ECT The Time of the Gentiles

[genuineoriginal]

Luke 21:20-24 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.​

Jerusalem surrounded by armies.
Great distress in the land of Judea.
The people of Judea led away captive into all nations.

This is the description of the times of the Gentiles.

Was this prophecy fulfilled a long time ago, is the prophecy being fulfilled, or will the prophecy be fulfilled some time in the future?

 

[Danoh]

Luke 13:

34. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under
her wings, and ye would not!
35. Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Note that its people are also referred to as Jerusalem.

The 2nd half (in yellow) of Luke 21:24, "And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled" refers to how long the times of the Gentiles (Politically) will last with Jerusalem trodden down, its people scattered to the four corners of the Earth, before Jerusalem is at last "the city of the Great King," Matt. 5:35.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Luke 13:

34. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under
her wings, and ye would not!
35. Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Note that its people are also referred to as Jerusalem.

The 2nd half (in yellow) of Luke 21:24, "And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled" refers to how long the times of the Gentiles (Politically) will last with Jerusalem trodden down, its people scattered to the four corners of the Earth, before Jerusalem is at last "the city of the Great King," Matt. 5:35.

So, the people of Jerusalem shall be led away captive into all nations?
Who are these people and when did/will this happen?

 

[drbrumley]

Luke 21:20-24 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.​

Jerusalem surrounded by armies.
Great distress in the land of Judea.
The people of Judea led away captive into all nations.

This is the description of the times of the Gentiles.

Was this prophecy fulfilled a long time ago, is the prophecy being fulfilled, or will the prophecy be fulfilled some time in the future?

This was fulfilled in 70 AD in my estimation.

 

[God's Truth]

Luke 21:20-24 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.​

Jerusalem surrounded by armies.
Great distress in the land of Judea.
The people of Judea led away captive into all nations.

This is the description of the times of the Gentiles.

Was this prophecy fulfilled a long time ago, is the prophecy being fulfilled, or will the prophecy be fulfilled some time in the future?

I believe that is when the temple was destroyed.

Jews, Gentiles, and all nationalities can be saved the same way, through belief that Jesus' blood atones for the sins we repent of doing.

 

[Interplanner]

Luke 21:20-24 20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.​

Jerusalem surrounded by armies.
Great distress in the land of Judea.
The people of Judea led away captive into all nations.

This is the description of the times of the Gentiles.

Was this prophecy fulfilled a long time ago, is the prophecy being fulfilled, or will the prophecy be fulfilled some time in the future?

Those warnings were about the Jewish War of 66+. It was the inevitable direction Israel went when they did not largely become the missionaries God wanted them to be. Like Paul. That's why it's that generation, and why Luke used Roman warfare equipment terms but expressions from the 1st destruction of Jerusalem.

 

[Bradley D]

Now we wait the "time of the Gentiles" to come to an end. The Gentiles have been the keepers of the Church. It looks like prophecy expects Jewish believers to rise. Then church will be of both Gentile and Jewish believers. When that occurs then Jesus' return is expected (Luke 21:27).

 

[steko]

'The times of the Gentiles' comprise the time span of the four gentile empires beginning with Babylon, then Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome and then the final ten kings, and culminating with the little horn. Then the Lord will set up the Kingdom which will never end.

 

[Danoh]

'The times of the Gentiles' comprise the time span of the four gentile empires beginning with Babylon, then Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome and then the final ten kings, and culminating with the little horn. Then the Lord will set up the Kingdom which will never end.

Egg-zact-ly

 

[God's Truth]

Now we wait the "time of the Gentiles" to come to an end. The Gentiles have been the keepers of the Church. It looks like prophecy expects Jewish believers to rise. Then church will be of both Gentile and Jewish believers. When that occurs then Jesus' return is expected (Luke 21:27).

The Church is already the Church of all nationalities, Jews included.

 

[God's Truth]

All are Jews who are one INWARDLY. A person who calls themselves 'Jew' are cut off from God because they do not believe the One He sent; just like Gentiles and Greeks.

