Anyone Who Thinks Another Person Deserves To Be Raped Is A Knob

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Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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Not very subtle and another "rape" thread but hopefully this one might just lay to rest the insidious theme that's been going about and end the crap once and for all.

Does anyone agree with the following from the TOL "stalwart" of good taste, scholarly debate and outright bollards on this for example:

"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4528653&postcount=106

I submit that if you do agree with the above then you're either a psychopath, a sociopath, or a complete troll who needs something to keep his bridge warm at night.

Does anyone deserve to be raped, at all?
 
Traditio

Traditio

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I've seen this posting of Koban before. I don't know how to interpret it. "Deserve" could be understood in more than one sense.

1. It could indicate a claim of justice. A deserves B if and only if B is owed to A in justice. Thus, if A deserves to receive B from C, then C commits an act of justice in giving B to A. Thus, "A deserves to be raped" could mean "It is just for somebody to rape A." This reading of Koban, however, seems to be contraindicated by another thread in which he asserted that the commission of rape is always wrong.

2. A deserves B if and only if B is a foreseeable (albeit, perhaps, unintended) and avoidable consequence of some act C, and A commits C, knowing fully well that B could, and indeed, probably would, result in consequence. This is what we customarily mean when we say things like:

A. He had it coming.
B. He made his own bed; now he has to lie in it.
C. He should have known better.

I'm inclined to think tht Koban means the latter sense, but I'm not sure.

What do you think that he is saying?

If he means the latter sense, we do often say things like the following:

"Dude, you parked right out on the street in the middle of the ghetto...left your windows open...and the GPS on the front seat...and somebody stole it? Yup. You had it coming, man. What have we learned?"

Does this ever apply to the case of rape? I'm not prepared to comment on this either way.
 
Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Traditio said:
I've seen this posting of Koban before. I don't know how to interpret it. "Deserve" could be understood in more than one sense.

1. It could indicate a claim of justice. A deserves B if and only if B is owed to A in justice. Thus, if A deserves to receive B from C, then C commits an act of justice in giving B to A. Thus, "A deserves to be raped" could mean "It is just for somebody to rape A." This reading of Koban, however, seems to be contraindicated by another thread in which he asserted that the commission of rape is always wrong.

2. A deserves B if and only if B is a foreseeable (albeit, perhaps, unintended) and avoidable consequence of some act C, and A commits C, knowing fully well that B could, and indeed, probably would, result in consequence. This is what we customarily mean when we say things like:

A. He had it coming.
B. He made his own bed; now he has to lie in it.
C. He should have known better.

I'm inclined to think tht Koban means the latter sense, but I'm not sure.

What do you think that he is saying?
Click to expand...

'Think' he's saying? He said it in black and white. Here it is again in case you hadn't noticed...:

"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"

Now never mind with the pseudo intellectual borefest Trad, is there any situation that you can envisage where a person deserves to be raped as explicitly voiced by SOD?
 
Traditio

Traditio

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Arthur Brain said:
'Think' he's saying? He said it in black and white. Here it is again in case you hadn't noticed...:

"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"
Click to expand...

I don't know what the underlined means.

How would you rephrase it? :idunno:

Now never mind with the pseudo intellectual borefest Trad, is there any situation that you can envisage where a person deserves to be raped as explicitly voiced by SOD?
Click to expand...

If the latter sense is intended, I can envision circumstances in which a woman can put herself at a high risk for being raped when she otherwise could have avoided it. I further can envision circumstances in which the risk is so likely and so utterly obvious to any reasonable person that it would be quite unreasonable for anyone to put herself in such circumstances.

I wouldn't use words like "deserve" or "earned" though. I would say something like: "Y'know...she probably should have seen that coming." Expressed differently, I might say: "You left your drink unattended at the sex offenders anonymous party, and you subsequently got drugged and then raped? What on earth did you expect to happen?"
 
Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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Traditio said:
I don't know what the underlined means.

How would you rephrase it? :idunno:
Click to expand...

What do you mean you 'don't know what it means'? It means exactly what it says! That SOD thinks that in "certain circumstances" a woman deserves to be raped...what exactly is tripping you up on this? Do you think it was written in some sort of secretive code?

If the latter sense is intended, I can envision circumstances in which a woman can put herself at a high risk for being raped when she otherwise could have avoided it. I further can envision circumstances in which the risk is so likely and so utterly obvious to any reasonable person that it would be quite unreasonable for anyone to put herself in such circumstances.

I wouldn't use words like "deserve" or "earned" though. I would say something like: "Y'know...she probably should have seen that coming." Expressed differently, I might say: "You left your drink unattended at the sex offenders anonymous party, and you subsequently got drugged and then raped? What on earth did you expect to happen?"
Click to expand...

Hey, please either address as to whether someone deserves to be raped or pontificate off elsewhere.
 
musterion

musterion

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Prostitutes are reported to have the highest incidence of rapes. Though many go unreported, the rates are said to be considerably above that of any country's average female population.

If a woman - a college student, for example - chooses to sell herself (and such does happen; not all prostitutes are forced into it), does she bear any responsibility for putting herself in a situation where her statistical likelihood of being raped is higher than average?

This is not an extreme scenario. Nor in any case does any woman "deserve" rape.
 
musterion

musterion

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Speaking of "deserve."


Arthur Brain said:
"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4528653&postcount=106
Click to expand...

Notice the qualifier he provided, which I highlighted? It makes a totally different point than you want him to have made.

