Dr. Walt Brown on the Hydroplate Theory

[patman]

Questions on Dr. Brown's theory:
1. Before the flood were there oceans on the surface of the earth?
2. When the fountains opened and started throwing stuff up into the air, what was the speed at which, a rock, say, one of the ones that became an asteroid, going when it left the surface of the earth?
3. What is escape velocity at the surface of the earth? Would not the rocks have to be accelerated to that speed almost immediately?

Any one with any thoughts about this?

1. Before the flood were there oceans on the surface of the earth?
Yes, the Pacific ocean.

2. When the fountains opened and started throwing stuff up into the air, what was the speed at which, a rock, say, one of the ones that became an asteroid, going when it left the surface of the earth?
I couldn't find this one. But the force that launched them was that of 30 trillion hydrogen bombs.

3. What is escape velocity at the surface of the earth? Would not the rocks have to be accelerated to that speed almost immediately?
No, but if so, not by much. It would just take a little longer to get there requiring enough energy to make the extra stretch, but the same energy, at a constant would get 'her there.

 

[Jukia]

1. Before the flood were there oceans on the surface of the earth?
Yes, the Pacific ocean.

2. When the fountains opened and started throwing stuff up into the air, what was the speed at which, a rock, say, one of the ones that became an asteroid, going when it left the surface of the earth?
I couldn't find this one. But the force that launched them was that of 30 trillion hydrogen bombs.

3. What is escape velocity at the surface of the earth? Would not the rocks have to be accelerated to that speed almost immediately?
No, but if so, not by much. It would just take a little longer to get there requiring enough energy to make the extra stretch, but the same energy, at a constant would get 'her there.

#3 I think escape velocity is pretty quick. These rocks that are being thrown into the air would have to reach escape velocity immediatley, wouldn't they? Our space vehicles reach orbit and further by the addition of force on the way up. Brown's theory seems to lack that and therefore escape velocity would need to be reached almost intantaneously. Am mI missing something?

 

[GuySmiley]

#3 I think escape velocity is pretty quick. These rocks that are being thrown into the air would have to reach escape velocity immediatley, wouldn't they? Our space vehicles reach orbit and further by the addition of force on the way up. Brown's theory seems to lack that and therefore escape velocity would need to be reached almost intantaneously. Am mI missing something?

I don't think you are missing anything. No, the rocks that left earth had to be going faster than escape velocity almost instantaneously, since they dont get any thrust after they left the crack in the earths crust. Its just a matter of what 'almost' means.

 

[Jukia]

I think, if my math is correct, that escape velocity is 25,000 miles per hour. So whatever started the rocks and water flying had to put them at that speed pretty quickly. Does not that raise all sorts of other issues? How did all the water stay as water when it was subjected to the heat of atmospheric friction at 25K mph???

 

[patman]

I think, if my math is correct, that escape velocity is 25,000 miles per hour. So whatever started the rocks and water flying had to put them at that speed pretty quickly. Does not that raise all sorts of other issues? How did all the water stay as water when it was subjected to the heat of atmospheric friction at 25K mph???

According to this article on wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_velocity

to reach space, something needs to be traveling at 7 km per second, which is 1,565.9 miles per hour.

The rocks under the entire weight of the crust of the earth would easily find enough momentum to get there.

 

[Jukia]

According to this article on wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_velocity

to reach space, something needs to be traveling at 7 km per second, which is 1,565.9 miles per hour.

The rocks under the entire weight of the crust of the earth would easily find enough momentum to get there.

No. Escape velocity is 11.2 km/sec on the surface of the earth, from the Wiki article. 7.1 km if you start at 9000 meters. Lets split the difference, after all the surface of the earth must have been a lot further out with all that water underneath per Brown. So lets say 9.15 km/second. To convert to miles per second, 9.15 x .62 = 5.67 miles/second x 60 seconds = 340 miles/minute x 60 = 20,412 miles per hour.
And that is at the start, and just to get it to escape earth's gravity with no real speed thereafter until the object falls under the gravity of another body.
So, how does all that water stay as water so that it can splash on the face of mars? And, once it reaches space, why does it not all simply boil away?
I think Dr. Brown needs to work on his theory a bit more.

