The 12 did not understand or believe - So jesus tried to teach DBR but they didn't get it !!! Therefore is WAS NOT taught
Luke 18:31-32 Luke 18:33-34 Mark 9:31-32 Luke 24:9-10 Luke 24:11 John 20:9
ECT what say Madist about this scripture ?
- Thread starter dodge
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Luke 18:31-32 Luke 18:33-34 Mark 9:31-32 Luke 24:9-10 Luke 24:11 John 20:9
Interplanner
Well-known member
More specifically, they did not think the kind of messiah/leader that Jesus was so far was going to suffer that kind of death. Many of the disciples were recruited from Galilee which was the hotbed of revolt. That group of people really expected a serious revolt leader. It is much more likely that they thought he would die a war hero and miraculously recover than to be persecuted for 'abstract' things like claiming the authority to forgive, and saying the Scriptures testify to him.
There are different kinds of not understanding, and the disciples failure was not that of not knowing there was going to be suffering.
dodge
New member
Because they did not understand does not mean it was not taught by scripture and by Jesus.
Not understood but in scripture and taught by Jesus.
Interplanner
Well-known member
That's right. There were many other conceptions in their minds from Judaism, and there is the personal shock of hearing someone say they are going to willingly die.
dodge
New member
They wanted and waited for a king to free them from Rome . They had no clue of the suffering, and D.B.R. of Messiah as payment for sin. Even though it was in the scriptures.
The scriptures disagree with you as usual
Luke 18:31-32 Luke 18:33-34 Mark 9:31-32 Luke 24:9-10 Luke 24:11 John 20:9
Show us and prove it -
dodge
New member
It was in response to Hebrews was after the fact, and it was poorly worded.
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I have had a Madist tell me that salvation by grace through faith and not works for gentiles and salvation is different for the Jews.The two gospel belief that Jesus, the Apostles ,nor the prophets ever taught.
Interplanner
Well-known member
The restoration of the whole world is from the prophets. There's no mystery, then, about that. But in Judaism, they thought this would happen through the Law.
Some of these expressions 'since the world began' are not good trans. 'kronois aionois' in Rom 16 is certainly not 'since the world began.' So the TEV put 'long ages.'
Acts 3:21 is simply 'ap' aionos' "for ages" and it is from the prophet period. I have no idea how 'since the world began' got there except as a figure of speech.
Are you speaking of the Kingdom on earth that will last for a thousand years? That is meant for "The House of Israel."
dodge
New member
Jhn 20:9
For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.
Psa 16:10
For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Paul taught the Grace Message to the Gentiles. It included faith alone without works. Peter and the rest of the Apostles preached the Kingdom Message which included faith in Christ plus works.
Luke 1:31-33 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son and shall call His name Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever and of His kingdom there will be no end.
Interplanner
Well-known member
There is no flipping back and forth between programs. The resurrection is the enthronement of Christ on the 'throne of David' which Ps 2 says was actually the throne of God. That's why it is mentioned here, and in Acts 2, 3, and why Ps 2 is prayed (re-prayed) in Acts 4: the Christ is enthroned, and is to be preached as such, though the eye of sinful man may not see it. To cause the whole world to obey the Son, to honor the Son, lest he be angry and smash them.
GM is looking for pre-set events, but that is not what the NT is about. It is about a daring message and you (the messenger) may lose your life.
Why do you believe Luke was flipping back and forth?
His statement seems clear to me.
Interplanner
Well-known member
I was referring to D'ists. It would be: Christ gets several missionaries ready to go to the nations, but is also going to have an Israel with a throne ruling through 12 tribes over all the nations. (Some would say the 70 was about prep for the 12 tribes ruling). Two completely different programs for two kinds of people.
They are always seeking two separate programs, uncoordinated, for different reasons, objectives, outcomes, so that OT prophecy can be 'fulfilled literally.'
When they see 'David's throne' it has to be the nation of Israel and its restoration and worship system.
Memory does not serve you correctly.
Interplanner
Well-known member
But people can read things "loaded" Jamie. That's what a century of D'ism does. The leaders say the same sound-bytes THEIR way over and over and people start thinking that's what it means. They have a Pavlovian response to 'throne of David.' So when they go through Acts 2-4, they have to do tons of splitting and separating and their fav 'right dividing' of the passages, instead of let it speak plainly.
In contrast to your books based pigeon fed, Operant Conditioning :chuckle;