Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God

[TrevorL]

Greetings again God's Truth,

Except that the Bible calls Jesus the King of kings, and Jesus is sitting on the Father's throne.

Jesus was invited to sit down on the right hand of God His father in His throne Psalm 110:1. Jesus is the Son of God. Jesus will sit upon the throne of David in the Kingdom Isaiah 2:1-4, Acts 3:19-21.
Revelation 3:21 (KJV): To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[God's Truth]

No more curse in need of sacrifices...but a throne of Yah and of the Lamb Rev 22:3 again NO MENTION of where the Holy Spirit sits...

Why do you keep saying such things about the Holy Spirit? What is your point?

By the way, did you forget that we are discussing together because you wrongly said Jesus didn’t change the old law?

 

[Aimiel]

Greetings again Apple7,Another example of your method and unusual reasoning. I even doubt that many Trinitarians would agree with you here. Was the Shekinah glory in the Tabernacle actually Jesus in disguise?

Kind regards
Trevor

Had to be: God shares His Glory with NO ONE. Jesus spoke about having His Glory before the world was. Their Glory is The Same. They are God. He is ONE.

 

[God's Truth]

“celebrate the festival with the new unleavened bread of spirit and truth”...all Nations will celebrate feast of tabernacles...Zech 14:16

Makes sense the other festivals throughout His year are observed as memorials...

Certainly ALL flesh will worship from Sabbath to Sabbath...Is 66:23

Sabbath being instituted BEFORE the fall even...you know as part of the lifestyle of living with “I AM” it’s what He DOES...and we were made in His image...not just to look like but behave like Him...

citation needed...you mean “observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you”?

All the special days are about Jesus. We don’t have to observe special days anymore, we have to observe Jesus all day every day.

and when was this new contract written? This last will and testament? Before He was killed, as in during His life as He lived and taught as an example for us to follow? Or AFTER the death of the testator?

The new covenant went into effect at the death of the Testator...is why they hurried to bury Him before the Sabbath started...the first full day of the New Covenant Age...just like the first full day of the Edenic covenant...neat eh?

Then why are you going against me for saying Jesus made a new covenant?

Yup...is why He became the High Priest because all other high priests were NOT IMMORTAL...so the law to administer the ETERNAL LAW had to be changed back for Him to be the first and last administrator of it...

What?

The Law of administration was changed...the law of the ministration of death its curse...not the Law which describes the life with “I AM”

There is a new law, a new covenant, new rules and guidelines, a last will and testament.

The IMMUTABLE Law...is my delight...do this and live...if you love Him

Jesus did change the law. No more eye for eye and hand for hand and foot for foot. No more stoning to death for some sins. No more cut off without mercy. It is a faith based law. No more purification works. No more go to a temple.

Here are they that keep it...and the faith OF Yahushua...not just IN HIM...but HIS FAITH walk...

“Blessed are those who do His commandments that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city...” Rev 22:14

Be righteous still be holy still...that we might reign forever and ever...

We are warned about a bitter root which defiles many.

Hebrews 12:15 See to it that no one falls short of the grace of God and that no bitter root grows up to cause trouble and defile many.

Do you know what that means?

I do, but I want to see if you do.

 

[God's Truth]

Of course I have. Which one do you deny?
1) The heavens and the earth before the Flood.
2) The heavens and the earth which are now.
3) The NEW heavens and the earth which follow the radical "global warming" God has planned.

You haven't proven it. How many times has heaven and earth fled away? Never, not yet it hasn't, but it will.

 

[God's Truth]

Greetings again God's Truth,Jesus was invited to sit down on the right hand of God His father in His throne Psalm 110:1. Jesus is the Son of God. Jesus will sit upon the throne of David in the Kingdom Isaiah 2:1-4, Acts 3:19-21.
Revelation 3:21 (KJV): To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Kind regards
Trevor

That scripture you quoted proves what I said.

 

[Dartman]

How many times has heaven and earth fled away? Never, not yet it hasn't, but it will.

You realize you are arguing with PETER, right??

2 Peter 3:3-13 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

 

[God's Truth]

You realize you are arguing with PETER, right??

2 Peter 3:3-13 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Prove heaven and earth and fled away twice already.

 

[Apple7]

Was the Shekinah glory in the Tabernacle actually Jesus in disguise?

Kind regards
Trevor

Correct.

 

[Dartman]

Prove heaven and earth and fled away twice already.

You have contrived the whole "fled away" issue.

Re-read the text.

You are asking an inaccurate question.

What PETER states is;
1) the heavens and earth of old PERISHED with water.
2) the heavens and earth WHICH ARE NOW are "reserved unto fire" and they will "melt with fervent heat" and they will "be disolved".
3) the 3rd heavens and earth will NOT pass away.



2 Peter 3:3-13 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness

 

[7djengo7]

You are just proving that you are an idiot!

Hehehe. A little crotchety, eh. Hmmm. I wonder why. Oh, wait...I know why.

Again, why can't you show me a passage of Scripture where God the Father is called "THE ruler of the kings of the earth"?

 

[7djengo7]

I was not making Joseph out to be over Pharaoh,
The passage and everything I said about Pharaoh and Joseph clearly established Pharaoh to be over Joseph and both Joseph and Pharaoh to be over all of Egypt.
In the same way, Paul is clear that God is over Jesus and both God and Jesus reign over the kings of the earth.

Again, why can't you find any passage of Scripture in which God the Father is called "THE ruler of the kings of the earth"?

 

[7djengo7]

The Scriptures ALSO state that each believer has glory before the world existed.

False.

Neither Romans 8, nor 1 Corinthians 2, say that "each believer HAS glory before the world existed", nor that "each believer HAD glory before the world existed".

