ECT According to Paul he was not the only one that preached the MYSTERY.

[Crucible]

So you find the following scripture insulting ?

Eph 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

It is much better to trust and follow God than men.

It's hilarious how you don't see the amazing contradiction you are perpetuating :rotfl:

Also
You perpetuating that has given birth to nothing but heresy. You all are the sole reason why there are a million different 'one true beliefs' in Christianity.

 

[Danoh]

Yours is based on D'ist wisdom but you won't say so. I have collected mine from historians.

What does this have to do with your incomplete homework of commenting on why or how Josephus was informed by Dan 8-9?

Actually, I go by something higher than going by history...I go by the recurrent patterns of things...for what they point back to as to their origin.

You being ever the amatuer; are ever stuck at going only by a subset of my higher level of abstraction - history.

Go up a level of abstraction; you'll see more.

 

[Interplanner]

Actually, I go by something higher than going by history...I go by the recurrent patterns of things...for what they point back to as to their origin.

You being ever the amatuer; are ever stuck at going only by a subset of my higher level of abstraction - history.

Go up a level of abstraction; you'll see more.

Just as I thought. You can't really comment on a specific passage. You're entirely predictable.

 

[dodge]

It's hilarious how you don't see the amazing contradiction you are perpetuating :rotfl:

Also
You perpetuating that has given birth to nothing but heresy. You all are the sole reason why there are a million different 'one true beliefs' in Christianity.

To those who do not trust God and His word( and trust men more than God ) believing scripture is always heresy !

Your loss NOT mine.

 

[Danoh]

Just as I thought. You can't really comment on a specific passage. You're entirely predictable.

I try to be, in contrast to your vagueness :chuckle:

 

[God's Truth]

Mocker is her name.

 

[Interplanner]

I try to be, in contrast to your vagueness :chuckle:

That's your comment on Josephus on Dan 8-9?

 

[Lighthouse]

I have shown you.

I will shown you again, this time with the scripture references:

Jesus preached the Good News, the Apostles taught the Good News, and Paul taught the same Good News.

Matthew 4:23
[ Jesus Heals the Sick ] Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

Matthew 9:35
[ The Workers Are Few ] Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness.
Matthew 11:5

The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Mark 1:1
[ John the Baptist Prepares the Way ] The beginning of the good news about Jesus the Messiah, the Son of God,

Mark 1:14
[ Jesus Announces the Good News ] After John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God.

Mark 1:15
“The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!”

Luke 3:18
And with many other words John exhorted the people and proclaimed the good news to them.

Luke 4:18
“The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to set the oppressed free,

Luke 4:43
But he said, “I must proclaim the good news of the kingdom of God to the other towns also, because that is why I was sent.”

Luke 7:22
So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Luke 8:1
[ The Parable of the Sower ] After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him,

Luke 9:6
So they set out and went from village to village, proclaiming the good news and healing people everywhere.

Luke 16:16
[ Additional Teachings ] “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing their way into it.

Luke 20:1
[ The Authority of Jesus Questioned ] One day as Jesus was teaching the people in the temple courts and proclaiming the good news, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, together with the elders, came up to him.

You haven't shown squat.

If you could make an argument you'd be able to tell us what the good news of the kingdom is.

Here's a question that I bet you can't answer: Before the cross did the12 preach about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ?

Acts 5:42
Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Messiah.

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip as he proclaimed the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ,they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:35
Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

Acts 10:36
You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all.

Acts 11:20
Some of them, however, men from Cyprus and Cyrene, went to Antioch and began to speak to Greeks also, telling them the good news about the Lord Jesus.

Acts 13:32
“We tell you the good news: What God promised our ancestors

Acts 14:15
“Friends, why are you doing this? We too are only human, like you. We are bringing you good news, telling you to turn from these worthless things to the living God, who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and everything in them.

Acts 17:18
A group of Epicurean and Stoic philosophers began to debate with him. Some of them asked, “What is this babbler trying to say?” Others remarked, “He seems to be advocating foreign gods.” They said this because Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection.

Acts 20:24
However, I consider my life worth nothing to me; my only aim is to finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the good news of God’s grace.

Romans 10:15
And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”

Romans 10:16
But not all the Israelites accepted the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?”

Hebrews 4:2
For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.

