The West is dead

musterion

musterion

Well-known member
Many societies have been moral, to varying degrees, but no civilization ever has been truly godly. Ours is no exception. Israel was godly only in fits and starts throughout her existence; much of the time she went whoring after idols and was chastised, crushed and sent into horrible slavery for it. But since the end of the period covered by the book of Acts, all nations are equally lost before God, just as at the scattering of Babel. All are now set aside by God as equally lost in unbelief. That means no nation today has precedence over others. Nor does any individual. ALL may come to Him, but solely and only through faith in Christ according to the Gospel of the grace of God, without works, as it was the death of the Son on the cross that paid the individual’s sin debt, and His raising from the dead which ensures the individual’s justification before God.

So to look for any societal-scale redemption of Europe or the U.S. — which by and large rejected the Word of God many decades ago — is vain. No society which tolerates or shrugs off such as this…

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...kicks-black-friday-violence-article-1.2448085

or this...

http://www.zombietime.com/up_your_alley_2008/

or this...

http://nypost.com/2015/11/27/people-having-sex-with-horses-is-on-the-rise-in-switzerland/

or this…

http://christiannews.net/2015/11/22...od-while-standing-next-to-photo-of-dead-baby/

…can stand in the face of an invader bent on converting, conquering or killing those it knows have grown soft and fat with iniquity. It just can't, not as a society.

There are saved individuals everywhere, and God knows who are His. But while Islam is of the Devil — on that point there is no argument — so is everything else in this world, most pointedly including the dissipated, useless “Christendom” of Europe and the U.S. that increasingly no longer believes God’s Word and isn’t even convinced He exists:

“In the last days, perilous times shall come. . .having a form [false outward appearance] of godliness but denying the POWER thereof” (2 Tim 3:5).

“…[Satan’s ministers] transforming themselves into ministers of righteousness" (2 Cor 11:15).

That power of true godliness is the Gospel of the grace of God itself, for it alone is “the power of God unto salvation” (Rom 1:16). So it wasn’t Islam the apostle Paul was warning about. It was professing but unsaved Christians to whom Christ will say, “Depart from Me, I never knew you.”

Yet if you ask most natives on the streets of Europe and the U.S. if they consider themselves at least nominally Christian, they’ll say “yes” no matter what else they believe or, more to the point, do not believe.

As a society, we’re doomed. But that really isn’t news (Rev 11:15).
 
chrysostom

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
give me a break

religion is dead
because
you self righteous religious wackos
are
just to good for us
you won't get involved in politics
or
the real world we live in

you don't vote
because
the candidate is catholic
or
the candidate is mormon
or
the candidate does not have a perfect stand on abortion

you won't bother to vote republican
to show you are against abortion
to show you are against same sex marriage

you don't vote
to show how good you are

you make me sick
 
musterion

musterion

Well-known member
chrysostom said:
give me a break

religion is dead
because
you self righteous religious wackos
are
just to good for us
you won't get involved in politics
or
the real world we live in

you don't vote
because
the candidate is catholic
or
the candidate is mormon
or
the candidate does not have a perfect stand on abortion

you won't bother to vote republican
to show you are against abortion
to show you are against same sex marriage

you don't vote
to show how good you are

you make me sick
Click to expand...

You're one of the ones Paul warned about.
 
exminister

exminister

Well-known member
No news flash here.

The Old Testament is a testament to the failure of Theocracies. Jesus said "My kingdom is not of this world". The devil took Jesus up on a mountain and told Him if He bowed down and worshipped him then all these kingdoms would be His. He said No, but many Christians say Yes. Beats me why so many focus on the world besides fear mongering.

Why are you focused on the world?
 
nikolai_42

nikolai_42

Well-known member
musterion said:
Many societies have been moral, to varying degrees, but no civilization ever has been truly godly. Ours is no exception. Israel was godly only in fits and starts throughout her existence; much of the time she went whoring after idols and was chastised, crushed and sent into horrible slavery for it. But since the end of the period covered by the book of Acts, all nations are equally lost before God, just as at the scattering of Babel. All are now set aside by God as equally lost in unbelief. That means no nation today has precedence over others. Nor does any individual. ALL may come to Him, but solely and only through faith in Christ according to the Gospel of the grace of God, without works, as it was the death of the Son on the cross that paid the individual’s sin debt, and His raising from the dead which ensures the individual’s justification before God.

So to look for any societal-scale redemption of Europe or the U.S. — which by and large rejected the Word of God many decades ago — is vain. No society which tolerates or shrugs off such as this…

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...kicks-black-friday-violence-article-1.2448085

or this...

http://www.zombietime.com/up_your_alley_2008/

or this...

http://nypost.com/2015/11/27/people-having-sex-with-horses-is-on-the-rise-in-switzerland/

or this…

http://christiannews.net/2015/11/22...od-while-standing-next-to-photo-of-dead-baby/

…can stand in the face of an invader bent on converting, conquering or killing those it knows have grown soft and fat with iniquity. It just can't, not as a society.

There are saved individuals everywhere, and God knows who are His. But while Islam is of the Devil — on that point there is no argument — so is everything else in this world, most pointedly including the dissipated, useless “Christendom” of Europe and the U.S. that increasingly no longer believes God’s Word and isn’t even convinced He exists:

“In the last days, perilous times shall come. . .having a form [false outward appearance] of godliness but denying the POWER thereof” (2 Tim 3:5).

