SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Do you want to be saved?
ECT DID THE ROMAN CHURCH FALL INTO APOSTASY?
- Thread starter Cruciform
- Start date
Do you want to be saved?
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Then why don't you believe the gospel, and trust the LORD?
what part of it don't I believe?
The church at Rome did not obey any bishop as though he were the person of Christ as taught by Ignatias at the turn of the century. That was the usurpation of the church by a clergy class.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
If you did, you would give up and rest in what was already done.
You would be saved.
Cruciform
New member
Already answered. The mere fact that the Marian doctrines happen to conflict with the admittedly non-authoritative dictates of your chosen recently-invented, man-made non-Catholic sect says nothing whatsoever about the truth-status of those (or any other) particular Christian teachings. Try again.
Cruciform
New member
Go ahead, then, and provide patristic quotations that disagree with Catholic beliefs and/or that reflect characteristically "Protestant" teachings. In short, document your claim from the voluminous writings of the early Church Fathers.
(Wait for it...)
Try again. :yawn:
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Cruciform
New member
No. The Catholic Church believed and taught these things (and others) for a millennium-and-a-half before a single Protestant ever managed to stumble onto the scene.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Cruciform
New member
Post your proof.
When you show that Paul in writing to the Romans ever made mention of any pope or cardinal or monsignor or archbishop......it would be a terrible lapse of curtesy if such people were there and Paul did not address them.
I drank what?
New member
sorry lad, i've done this too many times, i know how this ends
:beats dead horse:
/she's way past the glue stage now!!1!
//maybe if ... just ... keep.. beating it..
///this time it will work
Cruciform
New member
- First, your argument from silence is objectively fallacious, and so may simply be dismissed on that basis alone.
- [FONT=Georgia"]Second, your comment here relies entirely on a fundamental assumption of the 16th-century Protestant notion of sola scriptura, which is itself nowhere taught in Scripture, and so which directly refutes itself.
- Third, regarding the apostolic teaching concerning the Church's leadership, see this.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+[/FONT]
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Cruciform
New member
Feel free, then, to post elsewhere.
Jedidiah
New member
everready
New member
Apostasy Sets the Foundation for Later Persecution
Apostasy Sets the Foundation for Later Persecution
The historian, J. A Wylie, shows the beginning of corruption of the Christian Church, an apostasy which set in place the machinery for later persecution.
From the fourth century the corruptions of the Christian Church continued to make marked and rapid progress. The Bible began to be hidden from the people. And in proportion as the light, which is the surest guarantee of liberty, was withdrawn, the clergy usurped authority over the members of the Church. The canons of councils were put in the room of the one infallible Rule of Faith; and thus the first stone was laid in the foundations of "Babylon, that great city, that made all nations to drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication."
The Inquisition
William Shaw Kerr quotes from Lord Acton, who was among the most learned of the English Roman Catholics, regarding the basic nature of the Inquisition. Lord Acton's conviction was that,
The Inquisition is peculiarly the weapon and peculiarly the work of the Popes. It stands out from all those things in which they co-operated, followed or assented as the distinctive feature of papal Rome. It was set up, renewed and perfected by a long series of acts emanating from the supreme authority in the Church. No other institution, no doctrine, no ceremony is so distinctly the individual creation of the Papacy, except the dispensing power.
It is the principal thing with which the Papacy is identified, and by which it must be judged. The principle of the Inquisition is the Pope's sovereign power over life and death. Whosoever disobeys him should be tried and tortured and burnt. If that cannot be done, formalities may be dispensed with, and the culprit may be killed like an outlaw. That is to say, the principle of the Inquisition is murderous, and a man's opinion of the Papacy is regulated and determined by his opinion of religious assassination."
i found this interesting.
Just Penalties Today
In our own day Rome declares that there are "just penalties" for those who will not bend the knee to her. Present day canon law shows what offenses the RCC considers punishable.
Canon 1369 "A person who uses a public show or speech, published writings, or other media of social communication to blaspheme, seriously damage good morals, express wrongs against religion or against the Church or stir up hatred or contempt against religion or the Church is to be punished with a just penalty."
In an introductory article on these "just penalties" of Rome, official Catholic canon law commentator states, "While a certain type of diversity clearly enriches the Church, it simply cannot tolerate certain divergent patterns of thought or activity...." It is sobering when reading the account of history to remember that in present day Roman Catholic law, a "just penalty" is still required by Rome for deviating from her dictates.
http://www.biblebelievers.com/bennett/bennett_papal_persecution.html
everready
Apostasy Sets the Foundation for Later Persecution
The historian, J. A Wylie, shows the beginning of corruption of the Christian Church, an apostasy which set in place the machinery for later persecution.
From the fourth century the corruptions of the Christian Church continued to make marked and rapid progress. The Bible began to be hidden from the people. And in proportion as the light, which is the surest guarantee of liberty, was withdrawn, the clergy usurped authority over the members of the Church. The canons of councils were put in the room of the one infallible Rule of Faith; and thus the first stone was laid in the foundations of "Babylon, that great city, that made all nations to drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication."
The Inquisition
William Shaw Kerr quotes from Lord Acton, who was among the most learned of the English Roman Catholics, regarding the basic nature of the Inquisition. Lord Acton's conviction was that,
The Inquisition is peculiarly the weapon and peculiarly the work of the Popes. It stands out from all those things in which they co-operated, followed or assented as the distinctive feature of papal Rome. It was set up, renewed and perfected by a long series of acts emanating from the supreme authority in the Church. No other institution, no doctrine, no ceremony is so distinctly the individual creation of the Papacy, except the dispensing power.
It is the principal thing with which the Papacy is identified, and by which it must be judged. The principle of the Inquisition is the Pope's sovereign power over life and death. Whosoever disobeys him should be tried and tortured and burnt. If that cannot be done, formalities may be dispensed with, and the culprit may be killed like an outlaw. That is to say, the principle of the Inquisition is murderous, and a man's opinion of the Papacy is regulated and determined by his opinion of religious assassination."
i found this interesting.
Just Penalties Today
In our own day Rome declares that there are "just penalties" for those who will not bend the knee to her. Present day canon law shows what offenses the RCC considers punishable.
Canon 1369 "A person who uses a public show or speech, published writings, or other media of social communication to blaspheme, seriously damage good morals, express wrongs against religion or against the Church or stir up hatred or contempt against religion or the Church is to be punished with a just penalty."
In an introductory article on these "just penalties" of Rome, official Catholic canon law commentator states, "While a certain type of diversity clearly enriches the Church, it simply cannot tolerate certain divergent patterns of thought or activity...." It is sobering when reading the account of history to remember that in present day Roman Catholic law, a "just penalty" is still required by Rome for deviating from her dictates.
http://www.biblebelievers.com/bennett/bennett_papal_persecution.html
everready
Cruciform
New member
:thumb:
Cruciform
New member
Please explain what the medieval inquisitions have to do with the one historic Catholic Church supposedly having fallen into doctrinal apostasy.