Christians worship Christ; JW's do not!

God's Truth

New member
Good point.

No one is saying Jesus Christ was a mere mortal by saying there is a subsidiary nature shown in scripture.



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Thank you, pops. They seem to think having a body made makes one a mortal.

God is Spirit and made Himself a body.

Then He made everything through that body.

It is the spiritual body of the man Jesus Christ.

It is the body that Jesus had first and last.

It is the body he had before coming to earth and the body he received back after ascending to heaven.
 

popsthebuilder

New member
Sounds like the body you speak of here could also be referenced as the Word.

Would you agree?

It is obvious you aren't speaking of a physical body exactly.
Thank you, pops. They seem to think having a body made makes one a mortal.

God is Spirit and made Himself a body.

Then He made everything through that body.

It is the spiritual body of the man Jesus Christ.

It is the body that Jesus had first and last.

It is the body he had before coming to earth and the body he received back after ascending to heaven.

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keypurr

Well-known member
I hope you have been well friend. It is good to run into you more often lately.

You said something along the lines of GOD is spirit because HE or IT is a person.

Could you please explain this, as it seems very different from what I would have expected you to say.

Thanks.

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Sure friend, a spirit kind of indicates a person, not just a puff of smoke. To understand God somewhat we need to relate to him as a person. That's why he sent his son to become human so we could see the light of who and what God is. I am not good with words so I hope you see my point. But how else could we related to the most high? He is so far above us in all ways. I see his true spirit Son the same way, he needed to become flesh so we could understand his words.

The early English translations considered the Son at the creation an IT, like everything was created through IT. Yet we call this IT a he. No disrespect intended, but IT tells us that an IT (spirit) became flesh and needed a body to dwell in. Heb 10:5. That spirit came to Jesus with the dove, that is when Jesus became the Christ.

You and I seem to agree on most things.
 

popsthebuilder

New member
Thank you for your clarification.

It seems that you weren't equating GOD almighty to creation after all.

Phew!!!!


Yes sir; we still seem to generally agree.

Been a few years now I thing....

peace sir.
Sure friend, a spirit kind of indicates a person, not just a puff of smoke. To understand God somewhat we need to relate to him as a person. That's why he sent his son to become human so we could see the light of who and what God is. I am not good with words so I hope you see my point. But how else could we related to the most high? He is so far above us in all ways. I see his true spirit Son the same way, he needed to become flesh so we could understand his words.

The early English translations considered the Son at the creation an IT, like everything was created through IT. Yet we call this IT a he. No disrespect intended, but IT tells us that an IT (spirit) became flesh and needed a body to dwell in. Heb 10:5. That spirit came to Jesus with the dove, that is when Jesus became the Christ.

You and I seem to agree on most things.

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keypurr

Well-known member
You ant I both know that word begotten is an addition; and yes; name 1 thing that is born without having a start please

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Not sure if this is correct but I read some where that the Greek word used for "begotten" means "one of a kind", I can see that applied to the logos and Jesus. More so to the logos.
 

popsthebuilder

New member
In the interlinear I use, the only option for meaning is "unique, but that isn't even given for begotten which is literally absent in the Greek it seems to me.
Not sure if this is correct but I read some where that the Greek word used for "begotten" means "one of a kind", I can see that applied to the logos and Jesus. More so to the logos.

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God's Truth

New member
Sounds like the body you speak of here could also be referenced as the Word.

Would you agree?

It is obvious you aren't speaking of a physical body exactly.


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I am speaking of a physical body---a spiritual physical body, the kind we will have when we are raised from the dead.

Yes, Jesus is the body and mouth that speaks God's words; he is the Word of God and is God.
 

TrevorL

Well-known member
Greetings again Apple7,
If you acknowledge that TWO different words are in view, then what is your rational for having them mean the same thing?
I am not sure what two words you are referring to. If you are referring to “ha-Elohim” and “Elohim” as two different words, then I cannot agree with you as it is the same word “Elohim”. If you are referring to the normal word for Judge and the use of Elohim for the Judges that represented God in Exodus 21:6 and Exodus 22:8-9, then this is governed by the context and gives a range of meaning to the Hebrew language.

To illustrate, we have a Governor-General in Australia. If we say the Governor-General got into his car, then we understand that it is only referring to the individual. But if we say the Crown dismissed PM Gough Whitlam, then we think of the Governor-General acting in his role as the Queen’s representative, but it was the Governor-General John Kerr that did the actual dismissing. We do not know to this day if he consulted the Queen.
We have already covered this time and again.
The author of Hebrews used the LXX as the reference.
The writer to the Hebrews is endorsing the translation “Angels”, whether or not the same is contained in the LXX. Unfortunately for you your interpretation disagreed with both the LXX and the translation provided by the writer to the Hebrews. The LXX translation as a whole is not inspired as it has many errors, but the letter to the Hebrews and Hebrews 2:7 is inspired.

Christ and the Apostles were very careful of what they quoted and the following list of headings of where Isaiah is quoted in the NT, taken from Barnes’ Notes in his introduction to Isaiah, show that they were very selective and did not fully or always endorse our Hebrew text or the LXX:
“I. Quotations agreeing exactly with the Hebrew text:
II. Quotations nearly agreeing with the Hebrew text:
III. Quotations agreeing with the Hebrew in sense, but not in words:
IV. Quotations which give the general sense, but which abridge, or add to it:
V. Quotations which are taken from several different places:
VI. Quotations differing from the Hebrew text, but agreeing with the Septuagint text:
VII. Quotations in which there is reason to suspect a different reading in the Hebrew text, or that the words were understood in a sense different from that expressed in our Lexicons:
VIII. Allusion to a passage in Isaiah:
IX. Quotations made from the Septuagint: Many of the passages above referred to are made also from the Septuagint, when that version agrees with the Hebrew. I refer here to a few passages which have not been noted before. The apostles wrote in the Greek language and for the use of those among whom the Septuagint was extensively used. Occasionally, however, they quoted directly from the Hebrew, that is, made a translation themselves, or quoted according to the general sense. All the quotations that are in accordance with the Septuagint, or that vary from it, may be seen in Horne's Introduction, vol. ii. pp. 387, 428.
X. Quotations which differ from the Hebrew, and the Septuagint, and which were perhaps taken from some version or paraphrase, or which were so rendered by the sacred writers themselves: ”
John 10 does nothing to support your worldview,
Nice dismissive comment, but not much substance. I am very content with my understanding of John 10:30-36 that Jesus is the Son of God. I need to consider the full implications of Jesus being sanctified and sent, but this teaches and agrees with the belief of Jesus as the Son of God and not the Trinity. I have not found another reasonable explanation of the teaching of John 10:30-36.

Kind regards
Trevor
 
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