST/SPIRIT - Luke 1:35; Acts 5:4) as much GOD as GOD IS GOD?
GOD'S POWER (THE HOLY GHOST/SPIRIT) is subject to GOD'S WORD (JESUS CHRIST); GOD'S WORD (JESUS CHRIST) is subject to GOD HIMSELF, THE FATHER.
This can be spiritually seen in, "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (Genesis 1:1-3 KJ2000)"
The reason JESUS CHRIST IS both GOD and Man is because:
1) ONLY GOD can satisfy GOD (Romans 8:3; 3:10-12);
2) GOD, at the Creation, gave "dominion" of planet earth to man[kind] (Genesis 1:26-28);
3) THE PERFECT GOD/MAN had to reconcile fallen mankind back to GOD (Isaiah 9:6-7; John 3:16-17; 1John 4:14).
keypurr
Well-known member
Welcome to TOL be advised that most do not agree with me and that is OK, we can still be friends.
Lets see what you got:
The Father is the ONLY true God.
The WORD or logos in John 1 is not Jesus.
I see that as the power God uses
Could the spirit of God be the express image of the Father in Heb1:3? He would be a spiritual son that was with God at the creation.
1) I can not agree with you on this. Jesus was a man, born of a human. He is the body prepared for the express image of the father. Given the fullness of the Father he is a created form or God.
2) Agree
3) Jesus, a man with the spirit Christ dwelling in him. However there is no such thing as a God-Man. I see Christ and Jesus as two, one human one spirit. The spirit (word) became flesh.
As I said before welcome to TOL, you will find a lot of good folks here.
God's Truth
New member
Of course, God is greater than a Man; however, God did not pretend to come as a Man, He really did come as a Man.
Stop throwing away scripture. Jesus says he is the First and the Last, and that is the exact thing that God calls Himself.
God's Truth
New member
Jesus says he is the First and the Last. That is what God says He is.
Jesus says when you see him you see the Father.
Think about it.
CHR_Iam_IST
Member
Thank you for the welcome, as well as the offer of Friendship, that's very kind of you.
I see though, that you didn't answer my initial question, "What [part] of GOD [THE FATHER] is not GOD?"
Its okay, because the resounding answer is There is NO part of GOD that is not GOD; HIS WORD IS GOD; HIS POWER IS GOD . . . and I showed you that using Scripture . . . something you DID NOT do in your attempted rebuttal; in fact, the only reference to Scripture you make in your rebuttal is your attempt to negate JESUS' Divinity as written of in John 1 (1-3,14), along with your question regarding one phrase from Hebrews 1:3, which, by the way, begins with "Who (JESUS) being the brightness of his (GOD'S) glory, and" . . . the "and" meaning that you can't address what comes after it without first addressing what comes before it.
Ergo, you cannot be "the brightness of his (GOD'S) glory..." without first being as Divine as GOD IS DIVINE; which is why JESUS CHRIST IS "the express image of his (GOD'S) person..."
I like the way you chose carefully to state that "Jesus was a man, born of a human." The fact that JESUS had just one ("a") human parent (a virgin named Mary) makes HIM 100% Human, without sin . . . but since GOD'S WORD (Luke 1:38) via THE HOLY GHOST impregnated Mary, that makes JESUS CHRIST, THE WORD of GOD (Revelation 19:13), also, 100% GOD, since NO PART of GOD IS NOT GOD!
But back to John 1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
And the Word (the "Logos", as you stated it) was made flesh (became JESUS CHRIST), and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. (John 1:1-14 KJ2000)"
Keypurr, Scripture is very clear that:
1) GOD'S WORD is GOD ("the Word was God");
2) JESUS CHRIST was/is THE WORD of GOD ("the Word (the "Logos", as you stated it) was made flesh") and ("And he was clothed with a robe dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. Revelation 19:13 KJ2000");
3) JESUS CHRIST IS GOD ("For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6 KJV").