Perhaps YOUR bible--the bible YOU have been writing--says such asinine things. But God's Bible sure does not!

Inasmuch as there were no men before the world existed, there were no believers before the world existed. Inasmuch as there were no believers before the world existed, there were no believers having glory before the world existed.

 

[7djengo7]

You're being dishonest .... and it appears to be, your intent is just to "Troll".
GO NEVER SAID "equal to Pharaoh" .... that's YOUR twist to his words.
GO DID say BOTH ruled over all Egypt, and as I corrected your previous post, I showed the Scripture stating such.

Here's what genuineoriginal said:

Pharaoh was ruler over all of Egypt when Pharaoh made Joseph the ruler over all of Egypt.
While Joseph was the ruler over all of Egypt, Pharaoh and Joseph were both THE ruler over all of Egypt.
Pharaoh was the ruler over Joseph and all of Egypt and Joseph was the ruler over all of Egypt.

Let's see:

• GO called Joseph "THE ruler of all of Egypt"
• GO called Pharaoh "THE ruler of all of Egypt"

Here's another question for you and GO to stonewall against:

Is THE ruler of all of Egypt EQUAL TO THE ruler of all of Egypt? Yes or No?

 

[God's Truth]

You have contrived the whole "fled away" issue.

Re-read the text.

You are asking an inaccurate question.

What PETER states is;
1) the heavens and earth of old PERISHED with water.
2) the heavens and earth WHICH ARE NOW are "reserved unto fire" and they will "melt with fervent heat" and they will "be disolved".
3) the 3rd heavens and earth will NOT pass away.



2 Peter 3:3-13 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness

You don't understand what I said. You said there is going to be a third new heaven and earth. I said no only a second. You gave scriptures but those scriptures did not prove your beliefs.

Before there is a new heaven and a new earth, this heaven and earth will flee.

Revelation 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.


That never ever happened before, so your 3rd new heaven and earth does not make sense.

 

[7djengo7]

For example, Jesus answered their charge of blasphemy in John 10:30-36, but you seem to align yourself with their perspective.

Of WHAT does this "alignment" that you speak of consist?

Are you accusing glorydaz and me of charging Jesus with blasphemy, like the Jews written of in John 10:30-36 KJV charged Jesus with blasphemy?

-OR-​

Are you saying that the Jews written of in John 10:30-36 KJV believed that Jesus is God, like glorydaz and I believe that Jesus is God?

 

[Dartman]

You don't understand what I said. You said there is going to be a third new heaven and earth. I said no only a second. You gave scriptures but those scriptures did not prove your beliefs.

Of course those Scriptures proved my point.

Before there is a new heaven and a new earth, this heaven and earth will flee.

Revelation 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.

That never ever happened before, so your 3rd new heaven and earth does not make sense.

Of course this hasn't happened yet! It WON'T happen until Jesus sits on the great Judgment throne, judging all of mankind for his God ..... MORE THAN 1,000 years from now.
We are living in the 2nd heavens and earth right now, according to Peter.
The 1st was destroyed by water, the NEW (3rd) heavens and earth will replace THIS (2nd) heavens and earth AFTER the lake of fire.

 

[glorydaz]

Greetings again glorydaz and 7djengo7,You cannot prove that “Holy Holy Holy” is speaking of the Trinity. Actually Isaiah 6 is one of my favourite chapters, and I am disappointed that you use this chapter in support of the Trinity, and are most probably unwilling to discuss this remarkable chapter that is quoted in the NT in interesting ways and contexts a number of times.
For example, Jesus answered their charge of blasphemy in John 10:30-36, but you seem to align yourself with their perspective.

I would be interested in how both of you, glorydaz and 7djengo7 understand the following, but from my perspective this teaches that Yahweh Psalm 8:1, that is God the Father (compare Psalm 110:1) crowned Jesus the Son of God with glory and honour.
Psalm 8:4–6 (KJV): 4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? 5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour. 6 Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:

Kind regards
Trevor

There is no difficulty for those who understand that our Lord Jesus Christ is both Divine and Human. God became flesh and dwelt among us. Emmanuel, God with us. As long as you cherry pick verses that speak of Christ's humanity, you'll be ignoring the rest of Scripture.

 

[glorydaz]

Of course those Scriptures proved my point.
Of course this hasn't happened yet! It WON'T happen until Jesus sits on the great Judgment throne, judging all of mankind for his God ..... MORE THAN 1,000 years from now.
We are living in the 2nd heavens and earth right now, according to Peter.
The 1st was destroyed by water, the NEW (3rd) heavens and earth will replace THIS (2nd) heavens and earth AFTER the lake of fire.

Made up.

 

[7djengo7]

Scripture supports belief in a Binitarian view of both Jesus and the Father being God in about two dozen or so passages found in both the Old Testament and the New Testament, though the interpretation of those passages have been debated for 1700 years.

There, you admitted that Scripture SUPPORTS belief of Jesus "being God".

But, here, you contradict what you admitted there by saying:

The Bible never teaches that Jesus is God, so we shouldn't be quick to believe that Jesus is God.

You're a dyed-in-the-wool irrationalist, to be able, out of one side of your mouth, to say that Scripture SUPPORTS that Jesus is God, while, out of the other side of your mouth, saying that Scripture NEVER TEACHES that Jesus is God.

Try to explain what (if anything) you imagine it would be to SUPPORT a doctrine WITHOUT TEACHING the selfsame doctrine. Have fun.

You are mistaken about ... what constitutes idolatry (worship of objects).

What, precisely, would YOU say constitutes idolatry; what would you say constitutes worship of objects? What are you denoting by the word 'objects'?

What that is NOT GOD would you say one can worship without being guilty of idolatry?