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

'The times of the Gentiles' comprise the time span of the four gentile empires beginning with Babylon, then Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome and then the final ten kings, and culminating with the little horn. Then the Lord will set up the Kingdom which will never end.

Yes, the time of the Gentiles will not be over until all the nations of the world system are put down and the Lord Jesus reigns, nations the Lord rightfully characterizes as beasts, throughout history (they are like animals, except perhaps that animals would have some excuse for their behavior). Personally, the phrase "times of the Gentiles" has always also brought a reminder there is a remaining week in God's dealing with Israel in this world, the "time of Jacob's trouble." So, in a sense, the period of grace where the Lord is making up His bride, our current time since Pentecost, changes to another time, as God shifts His focus back on Israel and events that culminate in the millennium, events to come much prophesied in the Old and New Testaments.

Jeremiah 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

 

[genuineoriginal]

This was fulfilled in 70 AD in my estimation.

Even the "shall be led away captive into all nations" part?

 

[drbrumley]

Even the "shall be led away captive into all nations" part?

Well, where did they go after Jerusalem was in ruin?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Well, where did they go after Jerusalem was in ruin?

Are you asking about the captivity, or are you asking about something else?

This is what the Bible says is how the captivity of the children of Israel works:

Ezekiel 39:23-28 23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword. 24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them. 25 Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name; 26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid. 27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations; 28 Then shall they know that I am the Lord their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.​

If you read this, you may notice that the captivity consists mainly of being exiled from the land of Israel.
What are the dates for that happening, and when did the captivity end?

This is important because the captivity is said to last until the end of the times of the Gentiles.

 

[Danoh]

Are you asking about the captivity, or are you asking about something else?

This is what the Bible says is how the captivity of the children of Israel works:

Ezekiel 39:23-28 23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword. 24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them. 25 Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name; 26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid. 27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations; 28 Then shall they know that I am the Lord their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.​

If you read this, you may notice that the captivity consists mainly of being exiled from the land of Israel.
What are the dates for that happening, and when did the captivity end?

This is important because the captivity is said to last until the end of the times of the Gentiles.

Read it again - one captivity is negative; the other, positive. And this is consistent throughout their prophet's writings.

To take a thing captive is to take possession of it; one of those two describes Gentile captivity - as a pattern by which Israel can know they have screwed up big time, under the Law, see Daniel 9's prayer.

Another is a description of their being God's people again; back under His Hand of Blessing; the God of their Father's their God once more and in their midst, Jer. 24:7; 31:1, 33, 32:38; Ezek 11:20.

The latter half of Romans two - which is talking about the negative aspect of that (their Gentile captivity) - is concluded in the latter half of Romans 11, which is talking about the positive aspect - their "captivity again" one day unto the Lord - "for - this - is - my - covenant - unto - them - when - I - shall - take - away - their - sins" Rom. 11: 27 looking at Daniel 9:24 as to "thy people, and upon thy holy city," delayed, Thess. 2.

At which point the blessing of the Gentiles prophesied would take place through Israel's rise, Isaiah 61:1-3; Rom. 15:8-12, will be possible - thru Israel's yet future fulness, rather than through, their present fall, Rom. 2-3, 9-11.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Read it again - one captivity is negative; the other, positive.

Read the Old Testament again and pay attention to all the mentions of captivity.
Not one of the references is positive.
Captivity is a negative event.

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

Read the Old Testament again and pay attention to all the mentions of captivity.
Not one of the references is positive.
Captivity is a negative event.

Jeremiah 30:3 For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.

Jeremiah 30

17 For I will restore health unto thee, and I will heal thee of thy wounds, saith the LORD; because they called thee an Outcast, saying, This is Zion, whom no man seeketh after.
18 Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will bring again the captivity of Jacob's tents, and have mercy on his dwellingplaces; and the city shall be builded upon her own heap, and the palace shall remain after the manner thereof.
19 And out of them shall proceed thanksgiving and the voice of them that make merry: and I will multiply them, and they shall not be few; I will also glorify them, and they shall not be small.
20 Their children also shall be as aforetime, and their congregation shall be established before me, and I will punish all that oppress them.

