Calvinism: You Must Already be Saved to Get Saved?

God's Truth

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What jesus you talking about? Is it the one that made many righteous by His one obedience Rom 5:19?

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Jesus provides salvation for the WHOLE WORLD,for EVERY MAN, FOR ALL. That is what the Bible says.

Jesus dying for us is the GRACE of God.

We do NOT ENTER that grace unless we have living faith.


See Romans 5:2, James 2:14, 17, 20, and 22.
 

God's Truth

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That is exactly what he does. He is either unwilling or unable to comprehend the ideas of other people

That is the frustrating part, because we put so much into explaining with many scriptures and all we get is the same few scriptures he resorts to, scriptures that he misunderstands.
 

God's Truth

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God wants all men saved. Read how many times scripture says "all men.”


John 1:6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. 10He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. 13Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 Timothy2:3-6 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men—the testimony given in its proper time.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men.
 

beloved57

Well-known member

God wants all men saved. Read how many times scripture says "all men.”


John 1:6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. 10He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. 13Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 Timothy2:3-6 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men—the testimony given in its proper time.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men.
False teaching, unless you mean all the Elect!

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Shasta

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God wants all men saved. Read how many times scripture says "all men.”


John 1:6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. 10He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. 13Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 Timothy2:3-6 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all men—the testimony given in its proper time.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men.

Maybe...and I am just engaging in some wild speculation here but could

all = all
every = every
world = world
whosoever = whosoever

No that is much too simple. We need a Calvinist theologian to make the words mean something else.
 

Crucible

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1 John 2:2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

And how exactly does this go against Calvinism?

This repeated thing has gotten old- unless you believe everyone is saved, than it supports Calvinism because it is admission that while the Atonement is enough to suffice the whole world, God has nevertheless not chosen the whole world.
 

God's Truth

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Why do people reject Jesus? Why do they believe in nothing, or in false gods/goddesses? The Bible tells us why people do not believe. The bible tells us why Jesus does not save many, and it is NOT for the reason the Calvinists say!

Those who don't believe and obey Jesus love darkness instead of light because their deeds are evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.

They are stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, and they always resist the Holy Ghost.

They are obstinate people, who walk in ways not good, pursuing their own imaginations--

They do evil in God's sight and chose what displeases Him.

That which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations,

They exchange the truth of God for a lie.

They are self-seeking and they reject the truth and follow evil.

They do not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God.

They are hostile to God.

They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

They have been deceived by sin.

The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

Their minds are on earthly things.

When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart.

There are those who hear the word of God but the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. And there are those who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away. There are those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by life’s worries, riches and pleasures, and they do not mature.

They are stubborn and follow their own devices.

They are stubborn; the sinews of their neck are iron, their forehead are bronze.

They have stubborn and rebellious hearts; they have turned aside and gone away.

They do not listen or pay attention; instead, they follow the stubborn inclinations of their evil hearts. They go backward and not forward.

They have stubborn pride.

They refuse to give up their evil practices and stubborn ways.

They are rebellious people, deceitful children, children unwilling to listen to the LORD’s instruction.

Stubborn like a heifer. How then can the LORD pasture them like lambs in a meadow?

John 3:19, 20; Acts 7:51; Isaiah30:9; 65:2; 65:11,12; Romans 1:19-21; 1:25; 1:28; 2:8; 8:7; 2 Thessalonians 2:10; Hebrews 3:13; 2 Corinthians 4:3-4; Philippians 3:19; Matthew 13:19; Luke 8:11-16; Psalm 81:12; Isaiah 48:4; Jeremiah 5:23; 7:24; Leviticus 26:19; Judges 2:19; Hosea 4:16.
 
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