“…[Satan’s ministers] transforming themselves into ministers of righteousness" (2 Cor 11:15).

That power of true godliness is the Gospel of the grace of God itself, for it alone is “the power of God unto salvation” (Rom 1:16). So it wasn’t Islam the apostle Paul was warning about. It was professing but unsaved Christians to whom Christ will say, “Depart from Me, I never knew you.”

Yet if you ask most natives on the streets of Europe and the U.S. if they consider themselves at least nominally Christian, they’ll say “yes” no matter what else they believe or, more to the point, do not believe.

As a society, we’re doomed. But that really isn’t news (Rev 11:15).
Click to expand...

All of this is a symptom of one underlying problem - idolatry.

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Romans 1:18-25

Which cause is found here :

And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Romans 1:25

Remember...in Ezekiel 7-9, God's judgment on Israel came as He showed the prophet the abominations in the temple. It all centered in worship.

The Western world has been successful for one primary reason - the gospel. It has been the Western world that has spread the gospel since the times of the Reformation and it is the West that has prospered above all others. We have known and recognized God for who He is - nationally - for several centuries and have ultimately been kept because of it.

Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance.
Exodus 33:12

And that nation whose God is the Lord is not a statement of theocracy, but a general recognition of God (remember, God promised to spare Sodom if just a handful of righteous men were found in it!) and the necessity of humbling ourselves before Him :

Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
Proverbs 3:5-6

It seems to me that even though there is no perfect nation (by any stretch of the imagination) that national days of prayer, national days of fasting and prayer etc.... were a national recognition of God and I believe God honored that. When the US took prayer out of schools...took the bible out of the schools...made education at its foundation a-theistic, it did exactly what is described above - denied the Creator at a time that He was widely acknowledged.

So the things we see are just the outward workings of a man's worship - what he worships ultimately drives him. And while there are perverse things across the nation, God isn't looking at those (the symptoms) nearly as much as He is the cause.

England and the US in the 17th century was actually in a similar state to us now. Morality was virtually non-existent, bribery and corruption were considered almost virtues, sexual vice was rampant and woven into the fabric of life (England may have been worse than the US) and positions in the church were greatly desired for the monetary gain that went with them - meaning those occupying bishoprics were often the least qualified (spiritually) to hold them. Maybe there wasn't the same activity as we are seeing today, but things were bad. Enter Wesley, Whitfield and Edwards and within a generation, two countries (not just one) went from the depths of depravity to the heights of revival.

The point is, we look on the externals and God looks on the heart. What we see as bad, worse and worst, God sees differently. Idolatry being the heart of all the wickedness, God isn't saying something like "homosexuality is worse than stealing" or some such thing. He is rather giving a people over to that which they are continually going after in their rejection of Him. All could change literally overnight if people returned to God (thereby forsaking all that denies Him).

When churches become places of entertainment and catering to all manner of people's desires (some seemingly benign and even good) and forsake the consistent preaching of the Word of God, is it any wonder that the nation follows along since it sees no difference between itself and that which is supposed to be salt and light?

It is time that judgment must begin at the house of God...
 
nikolai_42

nikolai_42

Well-known member
chrysostom said:
it is all we have to work with

get your head out of the clouds
Click to expand...

(For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:
Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Philippians 3:18-20
 
aCultureWarrior

aCultureWarrior

BANNED
Banned
LIFETIME MEMBER
musterion said:
Many societies have been moral, to varying degrees, but no civilization ever has been truly godly. Ours is no exception...
Click to expand...

Not true naysayer musterion. Our Founding Fathers were brilliant enough to give us a nation where our rights come from God; no other nation on earth has been blessed with such rights.

Unfortunately people like you weren't brave enough to fight to keep that nation, and we're seeing the results of that.

2 Timothy 4:7 should be every Christian's motto.

http://www.gotquestions.org/fought-the-good-fight.html
 
musterion

musterion

Well-known member
Another case in point.

hillary-tweet.jpg
 
musterion

musterion

Well-known member
rocketman said:
I believe that it is also our duty to be good stewards of what God has provided, to fight for good, & resist evil in this world...it is all part of shining light into darkness.
Click to expand...

ACW is a lying hypocrite.

If you say you don't vote, for whatever reason, everything wrong with society is your fault.

If you say you do vote, you're minding earthly things.
 
quip

quip

BANNED
Banned
musterion said:
Many societies have been moral, to varying degrees, but no civilization ever has been truly godly. Ours is no exception. Israel was godly only in fits and starts throughout her existence; much of the time she went whoring after idols and was chastised, crushed and sent into horrible slavery for it. But since the end of the period covered by the book of Acts, all nations are equally lost before God, just as at the scattering of Babel. All are now set aside by God as equally lost in unbelief. That means no nation today has precedence over others. Nor does any individual. ALL may come to Him, but solely and only through faith in Christ according to the Gospel of the grace of God, without works, as it was the death of the Son on the cross that paid the individual’s sin debt, and His raising from the dead which ensures the individual’s justification before God.
Click to expand...

Because man clings to an unattainable spriritual goal. The only way for man or society to meet such a divinely stipulated goal...is to perish.

Think about it. :think:
 
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