ECT The sixty nine weeks of Daniel 9:25

ThreeAngels

New member
The time of the Gentiles came forth, an age (Church age) that was for the Gentiles to take the Gospel unto all the world while the Jewish Nation was dispersed unto all the world, just as Ezekiel prophesied. Then the question becomes, Can these bones Live again ? Answer, yes, God brought Israel back from the Nations they were dispersed to, and Israel was born again. That is why the time of Israels "70 WEEKS" was no more. And by the way, it is not actually 70 weeks per se, it is "Seventy Sevens", which implies no uninterrupted prophecy, but only implies Seventy Sevens or 70 Weeks of coming prophecy, it doesn't imply when they have to happen. How could Israel as a nation go through a prophecy as a nation, if she was no more a nation ?

As soon as the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled, and the Church is Raptured, then Israel will go through the 70th Week, which is designed to bring Israel to repentance and unto their Messiah Jesus, Elijah will turn Israel back unto God before the Day of the Lord (Malachi 4:5-6). The Tribulation is designed for Israel, not the church. Thus there was NO PAUSE per se, because there was no Prophecy that ever suggested the Seventy Sevens would be a consecutive prophecy, its a misconception by men.

The church is Israel. The two are not separate. During the Old Testament dispensation, Israel was the church. Israel according to the flesh rejected the Messiah and He also rejected them. Jesus said to the Jews, "Your house is left unto you desolate," Matthew 23:38. Now not all the professed believers are reckoned Israel, but only those that have the sign between them and God. And this is the sign,even the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. See Exodus 31:12-13, "The Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily My Sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you" . Here the Sabbath is clearly defined as a sign between God and His people.
 

Rondonmonson

New member
The church is Israel. The two are not separate. During the Old Testament dispensation, Israel was the church. Israel according to the flesh rejected the Messiah and He also rejected them. Jesus said to the Jews, "Your house is left unto you desolate," Matthew 23:38. Now not all the professed believers are reckoned Israel, but only those that have the sign between them and God. And this is the sign,even the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. See Exodus 31:12-13, "The Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily My Sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you" . Here the Sabbath is clearly defined as a sign between God and His people.

Replacement theology is just so wrong and off kilter:

The "original Covenant was not the Law it was the Promise to Abraham of a coming "SEED" that would wipe away our sins. Then you have Jeremiah saying to Israel that God would write the Laws on their Hearts in the last days.

All Israel being Saved doesn't mean all people of Israel will be saved, it means Israel as a Nation turns back to God. There are now Messianic Jews, always have been some here an there, most who live in Israel and turn to Chris Jesus are castigated by their families, they are despised and hated. Jews do not hate Christians per se, they hate other Jews who become Christians. This is what Paul meant by "All Israel" will be saved. He is speaking about that day that the nation of Israel is turned back unto God. Just as Daniels 70th Week Decree prophesies will happen, just as Zechariah 12:10 prophesies will happen, just as Paul promises will happen, just as many prophets prophesied will happen.

No Law can justify any man/men anywhere. The very reason Israel was considered unjust is because they turned to false gods and didn't keep the Law, which no one can. Israel then refused to accept the Lamb of God, the express image of God, one Jesus Christ, their promised Salvation or coming "SEED". Yeshua (Jesus) means Salvation. So when Paul says all Israel will be saved he is in NO WAY saying that everyone in the "Church" is going to be saved. He is saying Israel as a nation is going to one day turn back unto God, just as Malachi 4:5-6 promises, and in the very passage in which he speaks about this.

Romans 11 starts off with Paul asking the question has Israel been lost, Paul says God forbid, God has kept 7000 men ( I think this represents the fullness of Israel repenting at some point, not 7000 men) who have not bowed the knee to Baal. He then says there is a Remnant according to grace, and that it can never be of works, if so it could not be Grace. Then Paul says God has given Israel the spirit of slumber even unto this Day.....Now 2000 years later even unto this day also. Paul then tells them why Israel was cast aside, it answers everything we need to understand the whereto/wherefore and all the WHYS !!

KEY BELOW.............That solves the question about replacement thology, and finds it wanting.

19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. (Israel and the Gentiles are Two different entities by Paul's own Words)

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

So what does this passage mean/imply ? That Israel (branches) was broken off because of their UNBELIEF and will be Grafted back in when they BELIEVE AGAIN !! BOOM. So when does Israel believe again ? When the Fullness of the Gentiles is come in, PLAIN AS DAY !! And then what happens ? All Israel, or Israel as a Nation repents as a Nation and turns back unto God/Messiah, just as Zechariah 12:10 prophesies.

It is true, all of us are Gods children, in Christ Jesus, BUT for anyone to say that Paul when he said that there is neither Jew nor Greek was referring to the nation of Israel as having no place in future prophecy and is only the "Church" is people ignoring Paul's very words right here in this very passage. He says WHEN THE FULLNESS OF THE GENTILES BE COME IN ! This shows there will be TWO ENTITIES !! All Israel will be Saved, when the Time of the Gentiles is come in.

So Israel is a separate entity from the Gentile nations. We as individuals are all the same, children of Faith/Belief on/in a God who justifies us BY FAITH, but Israel and the Gentile Nations have separate callings, Israel brought forth the Messiah, the Gentile Nations brought forth the Gospel of the Messiah to the World, the Church will be Raptured to Heaven when the Gentiles time has been Fulfilled, then all Israel will be Saved, as a NATION, not all Jews will be saved, that can only happen via Jesus Christs blood. But a large majority of Israel will turn to God, and Israel as a Nation turns back to God. Not ALL ISRAEL Turned from God, there were still Godly men and prophets like Daniel who kept Gods commandments and they were Holy men before God, but ALL ISRAEL turned from God, as a NATION..........And likewise all Israel will turn back unto God in like manner.