Hebrews 4:6
Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience,
7 God again set a certain day, calling it "Today." This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts." 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience.


There is one gospel, and one good news.

What does this good news consist of?

Jesus preached it. That is good enough. Jesus was LAYING THE FOUNDATION, and then the Apostles also helped lay it after Jesus ascended to heaven.

To whom did Jesus preach the crucifixion?

Salvation through belief in Jesus for the forgiveness of sins one repented of...reconciliation to God.

Does the death, burial and resurrection have anything to do with it?

This is how I hear a Madist having God think about:

Oh wow, those Jews really fooled me, they didn't accept my son, oh man, I am going to send Paul with a pay back message; then later, I will help the Jews make me an earthly temple of stone so they can bring a bunch of animals to sacrifice.

Because you don't use your brain to think about it.

The parable of the fig tree shows that God expected this.

What I hear your false Paul saying:

Jesus entrusted me to give a better message, me alone...even though when my blood is shed NO ONE is atoned for.

No one said Paul's message was better. You're an idiot.

 

[Interplanner]

LightH wrote:
Here's a question that I bet you can't answer: Before the cross did the12 preach about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ?


Sure: behold the Lamb of God. Jn 1.
His name will be Jesus (Joshua) because he will save his people from their sins. You don't do that from a throne. Mt. 2
the son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins, in anticipation of what he would do/be. Mk 2.
Many others.

A 'basileu' is a reign, a power. That's what was being implanted. It was the power of forgiveness, which was a shocking contrast to Judaic law, and which is not controlled by a state. The expression never meant a brick and mortar theocracy with a throne as they knew it, although all believers reign and the apostles are foundation 'blocks' of the 'city' and are 'on thrones.'

 

[Right Divider]

No one said Paul's message was better. You're an idiot.

They love to give that straw-man of theirs a really good beating!

Let 'em have at it. Take something that we do not believe and beat the crap out of it!

 

[Lighthouse]

LightH wrote:
Here's a question that I bet you can't answer: Before the cross did the12 preach about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ?


Sure: behold the Lamb of God. Jn 1.
His name will be Jesus (Joshua) because he will save his people from their sins. You don't do that from a throne. Mt. 2
the son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins, in anticipation of what he would do/be. Mk 2.
Many others.

A 'basileu' is a reign, a power. That's what was being implanted. It was the power of forgiveness, which was a shocking contrast to Judaic law, and which is not controlled by a state. The expression never meant a brick and mortar theocracy with a throne as they knew it, although all believers reign and the apostles are foundation 'blocks' of the 'city' and are 'on thrones.'

Try again:

And it happened, as He was alone praying, that His disciples joined Him, and He asked them, saying, [Jesus]“Who do the crowds say that I am?”[/Jesus] So they answered and said, “John the Baptist, but some say Elijah; and others say that one of the old prophets has risen again.”
He said to them, [Jesus]“But who do you say that I am?”[/Jesus]
Peter answered and said, “The Christ of God.”
And He strictly warned and commanded them to tell this to no one, saying, [Jesus]“The Son of Man must suffer many things, and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised the third day.”[/Jesus]
- Luke 9:18-22

 

[Interplanner]

Try again:

And it happened, as He was alone praying, that His disciples joined Him, and He asked them, saying, [Jesus]“Who do the crowds say that I am?”[/Jesus] So they answered and said, “John the Baptist, but some say Elijah; and others say that one of the old prophets has risen again.”
He said to them, [Jesus]“But who do you say that I am?”[/Jesus]
Peter answered and said, “The Christ of God.”
And He strictly warned and commanded them to tell this to no one, saying, [Jesus]“The Son of Man must suffer many things, and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised the third day.”[/Jesus]
- Luke 9:18-22

It sank in slow didn't it! Your question was not how well received it was but whether he announced it.

Do you know what a lamb is in the Judaic worship system? OK, now, say a guy comes down the street and says he's the Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world. It's a big grisly, but it will do. You get the point.

And that was before he even got started.

 

[God's Truth]

You haven't shown squat.

How do you say that about the scriptures?

Jesus preached the Good News, the Apostles taught the Good News, and Paul taught the same Good News.

