ECT Was Christ "Doing Prophecy" in Mt 24?

Interplanner

New member
No, he was speaking protectively about his followers and how he was going to get them through the worst chapter of Israel. AND IT WORKED! That is the inexplicable thing about D'ist people!!! Here we are today and we are here because of something that almost didn't work!!! They nearly did not get out from under the zealots and out of the area. You make Christ into a space case, and you sound like one yourself by not knowing the gritty, amazing, phenomenal, supernatural detail that is the historic event of the destruction of Jerusalem, the final sledge of wrath against Israel fulfilling all the prophets, Lk 21.

You, inc. Danoh who knows, never go over the 7-8 astounding signatory or 'signs and wonders' that took place in the event IN DETAIL. There is always the lazy dismissal of course, but not the detail. He (J) really didn't want to report many of them, but he kept running into independent accounts of the same thing and he believed he had to: the cannabilism, the sword hanging over the city, the intense heat at the base of the temple which was still there several years later stopping reconstruction, the sound of roaring like a wind, the voice that made a play on the Hebrew 'ichabod' about departing from this place, etc, etc, etc.

I would think you would use these things to their fullness, but all I ever hear is the know-it-all dismissal by people like Danoh and several others, because of the precious 2P2P principle, or some dastardly belief that 'if it is not in the Bible, it is irrelevant or never happened.' Etc.

Well, the arrogant Thoreau ordered Bible pages to be used to wipe yourself with in the toilet, only to learn later that Biblical knowledge flourished by doing so. So God kicked butt. It's not in the Bible, so...is it therefore to be disregarded? What sort of mentality is that? There is absolutely no event in antiquity that was as astonishing and no record as extensive as the DoJ, but you people with your experts in 2P2P and your plans and your gospels just act like it is trash by comparison.
 

Danoh

New member
No, he was speaking protectively about his followers and how he was going to get them through the worst chapter of Israel. AND IT WORKED! That is the inexplicable thing about D'ist people!!! Here we are today and we are here because of something that almost didn't work!!! They nearly did not get out from under the zealots and out of the area. You make Christ into a space case, and you sound like one yourself by not knowing the gritty, amazing, phenomenal, supernatural detail that is the historic event of the destruction of Jerusalem, the final sledge of wrath against Israel fulfilling all the prophets, Lk 21.

You, inc. Danoh who knows, never go over the 7-8 astounding signatory or 'signs and wonders' that took place in the event IN DETAIL. There is always the lazy dismissal of course, but not the detail. He (J) really didn't want to report many of them, but he kept running into independent accounts of the same thing and he believed he had to: the cannabilism, the sword hanging over the city, the intense heat at the base of the temple which was still there several years later stopping reconstruction, the sound of roaring like a wind, the voice that made a play on the Hebrew 'ichabod' about departing from this place, etc, etc, etc.

I would think you would use these things to their fullness, but all I ever hear is the know-it-all dismissal by people like Danoh and several others, because of the precious 2P2P principle, or some dastardly belief that 'if it is not in the Bible, it is irrelevant or never happened.' Etc.

Well, the arrogant Thoreau ordered Bible pages to be used to wipe yourself with in the toilet, only to learn later that Biblical knowledge flourished by doing so. So God kicked butt. It's not in the Bible, so...is it therefore to be disregarded? What sort of mentality is that? There is absolutely no event in antiquity that was as astonishing and no record as extensive as the DoJ, but you people with your experts in 2P2P and your plans and your gospels just act like it is trash by comparison.

I reckon I'm right popular - the MAD Outlaw :chuckle:
 

steko

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
OP: Was Christ "Doing Prophecy" in Mt 24?

Matthew 24 and 25 is one discourse.
That discourse takes place under the Law, same as all other OT prophecy.
It contains revelation from Israel's prophets and is expounded and enlarged by prophecy from the LORD Jesus.
It concerns the coming Day of the LORD, the regathering of Israel from the nations, judgement of Israel and the nations and the coronation of the Lord Jesus upon David's throne....among other things.
The Lord is definitely 'doing prophecy'.
 

Interplanner

New member
Then please detail them for us, won't you? Bullet point fashion.


No, because as soon as someone puts up a decent link, or Keller's summary, or pastes the difficult passages here (long, compound sentences), the material disappears like no one even knows its there. This has been done prob 5 times since I have been on here.

Go do your own homework, but Pastor Peter Holford's 1805 restatement of these things is probably the most useful place to start.
 

Interplanner

New member
Matthew 24 and 25 is one discourse.
That discourse takes place under the Law, same as all other OT prophecy.
It contains revelation from Israel's prophets and is expounded and enlarged by prophecy from the LORD Jesus.
It concerns the coming Day of the LORD, the regathering of Israel from the nations, judgement of Israel and the nations and the coronation of the Lord Jesus upon David's throne....among other things.
The Lord is definitely 'doing prophecy'.


Mt 24, 25 contains "revelation from Israel's prophets"? That's quite a mouthful. Does that mean there are passages mentioned or quoted that are about to come true at that time?
 

