Dozer's Fixation on Rape!

[glorydaz]

Agreed. Rape is one of those actions (like murder, child molestation, abortion, adultery, spousal abuse, etc.) where there is no middle ground.

It's always wrong. It is never the victim's fault.

Again, I find it highly interesting that in any other scenario (gun control, hate crimes, etc.), the consistent answer is that the CRIMINAL is solely responsible for his/her actions.

What exactly is *real* rape? Is that like "real car jacking"? Real murder? Real break in?

Everyone is solely responsible for their own actions. Everyone. Whether they be right or whether they be wrong. Sometimes both parties do something wrong. Amazing how that is.

 

[patrick jane]

good for her - we all make mistakes
owning up to them is what's at hand here
and those women see no reason to accept responsibility for their behavior

I wonder how many rapes are alleged after a social interaction involving alcohol and/or drugs ? When legally they aren't rapes but the alleged victims sobers up and decides they were raped.

I think I was taken advantage of one time by a big girl, i'd say taken advantage of but not raped. Although I did feel a bit violated after the booze wore off.

 

[Quetzal]

Everyone is solely responsible for their own actions. Everyone. Whether they be right or whether they be wrong. Sometimes both parties do something wrong. Amazing how that is.

I hold the opinion that this idea does not apply when it comes to sexual assault.

 

[genuineoriginal]

This is such an outrageous conversation that I am really provoked!It appears to bring out deep seated misogyny in some posters including the author of these so many threads on rape? Dreaming up all kinds of hideous scenarios about rape to justify that rapists can't help themselves if they are provoked.

Who is trying to justify the rapists?

The problem being addressed is not whether the rapists are at fault

The problem these threads are trying to address is whether the current lack of common sense in our culture has any part in creating more rapists and victims.

 

[ok doser]

I wonder how many rapes are alleged after a social interaction involving alcohol and/or drugs ? When legally they aren't rapes but the alleged victims sobers up and decides they were raped.

I think I was taken advantage of one time by a big girl, i'd say taken advantage of but not raped. Although I did feel a bit violated after the booze wore off.

alcohol is the number one factor in youth rapes - typically high school and college age

 

[ok doser]

Those of us who have been here for a while remember dozer's attempt to blame his wife because they engaged in physical confrontations. He actually bragged about it.

wanted to link to this because it was such a pain to search for - here's the closest i could get - the original is apparently gone:

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3921491&postcount=282


now knock it off

 

[genuineoriginal]

The answer is no because rape has always existed.

Rape existing for thousands of years does not automatically make the answer "no".

To say a rapist was "provoked" is an absurd concept.

Not according to some scientists.

_____
What Provokes a Rapist to Rape?; Scientists Debate Notion of an Evolutionary Drive
. . .
they assert in ''A Natural History of Rape: Biological Bases of Sexual Coercion,'' that rape ''is in its very essence a sexual act'' and that the practice may have evolved because it confers an evolutionary advantage.

All of which, given the current passion for pulling Darwin into the domain of human sexual affairs, is not particularly new. But the scientists go further: If rape prevention programs are to be successful, they contend, evolution must be taken into account. They recommend, among other things, advising women that ''the way they dress can put them at risk.'' They also recommend instructing young men, before they are granted drivers' licenses, that ''Darwinian selection'' is the reason a man ''may be tempted to demand sex even if he knows that his date truly doesn't want it'' or ''may mistake a woman's friendly comment or tight blouse as an invitation to sex.''
. . .
_____​

 

[glorydaz]

Who is trying to justify the rapists?

The problem being addressed is not whether the rapists are at fault

The problem these threads are trying to address is whether the current lack of common sense in our culture has any part in creating more rapists and victims.

:thumb:

 

[Rusha]

I hold the opinion that this idea does not apply when it comes to sexual assault.

That is because ... sexual assault in not legal. Nor is rape. Nor is murder. Nor is child abuse. Nor is theft.

When is the last time you heard someone blast the victim of a sniper because they were taking a walk after dark? OR ... for allowing a thief to break into their home and steal their guns?

 

[Quetzal]

Not according to some scientists.

_____
What Provokes a Rapist to Rape?; Scientists Debate Notion of an Evolutionary Drive
. . .
they assert in ''A Natural History of Rape: Biological Bases of Sexual Coercion,'' that rape ''is in its very essence a sexual act'' and that the practice may have evolved because it confers an evolutionary advantage.