Matthew 4:23
[ Jesus Heals the Sick ] Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

Matthew 9:35
[ The Workers Are Few ] Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness.
Matthew 11:5

The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Mark 1:1
[ John the Baptist Prepares the Way ] The beginning of the good news about Jesus the Messiah, the Son of God,

Mark 1:14
[ Jesus Announces the Good News ] After John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God.

Mark 1:15
“The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!”

Luke 3:18
And with many other words John exhorted the people and proclaimed the good news to them.

Luke 4:18
“The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to set the oppressed free,

Luke 4:43
But he said, “I must proclaim the good news of the kingdom of God to the other towns also, because that is why I was sent.”

Luke 7:22
So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Luke 8:1
[ The Parable of the Sower ] After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him,

Luke 9:6
So they set out and went from village to village, proclaiming the good news and healing people everywhere.

Luke 16:16
[ Additional Teachings ] “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing their way into it.

Luke 20:1
[ The Authority of Jesus Questioned ] One day as Jesus was teaching the people in the temple courts and proclaiming the good news, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, together with the elders, came up to him.

Acts 5:42
Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Messiah.

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip as he proclaimed the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ,they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:35
Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

Acts 10:36
You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all.

Acts 11:20
Some of them, however, men from Cyprus and Cyrene, went to Antioch and began to speak to Greeks also, telling them the good news about the Lord Jesus.

Acts 13:32
“We tell you the good news: What God promised our ancestors

Acts 14:15
“Friends, why are you doing this? We too are only human, like you. We are bringing you good news, telling you to turn from these worthless things to the living God, who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and everything in them.

Acts 17:18
A group of Epicurean and Stoic philosophers began to debate with him. Some of them asked, “What is this babbler trying to say?” Others remarked, “He seems to be advocating foreign gods.” They said this because Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection.

Acts 20:24
However, I consider my life worth nothing to me; my only aim is to finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the good news of God’s grace.

Romans 10:15
And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”

Romans 10:16
But not all the Israelites accepted the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?”

Hebrews 4:2
For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.

Hebrews 4:6
Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience,
7 God again set a certain day, calling it "Today." This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts." 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience.

 

[God's Truth]

You haven't shown squat.

That is what you say about all the scriptures I gave showing that the good news was preached through out the whole New Testament.

If you could make an argument you'd be able to tell us what the good news of the kingdom is.

Again, I have shown you.

Here's a question that I bet you can't answer: Before the cross did the12 preach about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ?

To whom did Jesus preach the crucifixion?

Jesus preached to his disciples that he would have to die.

Matthew 16:21
From that time on Jesus began to show His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

Luke 9:22 And he said, "The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life."

Luke 9:44
"Let these words sink into your ears: The Son of Man is about to be delivered into the hands of men."

Luke 24:44
Jesus said to them, "These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms."


EVEN NON BELIEVERS KNEW JESUS PREACHED HE WOULD DIE AND RISE AGAIN.

Matthew 27:63
"Sir," they said, "we remember that while He was alive that deceiver said 'After three days I will rise again.'

Does the death, burial and resurrection have anything to do with it?


Because you don't use your brain to think about it.

The parable of the fig tree shows that God expected this.

Reread what I just wrote for you.

 

[Danoh]

That's your comment on Josephus on Dan 8-9?

You ask for comment on a passage just so you can then vomit your books based garbage against it.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

You ask for comment on a passage just so you can then vomit your books based garbage against it.

You seem to be losing Holfordian patience with IP.

 

[Lighthouse]

It sank in slow didn't it! Your question was not how well received it was but whether he announced it.

No it wasn't. My question was "Did the 12 preach it before it happened?". And they did not. So the gospel they preached was different from the one Paul preached.

Do you know what a lamb is in the Judaic worship system? OK, now, say a guy comes down the street and says he's the Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world. It's a big grisly, but it will do. You get the point.

And that was before he even got started.

Who said that?

Hint: It wasn't Jesus. Nor was it one of his disciples.

How do you say that about the scriptures?

Because, none of them say what the "good news" is.

Jesus preached the Good News, the Apostles taught the Good News, and Paul taught the same Good News.

What good news? What was the good news they preached?

Matthew 4:23
[ Jesus Heals the Sick ] Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

Matthew 9:35
[ The Workers Are Few ] Jesus went through all the towns and villages, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom and healing every disease and sickness.
Matthew 11:5

The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Mark 1:1
[ John the Baptist Prepares the Way ] The beginning of the good news about Jesus the Messiah, the Son of God,

Mark 1:14
[ Jesus Announces the Good News ] After John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God.