Interplanner

New member
Matthew 24 and 25 is one discourse.
That discourse takes place under the Law, same as all other OT prophecy.
It contains revelation from Israel's prophets and is expounded and enlarged by prophecy from the LORD Jesus.
It concerns the coming Day of the LORD, the regathering of Israel from the nations, judgement of Israel and the nations and the coronation of the Lord Jesus upon David's throne....among other things.
The Lord is definitely 'doing prophecy'.


Israel was regathered from captivity and the most exciting event--the glory of israel--that took place, was the Gospel.
 

Interplanner

New member
Matthew 24 and 25 is one discourse.
That discourse takes place under the Law, same as all other OT prophecy.
It contains revelation from Israel's prophets and is expounded and enlarged by prophecy from the LORD Jesus.
It concerns the coming Day of the LORD, the regathering of Israel from the nations, judgement of Israel and the nations and the coronation of the Lord Jesus upon David's throne....among other things.
The Lord is definitely 'doing prophecy'.


I know he was declaring hard things about that generation, but was he doing what is now call pop eschatology? The difference between being a truth teller and a fore teller is that a fore teller is thought to be predicting a bunch of events whether there is any moral consequence or not. The consequence of the things Christ said about Israel in 24-25 is that it was being rejected and pulverized for not accepting the mission of Messiah.
 

Danoh

New member
No, because as soon as someone puts up a decent link, or Keller's summary, or pastes the difficult passages here (long, compound sentences), the material disappears like no one even knows its there. This has been done prob 5 times since I have been on here.

Go do your own homework, but Pastor Peter Holford's 1805 restatement of these things is probably the most useful place to start.

Well, that settles that :chuckle:

Is that your new approach; I like it, lol
 

musterion

Well-known member
The IP/AndyC/SerpentD/GT/CC/LA/Meshak method of argumentation.

1. Make a bold, inflammatory claim with insufficient explanation or evidence to back it up.

2. When asked for explanation or evidence,

(a) refuse to provide either (cite "pearls before swine")
(b) claim you already provided it in post #_____ when you didn't
(c) claim you already provided it but someone mysteriously deleted it
(d) cite blocks of unrelated Scripture
(e) ask irrelevant, distracting questions
(f) change the subject
(g) ignore the request; continue posting as before
(h) call the inquisitor "worldly," wish them a good day/place on Ignore

3. Claim victory.
 

Danoh

New member
A person can also go back several pages of threadlists and find them. What does that tell you?

True, bro; but you can't expect from others what you yourself often appear to have failed in - whenever you respond to a post either absent of any quotes as to who's post you are responding to, or post a response not only absent of that, but to the wrong poster.

You often do lay out your points. But again, you can't expect...well, read the proceeding paragraph again...
 

steko

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Mt 24, 25 contains "revelation from Israel's prophets"?

Yep.

That's quite a mouthful.

Mt 24-25 is quite a mouthful indeed.


Does that mean there are passages mentioned or quoted that are about to come true at that time?

"that time"? Definitely not immediately in time but from that particular frame of reference, maybe yes and maybe no.

Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.


Act 3:12 ...... Ye men of Israel .........
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
Act 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
 

steko

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Israel was regathered from captivity and the most exciting event--the glory of israel--that took place, was the Gospel.

Judah was partially regathered.
Prophecy says all the tribes will be regathered to the land and the Lord Christ affirms this in Mat 24:31.

Which gospel?

Christ takes His glorious throne at His second coming to this earth and says so in Mat 25:31.
 

steko

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
I know he was declaring hard things about that generation,

'that generation' is the generation which sees 'all' the signs.

but was he doing what is now call pop eschatology?

Definitely not.

The difference between being a truth teller and a fore teller is that a fore teller is thought to be predicting a bunch of events whether there is any moral consequence or not.

Yeah, one or more, but it's still truth, if it's a true prophet.


The consequence of the things Christ said about Israel in 24-25 is that it was being rejected and pulverized for not accepting the mission of Messiah.

You appear to be implying permanently, which is not the case.
 

Interplanner

New member
'that generation' is the generation which sees 'all' the signs.



Definitely not.



Yeah, one or more, but it's still truth, if it's a true prophet.




You appear to be implying permanently, which is not the case.



But he was talking about that generation, as Lk 19, 21, etc show. OR check Lk 23 about the babes who will become adults and what they will face.

Lots of people think he was doing what now call pop esch--Lindsay, Ryrie, LaHaye, Rosenberg.

By moral consequence I am drawing attention to the fact that Mt 10 and 24 have these courage issues that are parallel even though the people in 10 were simply doing mission work in Judea. That's what prophets do. It is not the same if you say he is speaking about things X000 years in the future. If "Israel" becomes a state again, but is secular, agnostic, etc., it is not the "same" moral issue as it was at that time.

If the wrath that fell on Israel in the DoJ was not permanent, what is the reason for Lk 21's fulfilling all the wrath that is written?
 

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
No, because as soon as someone puts up a decent link, or Keller's summary, or pastes the difficult passages here (long, compound sentences), the material disappears like no one even knows its there. This has been done prob 5 times since I have been on here.

Go do your own homework, but Pastor Peter Holford's 1805 restatement of these things is probably the most useful place to start.

Are you suggesting that there's some sort of conspiracy aimed at you?
 
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