A Peculiar Kind of Gospel

[LightSon]

Could the "spirit of the law" be taken from this passage?.

Rom. 7:6
'But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. "

Here is a clear reference to "the letter" of the law, from which we've been delivered and "newness of spirit" in which we should serve.

And Christ's extention to the spirituality of the law is another support for this shift from the letter to the spirit: OT to NT thinking if you will.

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by LightSon

Could the "spirit of the law" be taken from this passage?.

Rom. 7:6
'But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. "

Here is a clear reference to "the letter" of the law, from which we've been delivered and "newness of spirit" in which we should serve.

And Christ's extention to the spirituality of the law is another support for this shift from the letter to the spirit: OT to NT thinking if you will.

:think: :think: :nono:

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by godrulz

Not in your universe. What do you call the concept of Jesus distinguishing the letter of the law from its true, inclusive meaning (adultery/lust; murder/hate)? We could call the concept whatever you want (aba daba doo?), but the concept still exists.

cf. Trinity. The word is not in the Bible, but it does not mean the concept is not in the Bible.

Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom/liberty. The law written on tablets is now written on our hearts. There is a difference between the Holy Spirit and other uses of the word spirit.

God is the Moral Governor of the universe. He is the source of moral laws. The Law did not come from man or Satan. The law's relationship to grace must be clearly defined. We are not saved by the law, nor are we to be lawless (unless you are called Lawless).

the idea of the "spirit of the law" is not in the Bible. And there is nothing to allude to that. Except that the Spirit if the law is the Spirit of God, because it's His law. But beyond that, you have no place to stand. And the word Godhead is in the Bible. And it is where we get the Trinity from. The concept of the "spirit of the law" is completely absent from the Bible. Well, your concept of it anyway.

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by LightSon

Could the "spirit of the law" be taken from this passage?.

Rom. 7:6
'But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. "

Here is a clear reference to "the letter" of the law, from which we've been delivered and "newness of spirit" in which we should serve.

And Christ's extention to the spirituality of the law is another support for this shift from the letter to the spirit: OT to NT thinking if you will.

"Newness of spirit" is referring to us being a new creation, in our spirit, by the Spirit of God.

 

[godrulz]

How do you describe Jesus' clarification of the law being more than physical acts of adultery and murder (lust and hate)? It is not my intent to make a big doctrine of 'spirit of the law'. It is just a general phrase contrasting the true intent of the law with a legalistic interpretation (Jews added hundreds of little laws to the original laws of God...they could not even brush their teeth on the Sabbath...Jesus showed them the 'spirit'/intent of the law in contrast to their wooden legalism/literalism).

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by godrulz

How do you describe Jesus' clarification of the law being more than physical acts of adultery and murder (lust and hate)? It is not my intent to make a big doctrine of 'spirit of the law'. It is just a general phrase contrasting the true intent of the law with a legalistic interpretation (Jews added hundreds of little laws to the original laws of God...they could not even brush their teeth on the Sabbath...Jesus showed them the 'spirit'/intent of the law in contrast to their wooden legalism/literalism).

Get a clue.:doh:

The intent of the law was to show us that we are unrigtheous. And the intent of the Spirit is to make us righteous, apart from the law. You are intentionally missing our points because you are too stubborn to admit you might be wrong.

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by lighthouse

You are intentionally missing our points because you are too stubborn to admit you might be wrong.

Stubborn?

How about self-righteous pride and an inimitable hatred for the truth.

 

[godrulz]

Originally posted by lighthouse

Get a clue.:doh:

The intent of the law was to show us that we are unrigtheous. And the intent of the Spirit is to make us righteous, apart from the law. You are intentionally missing our points because you are too stubborn to admit you might be wrong.

I have stated that the law is a school teacher that brings us to Christ (Paul's imagery). I said that it condemns, not saves us. I have said the Spirit transforms us into the image of Christ. Where do we differ on these points?

 

[godrulz]

Originally posted by Sozo

Stubborn?

How about self-righteous pride and an inimitable hatred for the truth.

You know I love truth. You assume that your phraseology is divine revelation. If I seem to disagree with you on minor points, that does not mean I hate truth. It just means there is more to the story in my mind or I need clarification on what you are trying to say. Who is proud? The one who thinks he is perfect and correct on every point.
Can one not dialogue on share ideas without being called proud and stubborn? More ad hominem attacks. Deal with the issues instead of making everything a personal attack.

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by godrulz

I have stated that the law is a school teacher that brings us to Christ (Paul's imagery). I said that it condemns, not saves us. I have said the Spirit transforms us into the image of Christ. Where do we differ on these points?

We don't.

But that's not what we're discussing.

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by godrulz

You know I love truth. You assume that your phraseology is divine revelation. If I seem to disagree with you on minor points, that does not mean I hate truth. It just means there is more to the story in my mind or I need clarification on what you are trying to say. Who is proud? The one who thinks he is perfect and correct on every point.
Can one not dialogue on share ideas without being called proud and stubborn? More ad hominem attacks. Deal with the issues instead of making everything a personal attack.

