keypurr
Well-known member
Your words, not mine.
The image of God is not God any more than the image in your mirrors is you.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
The Trinity
- Thread starter Bright Raven
- Start date
The image of God is not God any more than the image in your mirrors is you.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
keypurr
Well-known member
This being was made a little lower than the angels when it became flesh. This being dwelled in the body provided for it in Heb 10:5. RD, you need to see God as a spirit and his true son as a spirit too.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
Not your Spirit thank you. You believe in two Gods.
keypurr
Well-known member
Nope, it is not me that has more than one God.
Only YHWH is God, Christ is his son.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
Rosenritter
New member
Show me where "first and the last" is used for "the Father" in the Old Testament. You might want to start with showing where "the Father" is in the old testament as a warm-up. Do you mean this reference?
Isaiah 9:6 KJV
(6) For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Can you show me where the following passages say "the Father?" The only way I can figure you can make that link is the child = the mighty God and the everlasting Father (Isaiah 9:6 above), then the LORD is God (Genesis 2:4 and others).
Isaiah 41:4 KJV (4) Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he.
Isaiah 44:6 KJV (6) Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
Isaiah 48:12 KJV (12) Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last.
Rosenritter
New member
And your recent denials do not make it any less true. You defined heretic as teaching something not from the bible. You are teaching something not from the bible. Your definition of heretic condemns you just the same. It's back in the thread posts. I'm not going to weary myself with posting the same over and over again.
Which is not the definition of Trinity doctrine, and not what you were teaching on this thread.
Yes, I believe that is essentially Jesus (God in one form) addressing himself in another form. Given that Jesus did sometimes speak in terms hard to understand (see John 6:41, "I am the bread which came down from heaven", John 6:54 "Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life...") this seems far more plausible than that Jesus meant something completely opposite when he says,
Mark 12:29 KJV
(29) And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
Your theory requires paradox that one no longer equals one but rather equals three. My understanding allows that God can be in more than one place at the same time, or even speak to himself (or in the third person) for the benefit of others that are listening.
Glad to see that you have mastered the wisdom from above.
James 3:15-18 KJV
(15) This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
(16) For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.
(17) But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
(18) And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
Rosenritter
New member
Keypurr,
Jesus himself said that you should only worship the Lord your God, see Matthew 4:10 KVJ and Luke 4:8 KJV.
Yet we have instances where people worshiped Jesus and we know this because it is recorded for us in the gospels. Do you have any instance in the gospel where it says that Jesus worshiped someone or anyone else, including "God?" Because it seems a little suspicious that such evidence would be lacking, considering it records Jesus accepting worship from men and angels.
Matthew 8:2 KJV
(2) And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.
Matthew 9:18 KJV
(18) While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live.
Matthew 14:33 KJV
(33) Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
Matthew 15:25 KJV
(25) Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.
Matthew 28:9 KJV
(9) And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.
Matthew 28:17 KJV
(17) And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.
Hebrews 1:6 KJV
(6) And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
There's seven passages from one gospel and Hebrews ascribing worship to Jesus. According to your theory, Jesus should reject worship and instead tell them to worship another.
Acts 10:25-26 KJV
(25) And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him.
(26) But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man.
Revelation 19:10 KJV
(10) And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
That's sort of fatal for your "Jesus was not God" theory. Difficult, to say the least. Must you hang onto that?
Rosenritter
New member
Or, how about, God is a spirit, his express image was himself manifest in the flesh. I myself am flesh, my express image is manifest in this thread. One me, one true form, but the other is no less me and although with limited power certainly not someone different.
CherubRam
New member
[FONT="]First and Last[/FONT]
[FONT="]Isaiah 41:4[/FONT]
[FONT="]4 Who has done this and carried it through,
calling forth the generations from the beginning?
I, (the Lord / Yahwah)—with the first of them
and with the last—I am he.” [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Isaiah 44:6[/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]“This is what (the Lord / Yahwah) says— Israel’s King and Redeemer, (the Lord / Yahwah) Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Isaiah 48:12[/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]“Listen to me, Jacob, Israel, whom I have called: I am he; I am the first and I am the last.[/FONT]
[FONT="]Isaiah 48 is Yahwah – interpreted as “The Lord.”[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Here is the correct translation.[/FONT]
[FONT="]Isaiah 9:6[/FONT]
[FONT="]For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: And the government shall be upon his shoulders: And he shall be called Wonderful Counselor of the Mighty God and Everlasting Father; [/FONT][FONT="](שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
At least you have that part right.
lifeisgood
New member
You reject what God said.
The Father said
Psalm 102:25-27King James Version (KJV)
25 Of old hast thou laid the foundation of the earth: and the heavens are the work of thy hands.
26 They shall perish, but thou shalt endure: yea, all of them shall wax old like a garment; as a vesture shalt thou change them, and they shall be changed:
27 But thou art the same, and thy years shall have no end.
The Father said of His Son, Jesus Christ:
Hebrews 1:11-12King James Version (KJV)
10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;
12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.
Right Divider
Body part
You're as stubborn as a mule and dumb as a rock.
Hebrews does NOT say that Jesus was MADE the "EXPRESS IMAGE OF HIS PERSON" (speaking of God), It says that He IS (BEING) the "express image of His person".
Is says BEING and NOT MADE.
You keep trying to ISOLATE the English word IMAGE which is NOT THERE.
keypurr
Well-known member
Nope, I do not reject any verse. Christ was given the fullness of his God. God created all through his son Christ. But that does not mean Christ is God. Only the Father (YHWH) is God.
Do not assume that Christ truly equal to his creator. Christ is created, he is the express image of his creator. Jesus is the body that Christ came to dwell in. The spirit son took the form of a human. God's spirit son became one with his flesh son. It was then God said that this was his don.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
keypurr
Well-known member
Jesus is not the express image for Jesus a man, however the spirit that dwelled him is the express image.
God is a spirit, his exact image has to be a spirit also. That is the point overlooked by most, including myself for many years. That is the key to understanding who Jesus Christ our Lord really is.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
Right Divider
Body part
That is a LIE. I said that a heretic teaches something that OPPOSES what the Bible teaches. Or I guess that all authors of car repair manuals are heretics.
LIE #2 for this post, your're off to a great start.
Since you've misrepresented what I said, you're up to your neck in it.
Thanks for exposing your heretical doctrine. That's pure Gnosticism.
Go study up on the Hebrew word used for ONE in that QUOTE from Deut 6:4. You might (should, but maybe not) learn that it is a one of UNITY and not ABSOLUTELY SINGULARITY. But that's probably above your pay grade.
More of the typical false accusations and "teaching". I guess it's a great benefit that God pretends to be more than one person, but really is not.
Please give us a whole new thread about how the Father and the Son love each other, but it's really just God loving Himself.
It is you that must make something as clear as "thine own self" mean something other than what it clearly means.
keypurr
Well-known member
Why do most on the Greek to English translators disagree with you on this verse?
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
Right Divider
Body part
They don't.
keypurr
Well-known member
Yes they do, I posted them for you to see.
Count them that translate as Image.
The others agree also.
Some use exact image.
.
Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app
Right Divider
Body part
You're really got a get a grip old man.
The Greek PHRASE is saying that He IS GOD and not some "photo copied" God.
You're totally hung up on an ENGLISH word that is not there.
Why have you yet to explain what happened to that poor man spirit that was IN Jesus before this "photo copied image" TOOK OVER that body?