ECT WHAT JOHN 3:16 REALLY MEANS TO US TODAY !!

[DAN P]

Hi to all and the book of John and portions of John seem to parallel Paul !!

John 3:16 reads , For God so loved the world , that he gave His only begotten Son , that who so ever believeth in Him , should not PERISH , but have Everlasting Life !!

#1, The first verb is in the AORIST TENSE , ACTIVE VOICE and in the INDICATIVE MOOD !!

The AORIST TENSE then points to , me , before Time as He was already SLAIN Rev 5:6 !!

#2 , Skipping to the third verb , is the PRESENT TENSE which speaks to CONTINUOUS ACTION since being SLAIN !!

#3 But the last 2 verbs , PERISH and HAVE are in the PRESENT TENSE of CONTINUOUS ACTION since being SLAIN !!

#4 But these last 2 verbs are in the SUBJECTIVE MOOD which then means , that NOT ALL WILL be possiblybe saved and this verse is CONTROLLED by the Subjective Mood !!

To me , John 3:16 HAS to cover all AGES and that would include the Dispensation of the Grace of God or the MYSTERY and as John 19:30 , where Jesus says " IT IS FINISHED " the payment for sins PAST , PRESENT and FUTURE as THE Greek word FINISHED is in the Greek PERFECT TENSE , PASSIVE VOICE and in the INDICATIVE MOOD as it has been written !!

We know from 2 Cor 3:14-16 why Jews have been set aside as there is a VAIL that covers there HEART , even until today verse 15 !!\

This than leaves ONLY DISPENSATIONALISM as the only way to be saved , which EXCLUDES all other so-called systems and theology !!

dan p

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Isaiah 9:6 (KJV)

Salvation of the world, through Israel.

 

[DAN P]

Isaiah 9:6 (KJV)

Salvation of the world, through Israel.

Hi and are you meaning Rom 11:11 ?

dan p

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Hi and are you meaning Rom 11:11 ?

dan p

No, salvation of Gentiles as in Isaiah 60.

 

[Lon]

To me , John 3:16 HAS to cover all AGES and that would include the Dispensation of the Grace of God or the MYSTERY and as John 19:30 , where Jesus says " IT IS FINISHED " the payment for sins PAST , PRESENT and FUTURE as THE Greek word FINISHED is in the Greek PERFECT TENSE , PASSIVE VOICE and in the INDICATIVE MOOD as it has been written !!

I believe all of John 3 speaks toward His salvation and man's new-nature as well. We cannot born-again ourselves. I'm not sure all or any MAD would agree, however.

We know from 2 Cor 3:14-16 why Jews have been set aside as there is a VAIL that covers there HEART , even until today verse 15 !!\

This than leaves ONLY DISPENSATIONALISM as the only way to be saved , which EXCLUDES all other so-called systems and theology !!

dan p

Why? :think: What specifically excludes them? Their disagreement over the future of Israel??? :idunno:

 

[DAN P]

I believe all of John 3 speaks toward His salvation and man's new-nature as well. We cannot born-again ourselves. I'm not sure all or any MAD would agree, however.

Why? :think: What specifically excludes them? Their disagreement over the future of Israel??? :idunno:

Hi and we see from Isa 6 :8-10 we see why God could not , nor would He save Israel !!

Anther one is in Luke 13:6-9 and there are many more verse !!

And of course Acts 7:1-60 that DEFINES Israel's SINS and why the Holy Spirit wrote Acts 13:46 and Acts 18:6 and Acts 28:28 !!

You will not find Eph 2:5 or 8 EXCEPT in Paul's writing !!

Or find Cal 1:25 and 26 ??

It seems that use believe in John 3:5 also as it is the same CONTEXT , born of WATER and the Spirit , is that true statement ??

Salvation by the MYSTERY IS only found in Rom 16:25 and 26 !!

dan p

 

[Lon]

Hi and we see from Isa 6 :8-10 we see why God could not , nor would He save Israel !!

Anther one is in Luke 13:6-9 and there are many more verse !!

And of course Acts 7:1-60 that DEFINES Israel's SINS and why the Holy Spirit wrote Acts 13:46 and Acts 18:6 and Acts 28:28 !!

You will not find Eph 2:5 or 8 EXCEPT in Paul's writing !!

Or find Cal 1:25 and 26 ??

It seems that use believe in John 3:5 also as it is the same CONTEXT , born of WATER and the Spirit , is that true statement ??