Thus ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED.........When they believe in God again as a Nation

Israel is not the Church and the Church is not Israel, its is a MISCONCEPTION of Men.
 

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
The church is Israel. The two are not separate. During the Old Testament dispensation, Israel was the church. Israel according to the flesh rejected the Messiah and He also rejected them. Jesus said to the Jews, "Your house is left unto you desolate," Matthew 23:38. Now not all the professed believers are reckoned Israel, but only those that have the sign between them and God. And this is the sign,even the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. See Exodus 31:12-13, "The Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily My Sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you" . Here the Sabbath is clearly defined as a sign between God and His people.

:chuckle:
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
Why were the Hebrews still labouring to enter into that rest?


Not all believed. There is no automatically all Israel believes, ever. There has always been the fact of the remnant. the 'all Israel' of Rom 11 is the cumulative of all who believe, all through time. They will be justified from their sins. That is what that text means. It does not refer to a land promise, a Davidic theocracy finally.
 

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
Not all believed. There is no automatically all Israel believes, ever. There has always been the fact of the remnant. the 'all Israel' of Rom 11 is the cumulative of all who believe, all through time. They will be justified from their sins. That is what that text means. It does not refer to a land promise, a Davidic theocracy finally.

Hebrews was not written to believers, then?
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
You said the Hebrews were believers.
You can't keep your stories straight?


You're just dishonest and meddlesome. Don't you have something to do in the kingdom? Some Jews are believers some are not. Even then, too. The critical mass of unbelief is what ruined the country in the destruction of Jerusalem.
 

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
You're just dishonest and meddlesome. Don't you have something to do in the kingdom? Some Jews are believers some are not. Even then, too. The critical mass of unbelief is what ruined the country in the destruction of Jerusalem.

Is Hebrews written to believers, or not?
I'm picking your fairy tales apart, by being a stickler for details. Your discombobulation is obvious.
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
This decree to rebuild Jerusalem was given to Ezra (see Ezra 7) by king Artaxerxes in 457 B.C.

Wrong!

That decree was issued in 444 B.C. when it was given to Nehemiah by king Artaxerxes:

"And it came to pass in the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king...And I said unto the king, If it please the king, and if thy servant have found favour in thy sight, that thou wouldest send me unto Judah, unto the city of my fathers' sepulchres, that I may build it...So it pleased the king to send me; and I set him a time"
(Neh.2:1,5-6).​
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
Is Hebrews written to believers, or not?
I'm picking your fairy tales apart, by being a stickler for details. Your discombobulation is obvious.



Name one fairy tale. You're the person who is ignorant of the bone-crushing reality of the DofJ. You are a fairy tale to history. As is 2P2P.

You can congratulate yourself all you want like RD, but what matters (to you) is my feedback. You're a scaredy-hidy amateur who really needs to face the NT realities.
 

ThreeAngels

New member
Wrong!

That decree was issued in 444 B.C. when it was given to Nehemiah by king Artaxerxes:

"And it came to pass in the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king...And I said unto the king, If it please the king, and if thy servant have found favour in thy sight, that thou wouldest send me unto Judah, unto the city of my fathers' sepulchres, that I may build it...So it pleased the king to send me; and I set him a time"
(Neh.2:1,5-6).​
The prophecy of Daniel 9:25 says, "... from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem..." This entails more than just civil works. It also includes a restoration of civil, political, and judicial forms and regulations. A quote from Uriah Smith's book Daniel and the Revelation well describes this, "In 457 B.C., a decree was granted to Ezra by the Persian emperor Artaxerxes Longimanus to go up to Jerusalem with as many of his people as were minded to go with him. The commission granted him an unlimited amount of treasure, to beautify the house of God, to procure offerings for its service, and to do whatever else might seem good unto him. It empowered him to ordain laws, set magistrates and judges, and execute punishment even unto death; in other words, to restore the Jewish state, civil and ecclesiastical, according to the law of God and the ancient customs of that people. Inspiration has seen fit to preserve this decree; and a full and accurate copy of it is given in the seventh chapter of the book of Ezra."
As respecting Nehemiah's work, I'll give another quote from the same work: "Thirteen years after this, in the twentieth year of the same king, B.C.444, Nehemiah sought and obtained permission to go up to Jerusalem. Nehemiah 2. Permission was granted him, but we have no evidence that it was anything more than verbal. It pertained to him individually, nothing being said about others going up with him. The king asked him how long a journey he wished to make, and when he would return. He received letters to the governors beyond the river to help him on his way to Judea, and an order to the keeper of the king's forest for timber for beams, etc. When he arrived at Jerusalem, he found rulers and priests, nobles and people, already engaged in the work of building Jerusalem. Neh.2:16. These were, of 166 course, acting under the decree given to Ezra thirteen years before. And finally, Nehemiah, having arrived at Jerusalem, finished the work he came to accomplish, in fifty-two days. Neh.6:15."
 

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
You can congratulate yourself all you want like RD, but what matters (to you) is my feedback. You're a scaredy-hidy amateur who really needs to face the NT realities.

I suspect you would have called the twelve unlearned fisherman amateurs, and sided with the learned Pharisees.
You would have been one of the ones yelling, "Crucify him"
 
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