All of which, given the current passion for pulling Darwin into the domain of human sexual affairs, is not particularly new. But the scientists go further: If rape prevention programs are to be successful, they contend, evolution must be taken into account. They recommend, among other things, advising women that ''the way they dress can put them at risk.'' They also recommend instructing young men, before they are granted drivers' licenses, that ''Darwinian selection'' is the reason a man ''may be tempted to demand sex even if he knows that his date truly doesn't want it'' or ''may mistake a woman's friendly comment or tight blouse as an invitation to sex.''
. . .
_____​

A bad person is a bad person, they can use any excuse they like but the fact remains the same.

 

[ok doser]

The answer is no because rape has always existed. To say a rapist was "provoked" is an absurd concept.

the ferguson protesters who assaulted Joe:

Joe goes down to the Ferguson protests dressed in klan robes and a hood, carrying a sign that says "Michael Brown Deserved To Be Shot!" and shouts racial slurs at the protesters. Joe gets his butt kicked, severely.

would you agree that they were provoked?

 

[glorydaz]

I hold the opinion that this idea does not apply when it comes to sexual assault.

I know. In other words, a woman can be doing something wrong, but if she ends up getting raped, that wrong she was doing is no longer wrong. Gotcha' :thumb:

 

[genuineoriginal]

Agreed. Rape is one of those actions (like murder, child molestation, abortion, adultery, spousal abuse, etc.) where there is no middle ground.

It's always wrong. It is never the victim's fault.

Again, I find it highly interesting that in any other scenario (gun control, hate crimes, etc.), the consistent answer is that the CRIMINAL is solely responsible for his/her actions.

What exactly is *real* rape? Is that like "real car jacking"? Real murder? Real break in?

Maybe you can tell us why is our society attempting to redefine what rape is to include things that are not rape?

 

[Quetzal]

the ferguson protesters who assaulted Joe:

Joe goes down to the Ferguson protests dressed in klan robes and a hood, carrying a sign that says "Michael Brown Deserved To Be Shot!" and shouts racial slurs at the protesters. Joe gets his butt kicked, severely.

would you agree that they were provoked?

I do not accept the comparison because they are not the same thing.

 

[ok doser]

Rape existing for thousands of years does not automatically make the answer "no".

Not according to some scientists.

_____
What Provokes a Rapist to Rape?; Scientists Debate Notion of an Evolutionary Drive
. . .
they assert in ''A Natural History of Rape: Biological Bases of Sexual Coercion,'' that rape ''is in its very essence a sexual act'' and that the practice may have evolved because it confers an evolutionary advantage.

All of which, given the current passion for pulling Darwin into the domain of human sexual affairs, is not particularly new. But the scientists go further: If rape prevention programs are to be successful, they contend, evolution must be taken into account. They recommend, among other things, advising women that ''the way they dress can put them at risk.'' They also recommend instructing young men, before they are granted drivers' licenses, that ''Darwinian selection'' is the reason a man ''may be tempted to demand sex even if he knows that his date truly doesn't want it'' or ''may mistake a woman's friendly comment or tight blouse as an invitation to sex.''
. . .
_____​

dang - i'm putting together a presentation on rape for next week and i would soooooo like to use that

 

[Quetzal]

I know. In other words, a woman can be doing something wrong, but if she ends up getting raped, that wrong she was doing is no longer wrong. Gotcha' :thumb:

You are using a lot of broad strokes.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I wonder how many rapes are alleged after a social interaction involving alcohol and/or drugs ? When legally they aren't rapes but the alleged victims sobers up and decides they were raped.

I think I was taken advantage of one time by a big girl, i'd say taken advantage of but not raped. Although I did feel a bit violated after the booze wore off.

I remember that.

What was the deal with her anyway?

 

[ok doser]

I do not accept the comparison because they are not the same thing.

so you'll only accept a comparison if it's the "same thing" and you already reject that a woman owns any responsibility for her foolish behavior :freak:

you get an F

 

[Quetzal]

I remember that.

What was the deal with her anyway?

In what dark corner of the internet did you find that picture? :chuckle:

 

[ok doser]

I remember that.

What was the deal with her anyway?

is that one of the "tougher girls than you" that john w used to fight?