Salvation by the MYSTERY IS only found in Rom 16:25 and 26 !!

dan p

As far as exact words? Agree. I simply believe the Jews were blinded by their expectations. The Lord Jesus Christ clearly told the disciples He was going to die and would explain it to them after he rose again. John 11:10-19

Even if we never agree, are you sure such means that only Dispensationalists are heaven-bound? Did you know some MAD think even Dispensational isn't good enough? I'm not really caught up in what a person says about who is saved and who is not. I'm concerned at who the Lord Jesus Christ and His Apostles say are saved and who are not. On this, I more than disagree. God is able to save to the uttermost those who are perishing. -Lon

 

[DAN P]

As far as exact words? Agree. I simply believe the Jews were blinded by their expectations. The Lord Jesus Christ clearly told the disciples He was going to die and would explain it to them after he rose again. John 11:10-19

Even if we never agree, are you sure such means that only Dispensationalists are heaven-bound? Did you know some MAD think even Dispensational isn't good enough? I'm not really caught up in what a person says about who is saved and who is not. I'm concerned at who the Lord Jesus Christ and His Apostles say are saved and who are not. On this, I more than disagree. God is able to save to the uttermost those who are perishing. -Lon

Hi and , yes , all that are saved by the MYSTERY are the only one going to heaven and ALL have to be in the B O C , 1 Cor 12:13 and have to be BAPTIZED / BAPTIZO / PLACED into His death in Rom 6:3 and Gal 2:20 apply's !!

Can you be saved by the LAW of Moses ?

Where are the TERMS of salvation UNDER a Covenant , PLEASE show those verse are found , Please do not use Jer 31:31 or Ezek 36:24-38 and look at the CONTEXT !!

dan p

 

[Lon]

Hi and , yes , all that are saved by the MYSTERY are the only one going to heaven and ALL have to be in the B O C , 1 Cor 12:13 and have to be BAPTIZED / BAPTIZO / PLACED into His death in Rom 6:3 and Gal 2:20 apply's !!

Can you be saved by the LAW of Moses ?

No.

Where are the TERMS of salvation UNDER a Covenant , PLEASE show those verse are found , Please do not use Jer 31:31 or Ezek 36:24-38 and look at the CONTEXT !!

dan p

As far as Galatians, the covenant was through the Son as Paul says it in Galatians. I realize MAD does not agree on that point but I think it inconsequential, for the most part, if one understands salvation by grace. If so, we can argue 'when' that grace first appeared until the cows come home, as far as I'm concerned. -Lon

 

[dodge]

Isaiah 9:6 (KJV)

Salvation of the world, through Israel.

Through Israel=birth of Jesus Christ.


Isa 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Through Israel=birth of Jesus Christ.


Isa 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Who is "us", according to Isaiah?

 

[Tambora]

Who is "us", according to Isaiah?

The Israelites.

 

[steko]

The Israelites.

How could anybody miss that? :idunno:

 

[steko]

Who is "us", according to Isaiah?

Certainly not these folks:

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

 

[dodge]

Who is "us", according to Isaiah?

Really ? So then who brought salvation ?

The us is everyone that gets saved because the verse is about the birth of Jesus.

Take off the MAD glasses they are blinding you to the truth.

 

[Tambora]

How could anybody miss that? :idunno:

Stupidity, that's how.

 

[Tambora]

Certainly not these folks:

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Certainly not.

 

[dodge]

How could anybody miss that? :idunno:

I was wondering the same thing as how could anyone miss that it is about the birth of Jesus who brought salvation !

Now comes along folks and adds the "who was it for" which diminishes the importance and meaning of the context which is "a child is born"," a Son is given",and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Why would anyone take the focus off of what the context of the verse is from a child is born ( John 3:16) and falsely claim that it was to Israel.

IF the "child was born" applies only to Israel only then NO ONE else would have salvation.

That is where MAD leads right into denial of context, truth, and replaces the truth of scripture with UN-Godly deception.

 

[drbrumley]

I was wondering the same thing as how could anyone miss that it is about the birth of Jesus who brought salvation !

Now comes along folks and adds the "who was it for" which diminishes the importance and meaning of the context which is "a child is born"," a Son is given",and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Why would anyone take the focus off of what the context of the verse is from a child is born ( John 3:16) and falsely claim that it was to Israel.

IF the "child was born" applies only to Israel only then NO ONE else would have salvation.

That is where MAD leads right into denial of context, truth, and replaces the truth of scripture with UN-Godly deception.

Baloney!

 

[dodge]

Baloney!

nah, straight up FACT. Jesus was not just sent to Israel and that is what that verse is about the birth of Jesus.

Real scholarly response ! I guess that is a good response when you have NOTHING !