 

[ThePhy]

No. Escape velocity is 11.2 km/sec on the surface of the earth, from the Wiki article. 7.1 km if you start at 9000 meters. Lets split the difference, after all the surface of the earth must have been a lot further out with all that water underneath per Brown. So lets say 9.15 km/second. To convert to miles per second, 9.15 x .62 = 5.67 miles/second x 60 seconds = 340 miles/minute x 60 = 20,412 miles per hour.
And that is at the start, and just to get it to escape earth's gravity with no real speed thereafter until the object falls under the gravity of another body.
So, how does all that water stay as water so that it can splash on the face of mars? And, once it reaches space, why does it not all simply boil away?
I think Dr. Brown needs to work on his theory a bit more.

25,000 mph is the right figure. Assuming an enormous mass of water under the earth’s crust might make the diameter of the earth larger, but it would also increase the earth’s total mass. Net effect probably would be an even higher escape velocity would be needed (haven’t run the figures, since the density of water is only a fraction of that of the earth’s crust).

Just a note, one pound of anything – water, feathers, lead – accelerated to 25,000 mph will have been given energy (kinetic) equal to that released by more than 10 pounds of TNT. That’s why it takes several millions of pounds of rocket fuel to put a space shuttle weighing about 100,000 lbs into just a low orbit. Since this immense addition of energy is in kinetic energy, that does not mean the water ejected under pressure would be heated by the ejection process itself. Heating (or cooling) experienced during the ejection depends on details of the process involved, and the initial conditions.

No matter its temperature when ejected, once in space, it would cool (via IR radiation) and droplets that happened to collide might fuse into crystals. If it fell to Mars it would be frictionally heated to temperatures far above the liquid phase, but the vapor would likely be captured in the atmosphere anyway. In a process similar to earthly clouds, it might cool and form as rain and end up as liquid on the surface.

 

[Jukia]

Just a note, one pound of anything – water, feathers, lead – accelerated to 25,000 mph will have been given energy (kinetic) equal to that released by more than 10 pounds of TNT. That’s why it takes several millions of pounds of rocket fuel to put a space shuttle weighing about 100,000 lbs into just a low orbit. Since this immense addition of energy is in kinetic energy, that does not mean the water ejected under pressure would be heated by the ejection process itself. Heating (or cooling) experienced during the ejection depends on details of the process involved, and the initial conditions.

.

I was thinking that water or anything moving at 25K mph through the atmosphere would be heated by friction with the atmosphere ala the space shuttle (known in my house when kids were little as the space "shovel").

Also, once I got this mass of water above the atmosphere would it not simply evaporate/boil away due to the lowered ambient atmospheric pressure?

And if this is happening world wide, and the earth is a globe, how is all this water and rock etc. directed toward the moon and also toward mars (millions of miles away)?

Perhaps Dr. Brown should jump onto this thread? Seems like there are some questions he could answer for us.

 

[ThePhy]

I was thinking that water or anything moving at 25K mph through the atmosphere would be heated by friction with the atmosphere ala the space shuttle (known in my house when kids were little as the space "shovel").

Also, once I got this mass of water above the atmosphere would it not simply evaporate/boil away due to the lowered ambient atmospheric pressure?

And if this is happening world wide, and the earth is a globe, how is all this water and rock etc. directed toward the moon and also toward mars (millions of miles away)?

Perhaps Dr. Brown should jump onto this thread? Seems like there are some questions he could answer for us.

The friction at 25K mph will vaporize most things. But the astronauts in the descending shuttle are cool, because the ceramic tiles on the nose of the space shuttle are in fact being vaporized by the friction. If the astronauts (or water) move to the “outside” of that protective insulated tin can during reentry, then they will indeed be cooked (as unfortunately happened a couple of years ago when the shuttle came apart on re-entry). The friction (and the heat it generates) is at the place where the non-moving air in the high atmosphere is impacting the object – hopefully the tiles on the nose of the shuttle. Inside, well away from that blistering interface, you only feel the g-forces cause by the deceleration.

