Good Friday?

[jamie]

Was the last supper the passover seder or just a dinner before the passover seder?

Jesus knew that the Law of Moses had ended with John and the Father was establishing a new priesthood after the order of Melchizedek who was appointed a priest forever.

The new priesthood does not need animal sacrifices, they have been preempted by Jesus as was the Levitical priesthood.

 

[WeberHome]

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Was the last supper the passover seder or just a dinner before the passover
seder?

†. Luke 22:7-16 . .Then came the first day of Unleavened Bread on which
the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed. And he sent Peter and John, saying:
Go and prepare the Passover for us, that we may eat it. And they said to
him: Where do you want us to prepare it?

. . . And he said to them: Behold, when you have entered the city, a man
will meet you carrying a pitcher of water; follow him into the house that he
enters. And you shall say to the owner of the house; "The teacher says to
you: Where is the guest room in which I may eat the Passover with my
disciples?" And he will show you a large, furnished, upper room; prepare it
there.

. . . And they departed and found everything just as he had told them; and
they prepared the Passover. And when the hour had come he reclined at the
table, and the apostles with him. And he said to them: I have earnestly
desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer; for I say to you, I shall
never again eat it until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God.

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[steko]

Was the last supper the passover seder or just a dinner before the passover seder?

The 'last supper' was the Passover meal, according to GOD's appointed times for all Israel.
The Lord Jesus ate the Passover meal with His disciples at GOD's appointed time for all Israel.

Mat 26:17 Now the first day of the feast of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat the passover?
Mat 26:18 And he said, Go into the city to such a man, and say unto him, The Master saith, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at thy house with my disciples.
Mat 26:19 And the disciples did as Jesus had appointed them; and they made ready the passover.
Mat 26:20 Now when the even was come, he sat down with the twelve.
Mat 26:21 And as they did eat

The first day of the week long feast of Passover/Unleavened Bread was the 14th and was the day on which they killed the Passover lamb and prepared for the Passover meal, which would be eaten after sundown on the 15th.
The Lord Jesus instructed His disciples to prepare for the Passover meal on that day according to GOD's appointed time for all Israel.


Mar 14:12 And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?
Mar 14:14 And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
Mar 14:16 And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
Mar 14:17 And in the evening he cometh with the twelve.
Mar 14:18 And as they sat and did eat

In John 13:1-2 The supper ended before passover.

The Passover meal ended when they finished eating that night of the 15th and proceeded to the Mt of Olives/Gethsemene, where He was betrayed.

In John 13:28-29 The disciples assumed that Judas was going out to buy things for the feast. If this was a passover seder would they not already have everything ready for the feast?

The feast of Unleavened Bread/Passover lasted for a week.
That night of the 15th, Israel males would be gathering things for the daytime event on the 15th of the Chagigah, the festive offering, as the disciples assumed Judas was doing.
The men could not participate in the Chagigah of the Passover week long feast if they were defiled, therefore later that same night they would not go into Pilate's Praetorium lest they be defiled.

Joh 18:28

 

[WeberHome]

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In John 13:28-29 The disciples assumed that Judas was going out to buy
things for the feast.

The feast in question is the Feast of Unleavened Bread. It's a seven-day
event that commences with the night of the lamb. In other words: the night
of the lamb is only the beginning of the feast.

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[achduke]

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The feast in question is the Feast of Unleavened Bread. It's a seven-day
event that commences with the night of the lamb. In other words: the night
of the lamb is only the beginning of the feast.

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Yes but can they go out on passover and buy anything? Is it not considered a sabbath at that point?

 

[achduke]

The Passover meal ended when they finished eating that night of the 15th and proceeded to the Mt of Olives/Gethsemene, where He was betrayed.

John 19:42 and Luke 23:53 appear to contradict eating the night of the 15th if the preparation day is the 14th. Christ was already in the tomb.

John 19:42 There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews' preparation day; for the sepulchre was nigh at hand.

Luke 23:53 And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid. 54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.

 

[jamie]

Yes but can they go out on passover and buy anything? Is it not considered a sabbath at that point?

Here is John's answer.

Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken and that they might be taken away. (John 19:31 NKJV)​

 

[achduke]

Here is John's answer.

Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken and that they might be taken away. (John 19:31 NKJV)​

That would mean the last meal was the night before on the 13/14th timeframe.

 

[WeberHome]

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Yes but can they go out on passover and buy anything? Is it not considered
a sabbath at that point?

The official Passover sabbath as per Ex 12:16 didn't begin until the night
that the Jews ate their lambs. Christ ate his a night ahead of theirs so shops
were still open for business.