Jeremiah 49

35 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Behold, I will break the bow of Elam, the chief of their might.
36 And upon Elam will I bring the four winds from the four quarters of heaven, and will scatter them toward all those winds; and there shall be no nation whither the outcasts of Elam shall not come.
37 For I will cause Elam to be dismayed before their enemies, and before them that seek their life: and I will bring evil upon them even my fierce anger, saith the LORD; and I will send the sword after them, till I have consumed them:
38 And I will set my throne in Elam, and will destroy from thence the king and the princes, saith the LORD.
39 But it shall come to pass in the latter days, that I will bring again the captivity of Elam [restore her fortunes], saith the LORD.

Etc. Brought back into the captivity of the Lord, which is under the Lord's good graces, is also referenced numerous places in the Old Testament, and, of course, this is a good thing.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Jeremiah 30:3 For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.

Jeremiah 30

17 For I will restore health unto thee, and I will heal thee of thy wounds, saith the LORD; because they called thee an Outcast, saying, This is Zion, whom no man seeketh after.
18 Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will bring again the captivity of Jacob's tents, and have mercy on his dwellingplaces; and the city shall be builded upon her own heap, and the palace shall remain after the manner thereof.
19 And out of them shall proceed thanksgiving and the voice of them that make merry: and I will multiply them, and they shall not be few; I will also glorify them, and they shall not be small.
20 Their children also shall be as aforetime, and their congregation shall be established before me, and I will punish all that oppress them.

Jeremiah 49

35 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Behold, I will break the bow of Elam, the chief of their might.
36 And upon Elam will I bring the four winds from the four quarters of heaven, and will scatter them toward all those winds; and there shall be no nation whither the outcasts of Elam shall not come.
37 For I will cause Elam to be dismayed before their enemies, and before them that seek their life: and I will bring evil upon them even my fierce anger, saith the LORD; and I will send the sword after them, till I have consumed them:
38 And I will set my throne in Elam, and will destroy from thence the king and the princes, saith the LORD.
39 But it shall come to pass in the latter days, that I will bring again the captivity of Elam [restore her fortunes], saith the LORD.

Etc. Brought back into the captivity of the Lord, which is under the Lord's good graces, is also referenced numerous places in the Old Testament, and, of course, this is a good thing.

The verses are speaking of the end of the punishment of captivity.
Captivity is not a reward.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Read it again - one captivity is negative; the other, positive. And this is consistent throughout their prophet's writings.

To take a thing captive is to take possession of it; one of those two describes Gentile captivity - as a pattern by which Israel can know they have screwed up big time, under the Law, see Daniel 9's prayer.

Another is a description of their being God's people again; back under His Hand of Blessing; the God of their Father's their God once more and in their midst, Jer. 24:7; 31:1, 33, 32:38; Ezek 11:20.

The latter half of Romans two - which is talking about the negative aspect of that (their Gentile captivity) - is concluded in the latter half of Romans 11, which is talking about the positive aspect - their "captivity again" one day unto the Lord - "for - this - is - my - covenant - unto - them - when - I - shall - take - away - their - sins" Rom. 11: 27 looking at Daniel 9:24 as to "thy people, and upon thy holy city," delayed, Thess. 2.

At which point the blessing of the Gentiles prophesied would take place through Israel's rise, Isaiah 61:1-3; Rom. 15:8-12, will be possible - thru Israel's yet future fulness, rather than through, their present fall, Rom. 2-3, 9-11.

There is truth in what you say.

However your insistence that Israel is not the continuance of the faithful among the nations since their scattering of all dispersions, and your concentration on the unbelievers descendants of Judaism, hides much truth from you, as does your rejection of Acts ch 1 and 2for the beginning of the Church sent among all nations from where they shall be gathered from..

LA