turbosixx
New member
I'm curious what you are wanting to get out of this forum?
Standing Up To Rome
- Thread starter WeberHome
- Start date
I'm curious what you are wanting to get out of this forum?
Brother Vinny
Active member
An honorary Lifetime Membership subscription.
Oh, wait, do you mean this particular thread?
I don't know. Certain ideas sit on my mind like wounds that won't scab over properly, and itch at me until I pick at them and yellowish pus drains out and. . ..
Curious. How do you know any of the Bible is Scripture?
turbosixx
New member
No, I meant in general.
Nice mental image.
I have faith that God gave us his word and the bible is it. Nothing else comes close. Everything takes faith, what do we REALLY know.
Cruciform
New member
Agreed. Therefore, the mere fact that something is "written by men" in no way rules out its being infallible and authoritative upon believers.
Brother Vinny
Active member
I don't know. I used to want the best-defended theological Castle from which I could browbeat naysayers. Now I just want to examine what it means to believe.
But. . . why those 66 books? Who are you trusting to have gotten those books right? Did you just come to faith one day and someone said, "Oh yeah, here's a manual. You have to believe all that's in here to fit in?". Or did you read the book in its entirety and weigh the matter for yourself?
I admit, I haven't read the whole thing. I have to take it on faith Isaiah is Scripture, cos it frankly perplexes me. I have to take it on faith Leviticus is Scripture because I have read it, and it is so dull--rule after rule, the bulk of which have nothing to do with Christianity. But I am fascinated by the question of canon, how we got what we got, and it is one of the open sores that won't go away.
MarcATL
New member
Proof positive that you never read, don't believe and/or simply choose to ignore what the Bible teaches.
MarcATL
New member
Why did you leave?
Where did you go to?
What were the offenses that caused you to return?
JonahofAkron
New member
I posted some refutations from a website to answer in kind to Cruciform, but it was to no avail.
"Call no one on earth your father."
WeberHome
New member
-
†. Luke 11:1-2 . . One day Jesus was praying in a certain place. When he
finished, one of his disciples said to him: Lord, teach us to pray, just as John
taught his disciples. He said to them: When you pray, say: Father
There are no instances of the Lord and Master of New Testament
Christianity-- nor of any of the inspired New Testament writers --either
commanding, teaching, encouraging, leading by example, or even so much
as suggesting --that prayer be made to celestial beings and/or deceased
human beings: and for good reason. Christ-- himself a devoted, observant
Jew --never prayed to his mother, nor to celestial beings, nor to deceased
human beings, nor to anybody other than the one true God of the Jews: his
Father.
Since that was the Son's habit (and also his instructions), then that very
same compulsion should be evident in all God's kin since they are supposed
to be recipients of the only begotten Son's filial mentality.
†. Gal 4:6a . . And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the spirit of His
son into your hearts
The nature of a son's spirit is quite a bit different than the nature of a
father's spirit or the nature of a mother's spirit. In particular; Christ's spirit is
the mentality of God's offspring. So that anyone who truly has the Son's
spirit in their hearts should be experiencing the very same personal filial
bond with the Father that Jesus experiences.
Recipients of the spirit of His son are also recipients of another kind of sprit
too.
†. Rom 8:15-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of bondage again to
fear; but you have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we call out: Abba!
Father.
Here's how the spirit of adoption works:
If I were to meet President Barack Hussein Obama, I would have to make an
appointment first; and then stand back and address him as Sir or Mister
President. But his two daughters Sasha and Malia can run right up uninvited
and cling to his arm because he's their father; and they call him daddy.
Now if the Obama's should adopt a little boy some day, he will have all the
very same rights and privileges as the Obama's natural born daughters;
including a right to inherit. Their new son would have every right to run up
uninvited to Mr. Obama yelling: Daddy! Daddy! Daddy! and cling to his other
arm.
In other words: the spirit of adoption imparts to God's legal children a
heartfelt bond with God that enables them to feel the love, and the
friendship, and the security feelings that normal boys and girls feel with their
birth parents.
Some professing Christians think it's disrespectful to regard the Bible's God
as a dad. But that kind of thinking isn't the mentality of a child in the home;
no, that is the mentality of hired hands, and subjects, and vassals, and
slaves. I am none of those; no, I am kin to The King. There's a place of my
own all set around the table in His home waiting for me to arrive.
Do you see now why I cannot pray to Christ's mom? It's just simply
impossible to overcome not only my family ties to Christ's Father, but also
the powerful impulses of the spirit of adoption. The spirit of adoption always
wins out over all other spirits when it comes time for me to pray because it
just naturally compels me to use a vocative to get my adoptive Father's
attention without my even thinking about it.
Adoption severs any and all obligations related to one's biological parents;
and in the eyes of the law, one's adoptive parents are just as "biological" as
the originals. Though I was at one time the son of an earthly father, I am
now the legal son of a celestial father so that Christ is not only my master;
but also my sibling; and in point of fact, since his mom is a Christian, then
she too is my sibling; and all three of us share the same paterfamilias
together.
†. John 20:17 . . Go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my
Father, and unto your Father; and unto my God, and unto your God.
