Self Introduction

[Alexis Georg Hoen]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

 

[patrick jane]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

Welcome to TOL. Early on here I started a thread called SELF - Selfishness. I think all sin can be traced back to selfishness, in fact every sin is for self. I hope you enjoy your activity here -

I believe Jesus paid for our sins, the Bible tells us

 

[Tambora]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

Welcome to TOL.

The Passover Lamb was to save the firstborn only from death.
There was no Passover lamb on the Day of Atonement feast.

 

[Rusha]

Welcome to TOL.

 

[intojoy]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

Heresy


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[Town Heretic]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

Welcome, from the resident attorney at large here. Not many academics about the joint, but any number of people with serious chops, theologically, lettered and not so. I don't think we're going to have a meeting of minds on Christ and the point of the cross, but if you learn to tune out the minority of loud, angry voices you'll find an interesting community with more than a few opinions worth considering.

:cheers:

 

[Learnerboy]

Your thoughts are IMO not really biblical but I should be interested to know your reasons for your belief more fully. Thanks

 

[Alexis Georg Hoen]

I realize that according to St. Paul's interpretation Jesus paid for our sins with his death. But I think that assuming such a vicarious payment as if it were a monetary debt is not necessary. Through giving up his selfish self Jesus shows us a way out of sin and death.

 

[Alexis Georg Hoen]

Yes, from the standpoint of the Church it is heresy, but that does not mean it is wrong.

 

[Alexis Georg Hoen]

I neither want nor can disprove the traditional view that Adam committed an "original sin" which we inherit, and that Jesus came down from heaven and died for our sins. I simply offer an alternate view that does not require blind faith. There is no compelling reason to believe in an original sin of disobedience but there is an obvious dilemma of wanting to serve God's creation and other beings in general but being able to do so only as an individual being, thus necessarily being opposed to something or somebody in our environment, the dilemma of being "a part and apart." Through teaching love and ultimately self-sacrifice, Jesus shows us a way out of that dilemma, as the sacrificial lamb was a means to escape Egypt, a symbol of sin and death.

 

[patrick jane]

Payment for my sins by another human being contradicts my sense of justice. Jesus himself does not identify with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement, but with the Passover Lamb that was not a payment for sins but a ticket out of Egypt, i.e. sin and death.

:nono: You're lost -

 

[Town Heretic]

Payment for my sins by another human being contradicts my sense of justice.

It should. It isn't just. It was something else. It's just that we are as separate from the perfect as our willful actions make us.

The cross is an intersection where that justice meets an equally perfect love, which is sacrificial in nature (see: greater love hath). Grace is the result.

 

[Nameless.In.Grace]

Payment for my sins by another human being contradicts my sense of justice. Jesus himself does not identify with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement, but with the Passover Lamb that was not a payment for sins but a ticket out of Egypt, i.e. sin and death.

Hebrew 2:14

For this reason he had to be made like them, fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.

Sent from my HTC One M9 using TheologyOnline mobile app

 

[Nameless.In.Grace]

I am a retired physician. I am a Roman Catholic. I am joining Theology on Line because my ideas of Christianity are not orthodox and I am anxious to discuss them with an interested audience. Two days ago when I joined I posted my views on Jesus's sacrifice viewing it not as a payment for our sins but rather an example of escaping from sin and death by giving up the selfish "self." I base this view on the body of Jesus's teaching and on the fact that he identifies with the Passover lamb and not with the "bulls and goats" sacrificed on the Day of Atonement.

Bulls blood = temporary fix.

God's blood = Permanent fix.

"Behold the Lamb if God, who takes away all the sin of the world.

According to the book of John, what is the sin of the world?

If you get this one, I have one more for you.

Hebrew 2:14

For this reason he had to be made like them, fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.

Sent from my HTC One M9 using TheologyOnline mobile app

Sent from my HTC One M9 using TheologyOnline mobile app

 

[Nameless.In.Grace]

:nono: You're lost -

But very findable as long as certain individuals don't get their hooks in.

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[patrick jane]

But very findable as long as certain individuals don't get their hooks in.

Sent from my HTC One M9 using TheologyOnline mobile app

True

 

[Alexis Georg Hoen]

Please see my edited statement of "yesterday 3 pm."

 

[Town Heretic]

Please see my edited statement of "yesterday 3 pm."

You're new, but if you use the quote function and reply to specific posts you'll avoid a lot of confusion on who you're speaking to at the time...like now.