Mark 1:15
“The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!”

Luke 3:18
And with many other words John exhorted the people and proclaimed the good news to them.

Luke 4:18
“The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to set the oppressed free,

Luke 4:43
But he said, “I must proclaim the good news of the kingdom of God to the other towns also, because that is why I was sent.”

Luke 7:22
So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor.

Luke 8:1
[ The Parable of the Sower ] After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him,

Luke 9:6
So they set out and went from village to village, proclaiming the good news and healing people everywhere.

Luke 16:16
[ Additional Teachings ] “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing their way into it.

Luke 20:1
[ The Authority of Jesus Questioned ] One day as Jesus was teaching the people in the temple courts and proclaiming the good news, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, together with the elders, came up to him.

Acts 5:42
Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Messiah.

Acts 8:12
But when they believed Philip as he proclaimed the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ,they were baptized, both men and women.

Acts 8:35
Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

Acts 10:36
You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all.

Acts 11:20
Some of them, however, men from Cyprus and Cyrene, went to Antioch and began to speak to Greeks also, telling them the good news about the Lord Jesus.

Acts 13:32
“We tell you the good news: What God promised our ancestors

Acts 14:15
“Friends, why are you doing this? We too are only human, like you. We are bringing you good news, telling you to turn from these worthless things to the living God, who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and everything in them.

Acts 17:18
A group of Epicurean and Stoic philosophers began to debate with him. Some of them asked, “What is this babbler trying to say?” Others remarked, “He seems to be advocating foreign gods.” They said this because Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection.

Acts 20:24
However, I consider my life worth nothing to me; my only aim is to finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the good news of God’s grace.

Romans 10:15
And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”

Romans 10:16
But not all the Israelites accepted the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?”

Hebrews 4:2
For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.

Hebrews 4:6
Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience,
7 God again set a certain day, calling it "Today." This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts." 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience.

Still no answer.

That is what you say about all the scriptures I gave showing that the good news was preached through out the whole New Testament.

And I have explained why.

Again, I have shown you.

No you haven't.

Jesus preached to his disciples that he would have to die.

Did He preach it to anyone else? Did they?

Matthew 16:21
From that time on Jesus began to show His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

Luke 9:22 And he said, "The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life."

Luke 9:44
"Let these words sink into your ears: The Son of Man is about to be delivered into the hands of men."

Luke 24:44
Jesus said to them, "These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms."

Apparently not.

EVEN NON BELIEVERS KNEW JESUS PREACHED HE WOULD DIE AND RISE AGAIN.

Matthew 27:63
"Sir," they said, "we remember that while He was alive that deceiver said 'After three days I will rise again.'

And when did Jesus say this?

Reread what I just wrote for you.

I actually read the passages in context.

 

[Danoh]

You seem to be losing Holfordian patience with IP.

Lol, I'm not much of an enabler - I'd've gotten rid of Barney long ago; talked Curly into finally beating Moe senseless; talked the Castaways into voting Gilligan off the island, talked Hymie into throwing Maxwell Smart off a tall building, and so on :rotfl:

 

[God's Truth]

No it wasn't. My question was "Did the 12 preach it before it happened?". And they did not. So the gospel they preached was different from the one Paul preached.


Who said that?

Hint: It wasn't Jesus. Nor was it one of his disciples.


Because, none of them say what the "good news" is.


What good news? What was the good news they preached?


Still no answer.


And I have explained why.


No you haven't.


Did He preach it to anyone else? Did they?


Apparently not.

And when did Jesus say this?



I actually read the passages in context.

You cannot get around it. Jesus preached that he would die and rise again. Even those who called him the deceiver knew.

Haaaaaaa!

 

[God's Truth]

Lighthouse,

I gave MANY scriptures saying what the good news is. It is not my fault that you do not accept what the scriptures say about the good news.

Jesus came and taught the guidelines for the NEW COVENANT, and then he shed his blood for the New Covenant.

Blood Covenants have to be followed exactly.

You saying the 12 did not preach Jesus was going to die is not proven, and does not change anything.

It certainly does not prove anything that you say.