What this all boils down to is that God's kin should feel an overwhelming
compulsion to pray to their adoptive Father without their having to be told
to. It should come naturally (so to speak), just as naturally as it came to
Jesus. And they should feel an equally overwhelming revulsion praying to
somebody else.
So then, people with a habit of praying to celestial beings, and/or ordinary
human beings like Christ's mom and departed saints, obviously have neither
the spirit of God's son in their heart, nor the spirit of adoption. No, the spirit
in their heart compels them to call out to pagan gods.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==
†. Luke 11:1-2 . . One day Jesus was praying in a certain place. When he
finished, one of his disciples said to him: Lord, teach us to pray, just as John
taught his disciples. He said to them: When you pray, say: Father
There are no instances of the Lord and Master of New Testament
Christianity-- nor of any of the inspired New Testament writers --either
commanding, teaching, encouraging, leading by example, or even so much
as suggesting --that prayer be made to celestial beings and/or deceased
human beings: and for good reason. Christ-- himself a devoted, observant
Jew --never prayed to his mother, nor to celestial beings, nor to deceased
human beings, nor to anybody other than the one true God of the Jews: his
Father.
Since that was the Son's habit (and also his instructions), then that very
same compulsion should be evident in all God's kin since they are supposed
to be recipients of the only begotten Son's filial mentality.
†. Gal 4:6a . . And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the spirit of His
son into your hearts
The nature of a son's spirit is quite a bit different than the nature of a
father's spirit or the nature of a mother's spirit. In particular; Christ's spirit is
the mentality of God's offspring. So that anyone who truly has the Son's
spirit in their hearts should be experiencing the very same personal filial
bond with the Father that Jesus experiences.
Recipients of the spirit of His son are also recipients of another kind of sprit
too.
†. Rom 8:15-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of bondage again to
fear; but you have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we call out: Abba!
Father.
Here's how the spirit of adoption works:
If I were to meet President Barack Hussein Obama, I would have to make an
appointment first; and then stand back and address him as Sir or Mister
President. But his two daughters Sasha and Malia can run right up uninvited
and cling to his arm because he's their father; and they call him daddy.
Now if the Obama's should adopt a little boy some day, he will have all the
very same rights and privileges as the Obama's natural born daughters;
including a right to inherit. Their new son would have every right to run up
uninvited to Mr. Obama yelling: Daddy! Daddy! Daddy! and cling to his other
arm.
In other words: the spirit of adoption imparts to God's legal children a
heartfelt bond with God that enables them to feel the love, and the
friendship, and the security feelings that normal boys and girls feel with their
birth parents.
Some professing Christians think it's disrespectful to regard the Bible's God
as a dad. But that kind of thinking isn't the mentality of a child in the home;
no, that is the mentality of hired hands, and subjects, and vassals, and
slaves. I am none of those; no, I am kin to The King. There's a place of my
own all set around the table in His home waiting for me to arrive.
Do you see now why I cannot pray to Christ's mom? It's just simply
impossible to overcome not only my family ties to Christ's Father, but also
the powerful impulses of the spirit of adoption. The spirit of adoption always
wins out over all other spirits when it comes time for me to pray because it
just naturally compels me to use a vocative to get my adoptive Father's
attention without my even thinking about it.
Adoption severs any and all obligations related to one's biological parents;
and in the eyes of the law, one's adoptive parents are just as "biological" as
the originals. Though I was at one time the son of an earthly father, I am
now the legal son of a celestial father so that Christ is not only my master;
but also my sibling; and in point of fact, since his mom is a Christian, then
she too is my sibling; and all three of us share the same paterfamilias
together.
†. John 20:17 . . Go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my
Father, and unto your Father; and unto my God, and unto your God.
What this all boils down to is that God's kin should feel an overwhelming
compulsion to pray to their adoptive Father without their having to be told
to. It should come naturally (so to speak), just as naturally as it came to
Jesus. And they should feel an equally overwhelming revulsion praying to
somebody else.
So then, people with a habit of praying to celestial beings, and/or ordinary
human beings like Christ's mom and departed saints, obviously have neither
the spirit of God's son in their heart, nor the spirit of adoption. No, the spirit
in their heart compels them to call out to pagan gods.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==
why do you think that is so important?
turbosixx
New member
I haven't read it word for word but I've been a Christian for over 30 years and know it fairly well. I mostly focus on the NT because that is what we live under today.
I believe the OT was kept intact by the Jews over the years. As for the NT, I have faith that God guided it's formation as well as it's writing. Those that put it together did their best to make sure only inspired writers were included. Everything seems to harmonize.
If we don't believe it to be God's inspired writtings, what other options do we have?
Cruciform
New member
Post your proof for this entirely unsubstantiated assertion.
Cruciform
New member
I posted some refutations from a website to answer in kind to JonahofAkron, but it was to no avail.
turbosixx
New member
He doesn't read the bible because he can't understand it. Just ask him.
Cruciform
New member
Straw Man Fallacy. Try again.
turbosixx
New member
Isn't that what your saying here? Only "the church" can understand scripture.
After thinking about this question I choose #3, individuals.