As to high altitude water, if it is raised to high altitude by relatively calm means (evaporating, winds, and such) the water actually cools due to the lowered pressure. High altitude clouds are clouds of ice crystals, not liquid droplets. Blasting the water into the stratosphere via Walt Brown mechanisms is a whole new story, complicated by a host of questions.

I presume the water ejected from the earth is not actually directed towards Mars or the Moon, but a small part of it would randomly have its path intersect that of the Moon or Mars. I expect the solar wind would have stripped away most of the rest from the vicinity of the earth (would have looked like the most spectacular comet’s tail ever observed by the bug-people of Venus).

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Jukia, Walt wasn't an engineer with NASA, nor was he in the Apollo 13 craft, nor did the astronauts radio to ask his opinion of what might happened if they dumped their waste overboard, nor did his telling this story imply that mankind only then discovered gravity.

Like I said, you apparently have such a bad attitude, that you're not a good listener, and also, you prefer obfuscating on petty matters to dealing with substance.

By definition, the scientist to discover something has a world-full of scientists who are not yet convinced, regardless of the solid evidence for his theory. You could have made the same objection to the heliocentrism. Once again, Jukia prefers obfuscation to substance.

-Bob Enyart

Where is that "Jukia with his fingers jammed into his ears" smilie when you need it?

 

[patman]

And, once it reaches space, why does it not all simply boil away?

He offered an answer in the show. scw ring a bell?

 

[Jukia]

He offered an answer in the show. scw ring a bell?

No, it does not. Oh wait, some type of special water, right. I'll have to go back & listen again tomorrow. thanks

 

[patman]

No, it does not. Oh wait, some type of special water, right. I'll have to go back & listen again tomorrow. thanks

Sure.

I made it into a video, you can watch it here:

http://www.christian-revolution.net/studyRender.php?studyID=38

Some of the visuals may help some

 

[Jukia]

Sure.

I made it into a video, you can watch it here:

http://www.christian-revolution.net/studyRender.php?studyID=38

Some of the visuals may help some

NIce video. Too bad it illustrates such nonsense.
Dr. Brown just continues to amaze me with his gibberish. But boy will I have egg on my face when Stockholm calls him, huh?
There is another thread discussing why someone is no longer a believer. In my case it is this blatant dishonesty with the facts. Brown is a fraud and Enyart is simply dishonest in his continued pushing of this junk.
Have a nice life. I need to take a break from TOL for a bit and try to figure out just how much damage it has done to my soul.

 

[patman]

NIce video. Too bad it illustrates such nonsense.
Dr. Brown just continues to amaze me with his gibberish. But boy will I have egg on my face when Stockholm calls him, huh?
There is another thread discussing why someone is no longer a believer. In my case it is this blatant dishonesty with the facts. Brown is a fraud and Enyart is simply dishonest in his continued pushing of this junk.
Have a nice life. I need to take a break from TOL for a bit and try to figure out just how much damage it has done to my soul.

:wave:

It isn't your hurting soul that makes you leave. Spankings of the truth hurt I guess... especially when you really don't want to hear it.

 

[Jukia]

:wave:

It isn't your hurting soul that makes you leave. Spankings of the truth hurt I guess... especially when you really don't want to hear it.

Nope, Brown is lying, plain and simple, either that or he is the dumbest PhD on the planet.

See ya.

 

[Stripe]

No going away party?

 

[eisenreich]

I've come up with my own theory. A giant man who once roamed the Earth ate one too many burritos. This explains water on Mars, the craters on the moon, and comets and asteroids. Weee!

Blasphemy! It was a chimichanga and he was running, not roaming..

 

[Jefferson]

Sure.

I made it into a video, you can watch it here:

http://www.christian-revolution.net/studyRender.php?studyID=38

Some of the visuals may help some

Post of the day! :first:

Great work patman. I was having some difficulty trying to visualize Walt Brown's concepts as he was describing them but your video made it so easy. Thank you.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Sure.

I made it into a video, you can watch it here:

http://www.christian-revolution.net/studyRender.php?studyID=38

Some of the visuals may help some

Wow! That must have taken a bit of work. Great job!