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[achduke]

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The official Passover sabbath didn't begin until the night that the Jews ate
their lambs. Christ ate his a night ahead of theirs so all the shops were
still open for business.

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I have to believe that Christ was crucified exactly at the appointed time when the lambs were slaughtered. Passover would be after the lambs are slaughtered.

 

[jamie]

That would mean the last meal was the night before on the 13/14th timeframe.

Yes, and in the context of the NT evening began at noon (midday). The Passover was sacrificed at the time of the evening sacrifice and eaten after sundown which began the annual Sabbath.

 

[achduke]

Yes, and in the context of the NT evening began at noon (midday). The Passover was sacrificed at the time of the evening sacrifice and eaten after sundown which began the annual Sabbath.

Do you believe then the last meal was not passover?

 

[Bright Raven]

Luke 22:15 New King James Version (NKJV)

15 Then He said to them, “With fervent desire I have desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer;

 

[jamie]

Do you believe then the last meal was not passover?

The unleavened bread and the wine are the NT Passover that God instituted through Jesus just as God had instituted the Passover for Israel through Moses.

God told Moses, "I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brethren and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him." (Deuteronomy 18:18 NKJV)

 

[steko]

John 19:42 and Luke 23:53 appear to contradict eating the night of the 15th if the preparation day is the 14th. Christ was already in the tomb.

John 19:42 There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews' preparation day; for the sepulchre was nigh at hand.

Luke 23:53 And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid. 54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.

Mark defines 'the preparation' for his readers:

Mar 15:42 And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath, [/B]

It is the Greek word 'paraskeue' and in every place in all four gospels where the word 'paraskeue/the preparation' is used, it is in reference to the day before the seventh day Sabbath.

Others will argue that Mark was referring to a sabbath other than the seventh day Sabbath. But, Mark was taking the time to inform us what the word 'paraskeue' means and if he was referring to something other than the seventh day Sabbath, he would have said so, otherwise his effort to inform us of the meaning is an exercise in futility.

In Greece today, the word for Friday is 'Paraskeve' which is derived from the Koine Greek 'paraskeue'.
I had the oportunity to meet an Egyptian Coptic Christian about a year ago. I asked him what the word Paraskeve meant to him and he replied, "It's the day before the seventh day Sabbath."

In the gospels, the word 'hetoimazo' is used in every case to describe the 'preparation' of the Passover meal on the 14th, not 'paraskeue'.

If one understands the plain statement of the text that the Lord Jesus ate the Passover meal at the appointed time with all Israel and one also understands the meaning of 'paraskeue', then everything falls into place and all four gospel accounts of the timeline harmonize.
If one does not understand these things then, Johns' account appears to contradict the other three.

 

[steko]

I have to believe that Christ was crucified exactly at the appointed time when the lambs were slaughtered. Passover would be after the lambs are slaughtered.

Can't be.
Israel killed the lambs/passover on the 14th, which is the same day that His disciples prepared[hetoimazo] the Passover. Christ was crucified on the 15th.

Mar 14:12 And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare[hetoimazo] that thou mayest eat the passover?

Luk 22:7 Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed.
Luk 22:8 And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare[hetoimazo] us the passover, that we may eat.

 

[achduke]

Can't be.
Israel killed the lambs/passover on the 14th, which is the same day that His disciples prepared[hetoimazo] the Passover. Christ was crucified on the 15th.

Mar 14:12 And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare[hetoimazo] that thou mayest eat the passover?

Luk 22:7 Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed.
Luk 22:8 And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare[hetoimazo] us the passover, that we may eat.

The day can begin at night fall which would be the beginning of the 14th which would leave time for the lambs to be slaughtered at the end of the 14th at twilight.

 

[steko]

The day can begin at night fall which would be the beginning of the 14th which would leave time for the lambs to be slaughtered at the end of the 14th at twilight.

Yes. I have no argument with that.

 

[Nick M]

The 'last supper' was the Passover meal, according to GOD's appointed times for all Israel.
The Lord Jesus ate the Passover meal with His disciples at GOD's appointed time for all Israel....

Well done and scripturally supported.

 

[jamie]

It is the Greek word 'paraskeue' and in every place in all four gospels where the word 'paraskeue/the preparation' is used, it is in reference to the day before the seventh day Sabbath.

Paraskeue is never translated in the NT as the sixth day of the week. In the Greek, the word means preparation, to make ready. Each house had to be unleavened before the first day of the feast.

The weekly Sabbath is never translated in the NT as being the first day of Unleavened Bread.

After the Sabbath the women bought spices, prepared them and rested on the seventh day.