I grant that "deserve" seems to be more of a moral judgment which others may be making, or which some (like you) want to dishonestly make on behalf of others who are NOT making it. Either way, I and others am not and have not made any such judgment. I'm simply appealing to the universal law of natural consequences: choose to put yourself in a situation with an increased likelihood of avoidable danger and you must bear some responsibility if that danger results. Condense it down to "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" and the principle is the same. There's nothing remotely sociopathic in pointing that out; it's what good parents teach their children because it's a fact of life.

It's also God's viewpoint on the matter.

So it's YOU, with your typically shallow, emotion-driven thinking, who are wicked and evil for denying that fact.
 
Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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musterion said:
Speaking of "deserve."

Notice the qualifier he provided, which I highlighted? It makes a totally different point than you want him to have made.

I grant that "deserve" seems to be more of a moral judgment which others may be making, or which some (like you) want to dishonestly make on behalf of others who are NOT making it. Either way, I and others am not and have not made any such judgment. I'm simply appealing to the universal law of natural consequences: choose to put yourself in a situation with an increased likelihood of avoidable danger and you must bear some responsibility if that danger results. Condense it down to "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" and the principle is the same. There's nothing remotely sociopathic in pointing that out; it's what good parents teach their children because it's a fact of life.

It's also God's viewpoint on the matter.

So it's YOU, with your typically shallow, emotion-driven thinking, who are wicked and evil for denying that fact.
Click to expand...

Oh, so there's a "qualifier" now for flat out stating that people can deserve to be raped then, "because of their actions"? You think that already wasn't part and parcel of the thread, his whole quote included? Get a grip you prat.

You've just 'justified' rape, in that a victim of such has "earned" it by their "actions", be it baring a leg or stripping off on Broadway or any other scenario you could feasibly or rather not come up with.

This isn't about inadvisable behaviour or your pompous sense of morality or situational ethics believe it or not.
 
Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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musterion said:
Prostitutes are reported to have the highest incidence of rapes. Though many go unreported, the rates are said to be considerably above that of any country's average female population.

If a woman - a college student, for example - chooses to sell herself (and such does happen; not all prostitutes are forced into it), does she bear any responsibility for putting herself in a situation where her statistical likelihood of being raped is higher than average?

This is not an extreme scenario. Nor in any case does any woman "deserve" rape.
Click to expand...

Then quit trying to defend SOD and just outright say that no person deserves to be raped, and without "qualifiers"...should be pretty damn easy yeah?

:thumb:
 
B

bybee

New member
Arthur Brain said:
Not very subtle and another "rape" thread but hopefully this one might just lay to rest the insidious theme that's been going about and end the crap once and for all.

Does anyone agree with the following from the TOL "stalwart" of good taste, scholarly debate and outright bollards on this for example:

"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4528653&postcount=106

I submit that if you do agree with the above then you're either a psychopath, a sociopath, or a complete troll who needs something to keep his bridge warm at night.

Does anyone deserve to be raped, at all?
Click to expand...

No!
 
B

bybee

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musterion said:
Prostitutes are reported to have the highest incidence of rapes. Though many go unreported, the rates are said to be considerably above that of any country's average female population.

If a woman - a college student, for example - chooses to sell herself (and such does happen; not all prostitutes are forced into it), does she bear any responsibility for putting herself in a situation where her statistical likelihood of being raped is higher than average?

This is not an extreme scenario. Nor in any case does any woman "deserve" rape.
Click to expand...

Responsibility for one's own words and deeds is a given.
Responsibility for the word's and deed's of another is a fallacy.
 
ok doser

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Arthur Brain said:
Does anyone deserve to be raped, at all?
Click to expand...



yes

by the definition of "deserve" as "earned by their actions"

a woman who goes alone to a frat party, strips naked and gives lap dances, takes any drugs handed her and drinks until she passes out has "earned by her actions" the consequences of that behavior, whether it includes rape, permanent brain damage or just a wicked hangover
 
B

bybee

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ok doser said:
yes

by the definition of "deserve" as "earned by their actions"

a woman who goes alone to a frat party, strips naked and gives lap dances, takes any drugs handed her and drinks until she passes out has "earned by her actions" the consequences of that behavior, whether it includes rape, permanent brain damage or just a wicked hangover
Click to expand...

You routinely bring up these horrid scenarios. Makes one wonder if you have been there and done that?
 
TomO

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ok doser

ok doser

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ok doser said:
yes

by the definition of "deserve" as "earned by their actions"

a woman who goes alone to a frat party, strips naked and gives lap dances, takes any drugs handed her and drinks until she passes out has "earned by her actions" the consequences of that behavior, whether it includes rape, permanent brain damage or just a wicked hangover
Click to expand...



in a similar manner, if i go to a gay bar wearing nothing but chaps, dance all night with the homos there and engage in all sorts of perverted behaviors that i won't go into here (and would rather not think about), take whatever drugs are offered me and drink myself unconscious, i will have...

earned by my actions

whatever the consequences of those actions are - whether it's permanent brain damage, rape or just a wicked hangover
 
ok doser

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Arthur Brain said:
Does anyone deserve to be raped, at all?
Click to expand...

not that it will matter to a retarded God-rejecter like you, artie, but here's what God has to say about it:




Ezra 9:13 And after all that is come upon us for our evil deeds, and for our great trespass, seeing that thou our God hast punished us less than our iniquities deserve, and hast given us such deliverance as this;




our iniquities deserve to be punished
 
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