ECT Patrick Cronin

[Patrick Cronin]

I have noticed that the vast majority of the posts on this site operate on the assumption that Christianity and the Bible are virtually synonymous. Yet the posts also show that there is disagreement over the interpretation of every scripture text. Surely you must suspect that there is something wrong about this approach, because we (almost) all believe that Jesus Christ came to reveal the truth to the world about God, about removing evil from Creation and about human destiny.
Let us ask ourselves who is the arbiter who can tell us the truth? When we consider that the first three hundred years of the preaching of the gospel of Christ was done without the aid of the written New Testament Scriptures. This was spectacularly successful- so what means did they have of knowing the truth in the absence of the written gospels? If we are believers it we know that the original source of truth cannot have been lost, because jesus promised that it would persevere until the end of time. Where is it? PATRICK CRONIN

 

[God's Truth]

I have noticed that the vast majority of the posts on this site operate on the assumption that Christianity and the Bible are virtually synonymous. Yet the posts also show that there is disagreement over the interpretation of every scripture text. Surely you must suspect that there is something wrong about this approach, because we (almost) all believe that Jesus Christ came to reveal the truth to the world about God, about removing evil from Creation and about human destiny.
Let us ask ourselves who is the arbiter who can tell us the truth? When we consider that the first three hundred years of the preaching of the gospel of Christ was done without the aid of the written New Testament Scriptures. This was spectacularly successful- so what means did they have of knowing the truth in the absence of the written gospels? If we are believers it we know that the original source of truth cannot have been lost, because jesus promised that it would persevere until the end of time. Where is it? PATRICK CRONIN

What do you mean by saying the first three hundred years there was no written gospel?

The churches shared the books, and the rest of the scriptures are letters that the churches also shared.

 

[Danoh]

What do you mean by saying the first three hundred years there was no written gospel?

The churches shared the books, and the rest of the scriptures are letters that the churches also shared.

Yep :thumb:

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Daniel 9:2 In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.

2 Timothy 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

And that's just the tip of all that Scripture says about this.

Pointed conceded, GT.

 

[God's Truth]

Yep :thumb:

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Daniel 9:2 In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.

2 Timothy 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

And that's just the tip of all that Scripture says about this.

Pointed conceded, GT.

I am not quite sure, but I think you are complementing me.

That is true, the New Testament is the Old Testament fulfilled. However, the Books Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were shared by the churches, and so were all the letters.

Colossians 4:16 After this letter has been read to you, see that it is also read in the church of the Laodiceans and that you in turn read the letter from Laodicea.

1 Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read to all the brothers and sisters.

 

[musterion]

Since you concede the Truth can't have been lost, you are not Mormon.

Where is it?

Let me guess...Rome?

 

[Interplanner]

I am not quite sure, but I think you are complementing me.

That is true, the New Testament is the Old Testament fulfilled. However, the Books Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were shared by the churches, and so were all the letters.

Colossians 4:16 After this letter has been read to you, see that it is also read in the church of the Laodiceans and that you in turn read the letter from Laodicea.

1 Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read to all the brothers and sisters.

...and the best manuscripts on Ephesians have a blank at 1:1 for the destination. That means it was copied many times and circulated widely, almost a 'publication.'

 

[Truster]

I have noticed that the vast majority of the posts on this site operate on the assumption that Christianity and the Bible are virtually synonymous. Yet the posts also show that there is disagreement over the interpretation of every scripture text. Surely you must suspect that there is something wrong about this approach, because we (almost) all believe that Jesus Christ came to reveal the truth to the world about God, about removing evil from Creation and about human destiny.
Let us ask ourselves who is the arbiter who can tell us the truth? When we consider that the first three hundred years of the preaching of the gospel of Christ was done without the aid of the written New Testament Scriptures. This was spectacularly successful- so what means did they have of knowing the truth in the absence of the written gospels? If we are believers it we know that the original source of truth cannot have been lost, because jesus promised that it would persevere until the end of time. Where is it? PATRICK CRONIN

All those that are predetermined to eternal life will be brought to a saving knowledge of the truth. They will then be despised and hated by the unredeemed, unregenerate and uninspired denominational false worshipers.