We've clarified, over and over again. And you're too stubborn to give it any thought.

 

[godrulz]

Originally posted by lighthouse

We've clarified, over and over again. And you're too stubborn to give it any thought.

Stubborn? Maybe stupid. Or maybe you are not communicating with clarity?

 

[Lawless]

Quote godrulz:

God is the Moral Governor of the universe. He is the source of moral laws. The Law did not come from man or Satan. The law's relationship to grace must be clearly defined. We are not saved by the law, nor are we to be lawless (unless you are called Lawless).

Stubborn? Maybe stupid. Or maybe you are not communicating with clarity?

Speaking of communicating with clarity........ I quote from your post above! " ( unless you are called Lawless)"

Are you referring to me? If so, could you communicate with more clarity.

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by godrulz

God is the Moral Governor of the universe. He is the source of moral laws.

Has there always been the Law, godrulz? What relationship does God have with the Law?

 

[godrulz]

Originally posted by Lawless

Quote godrulz:



Speaking of communicating with clarity........ I quote from your post above! " ( unless you are called Lawless)"

Are you referring to me? If so, could you communicate with more clarity.

I was referring to you as a joke. You previously said, hey, I'm 'lawless'. Why do you call yourself that?

 

[godrulz]

Originally posted by Sozo

Has there always been the Law, godrulz? What relationship does God have with the Law?

Lex rex or Rex lex? Does the King submit to right laws or does He make arbitrary laws because He is a powerful King and can do what he wants (good and bad). God does that which is inherently right and consistent with His holiness, righteousness, and love.

It depends how you define law or which category of laws we refer to.

The Mosaic Law was given in space-time history by God to Moses (there has not always been the Mosaic law). Ceremonial laws were given to Israel over a period of time. The law of gravity started at creation, probably. The law of cause and effect, second law of thermodynamics, traffic laws, etc. were not from eternity.

God's moral laws are based on His character and attributes. They are wise and absolute.

God is the Lawgiver. He provides sanctions for those who break the law (or else they are mere, relative suggestions). He uses the Law to condemn us and break our hearts in conviction of sin. It drives us to the Savior and His grace. The Law does not save us. We cannot keep the Law perfectly, but we can choose to not murder and commit adultery. Because is goes beyond the act to our motives and thoughts, we all fall short of the glory of God.

In the OT, He blessed obedience and cursed disobedience. In the New Covenant, the laws are written on hearts of flesh rather than tablets of stone. They can be summarized as love God supremely and others equal to ourselves (Jesus).

Human civil and relationship laws were added as needed.

The law that God submits to is the law of love. He seeks to glorify Himself and bring the greatest good to Himself and others. He is not arbitrary in His love or laws.

You are probably referring strictly to OT laws. The word 'law' can be used in a more general sense.

 

[Lighthouse]

Originally posted by godrulz

Lex rex or Rex lex? Does the King submit to right laws or does He make arbitrary laws because He is a powerful King and can do what he wants (good and bad). God does that which is inherently right and consistent with His holiness, righteousness, and love.

It depends how you define law or which category of laws we refer to.

The Mosaic Law was given in space-time history by God to Moses (there has not always been the Mosaic law). Ceremonial laws were given to Israel over a period of time. The law of gravity started at creation, probably. The law of cause and effect, second law of thermodynamics, traffic laws, etc. were not from eternity.

Stick to the subject. Pay attention to the context. You know what law Sozo was referring to. And which ones he wasn't referring to.

In the New Covenant, the laws are written on hearts of flesh rather than tablets of stone.

Ummm, no. Not on our hearts of flesh [metaphorical, or physical]. On the heart [metaphorical] of our spirits.

 

[Lawless]

I was referring to you as a joke. You previously said, hey, I'm 'lawless'. Why do you call yourself that?

I see...:chuckle: I was joking also when you said " we should not be lawless" so I responded with " I am Lawless".....Humor only....didn't really have anything else to do with the context at hand.

Well.....One callsign is as good as any other I would guess,unless it be offensive or obscene. I can understand though how some may need a explanation as to it's meaning....lol! I wouldn't want any one to think I am actually " Lawless". I definitly believe in law and order, and really don't think we have enough of it today' in this great nation of ours. I think in a lot of ways our Justice system and courts of law are broken. Abortion is just one example of many.

I am just a simple man saved by the blood Jesus, dead to the Law of the old Covenant. .........thus....." Lawless".....Or at least that was what was on my mind when I signed in to TOL...

I never introducted myself here at TOL, just kinda stumbled on to it from a link somewhere, if I remember correctly. I mostly enjoy reading some of the threads here not really much of a debater. I speak of Jesus to anyone whenever I can. I came to know Jesus through reading of the word motivated from a desire to search for answers.

I presently live in Kentucky, have a wife, one daughter,I am a Retired firefighter..........and probably told ya more then you want to know!!.......lol! Anyway, Just my way of saying hello to everyone!

 

[Lighthouse]

:wave2:, Lawless!

 

[Lawless]

:wave: .......Lighthouse!