"That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them".

 

[God's Truth]

All those that are predetermined to eternal life will be brought to a saving knowledge of the truth. They will then be despised and hated by the unredeemed, unregenerate and uninspired denominational false worshipers.

"That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them".

You are using a scripture that was at a time when God cut off and hardened people when Jesus walked the earth so that those who already belonged to God could be saved first...why not? They are the people who waited for the Messiah.

When Jesus was crucified, then all could come to him to be saved, even those Jews who rejected him.

Please ask me for the scriptures if you do not recognize what I am saying as coming from the scriptures.

 

[God's Truth]

...and the best manuscripts on Ephesians have a blank at 1:1 for the destination. That means it was copied many times and circulated widely, almost a 'publication.'

That is very interesting. More proof that the believers from the beginning used these books and letters from the start. That is what determined these books as scripture.

 

[God's Truth]

Since you concede the Truth can't have been lost, you are not Mormon.



Let me guess...Rome?

I think you are right about that, because he said three hundred years since the New Testament was written, because Catholics think that they gave us the scriptures instead of the books and letters being accepted as scripture from the beginning is what declared them as scripture.

 

[musterion]

I think you are right about that, because he said three hundred years since the New Testament was written, because Catholics think that they gave us the scriptures instead of the books and letters being accepted as scripture from the beginning is what declared them as scripture.

This, while a false claim, is indeed a giveaway...

...the first three hundred years of the preaching of the gospel of Christ was done without the aid of the written New Testament Scriptures. This was spectacularly successful

 

[Danoh]

I am not quite sure, but I think you are complementing me.

That is true, the New Testament is the Old Testament fulfilled. However, the Books Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were shared by the churches, and so were all the letters.

Colossians 4:16 After this letter has been read to you, see that it is also read in the church of the Laodiceans and that you in turn read the letter from Laodicea.

1 Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read to all the brothers and sisters.

Compl-e-ment, your above, yes.

Agree with, and add to a thing where it is sound, yes.

Compl-i-ment, you, no.

Neither I, nor you, are the issue.

To concede a point is to give in, in agreement with a point; to concede that it is a valid point.

And to concede a point is to agree with that particular point alone.

It does not mean that the person conceding said point agrees with every other point ever made by the person who's one point, one is agreeing with.

You get something right every now and then.

I conceded you got that one right.

Keeps me ever free from ending up unable to learn even from someone I might normally disagree with on other points.

I conceded you got that one right.

As anyone who invests as much time in those parts of Scripture as you apparantly do, every now and then will...get one thing or another right - those simpler things that do not call for more the more complex principles of study, simply because they are so plain as day, as is.

No, I was not compl- i-menting...you.

Christ ALONE is the issue.

 

[Danoh]

I think you are right about that, because he said three hundred years since the New Testament was written, because Catholics think that they gave us the scriptures instead of the books and letters being accepted as scripture from the beginning is what declared them as scripture.

:thumb:

You're on a row.

That's it - often, it's those things that differ that allow seeing a thing beyond its' seeming first impression.

 

[God's Truth]

Compl-e-ment, your above, yes.

Agree with, and add to a thing where it is sound, yes.

Compl-i-ment, you, no.

Neither I, nor you, are the issue.

To concede a point is to give in, in agreement with a point; to concede that it is a valid point.

And to concede a point is to agree with that particular point alone.

It does not mean that the person conceding said point agrees with every other point ever made by the person who's one point, one is agreeing with.

You get something right every now and then.

I conceded you got that one right.

Keeps me ever free from ending up unable to learn even from someone I might normally disagree with on other points.

I conceded you got that one right.

As anyone who invests as much time in those parts of Scripture as you apparantly do, every now and then will...get one thing or another right - those simpler things that do not call for more the more complex principles of study, simply because they are so plain as day, as is.

No, I was not compl- i-menting...you.

Christ ALONE is the issue.

So then, I was right after all, even in my mistake.

 

[musterion]

So Paddy, are you Cath'lic, me boyo?