Peter affirms Paul's writings are Scripture

beameup

New member
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation;
just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort
[wrestle] as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. - 2 Peter 3:13-16

Even Peter found some of Paul's inspired epistles "difficult to understand".
 

Grosnick Marowbe

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Hall of Fame
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation;
just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort
[wrestle] as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. - 2 Peter 3:13-16

Even Peter found some of Paul's inspired epistles "difficult to understand".

Do you think Peter considered himself, untaught and unstable?
 

beameup

New member
Paul was revealing the "Mystery", which was the Gospel of Grace for all mankind.
Peter was preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, ie: the coming of Messiah to
rule over Israel and renew the earth. This new "Gospel" had to be reconciled to Peter's understanding ("difficult to understand").
 

jamie

New member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Paul was revealing the "Mystery", which was the Gospel of Grace for all mankind.
Peter was preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, ie: the coming of Messiah to
rule over Israel and renew the earth. This new "Gospel" had to be reconciled to Peter's understanding ("difficult to understand").

How long will God's kingdom last?

Is it just for a millennial reign?

"Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father" (1 Corinthians 15:24)

The kingdom is the Father's family, it's our universe.
 

Right Divider

Body part
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation;
just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort
[wrestle] as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. - 2 Peter 3:13-16

Even Peter found some of Paul's inspired epistles "difficult to understand".
Most of Churchianity finds them difficult to understand.
 

Danoh

New member
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation;
just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort
[wrestle] as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. - 2 Peter 3:13-16

Even Peter found some of Paul's inspired epistles "difficult to understand".

A guiding principle:

In Scripture, it is often the case that a writer will assert a thing and then immediately follow that with elaborating on what he'd meant by it.

Such is the case in the above by Peter.

He is not saying that what Paul had written had been hard for him to understand.

Not only did he still have Paul himself to explain things to him should he need that, Gal. 2: 7-9; but Peter himself was led of the Spirit to write the Scripture he wrote, 2 Tim. 3:16-17.

Besides, if Peter is referring to himself (especially after asserting that Paul had written to them about the reason for the delay in the Lord's 2nd Coming - His delay of His wrath prior to His return to bless Israel at last, given His Mystery longsuffering, Romans 9) - if Peter is referring to himself, then how would he be able to properly discern who had distorted what?

He is not referring to himself.

For he began that chapter with referring to a time after he would no longer be on this earth.

Peter is actually referring to a time after he and his fellow remaining Apostles, and the Apostle of the Gentiles, would no longer be on this earth.

The actual sense of that passage is that Peter asserts some things written by Paul are hard to understand...

He then follows that by elaborating on what he meant by that - that those who are unstable (who would therefore find said things hard to understand) would be distorting them, as has been done in Peter's and Paul's day, and even prior to them, with the other Scriptures also.

What he is actually doing is ending his thought on the exact same note he began that chapter with - a COMING distortion of things clear in Scripture on the reason for the delay in the Lord's promised return that some would be calling into question in THEIR instability, 2 Peter 3: 3-5.

The opposite of that being "ROOTED and built up" that is to say, being "STABLISHED in the faith, AS YE HAVE BEEN TAUGHT, " and as a result able to be "ABOUNDING therein with thanksgiving" Col. 2:7.

Which is the issue of knowing what's what; what goes where; and so on...

In contrast to the unstable in their ignorance are Peter and his readers' assurance - "but we, according to his promise..."

Thus, his words earlier, in...

2 Peter 1: 12 Wherefore I will not be negligent to put you always in remembrance of these things, though he know them, and be established in the present truth.

Another guiding principle being that of...

Just a matter of 2 Tim. 2:15's "study to" (spoudazo: be diligent to) being a bit more consistent where following the overall flow of thought of any Scripture writers complete narrative is concerned.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

In memory of Rom. 5: 6-8 - in each our stead.
 

beameup

New member
Most of Churchianity finds them difficult to understand.

Yes "right divider", it is confusing to some when you have two gospels.
You have the gospel that Jesus preached to Israel, and then
you have the gospel that was revealed to Paul after he was saved.
 

beameup

New member
How long will God's kingdom last?

Is it just for a millennial reign?

"Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father" (1 Corinthians 15:24)

The kingdom is the Father's family, it's our universe.

The "Millennium" (1,000 years) is a temporary state because, in the end, man will again rebel.
Following that, the New Heavens and New Earth will be created "wherein dwells righteousness".
 

jamie

New member
LIFETIME MEMBER
The "Millennium" (1,000 years) is a temporary state because, in the end, man will again rebel.
Following that, the New Heavens and New Earth will be created "wherein dwells righteousness".

What happens then?
 

beameup

New member
That's not what Revelation 20 says!

after these things he must be released for a short time (to deceive the nations)
Then:
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away
 

clefty

New member
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation;
just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort
[wrestle] as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. - 2 Peter 3:13-16

Even Peter found some of Paul's inspired epistles "difficult to understand".

“While Jesus was on earth, he and his disciples practiced the religion that God gave to the Israelites through Moses. The guidelines they followed were found primarily in the Torah*, which is the first five books of the Old Testament -- the writings of Moses. The Torah contains a variety of information including history, the Ten Commandments, and instructions pertaining to finance, government, family, health, farming, dress, feasts, and worship.

It was at some time after the death of Jesus that Christians stopped observing the Old Testament laws. Exactly when that change occurred is not clear in the Bible. Many people believe the change was made by Jesus himself immediately after the resurrection. However, there is compelling evidence in the book of Acts that the change did not occur until much later.

This article examines all the evidence in the book of Acts that indicates whether or not the apostles and early Christians were still following the Old Testament laws. The context of the story is important. It would be a good idea to read the whole book of Acts to understand the passages covered in this study.”

http://www.fogwhistle.ca/acts/evidence.html

Paul was not a hypocrite living one way teaching another...
 

beameup

New member
“While Jesus was on earth, he and his disciples practiced the religion that God gave to the Israelites through Moses. The guidelines they followed were found primarily in the Torah*, which is the first five books of the Old Testament -- the writings of Moses. The Torah contains a variety of information including history, the Ten Commandments, and instructions pertaining to finance, government, family, health, farming, dress, feasts, and worship.

It was at some time after the death of Jesus that Christians stopped observing the Old Testament laws. Exactly when that change occurred is not clear in the Bible. Many people believe the change was made by Jesus himself immediately after the resurrection. However, there is compelling evidence in the book of Acts that the change did not occur until much later.

This article examines all the evidence in the book of Acts that indicates whether or not the apostles and early Christians were still following the Old Testament laws. The context of the story is important. It would be a good idea to read the whole book of Acts to understand the passages covered in this study.”

http://www.fogwhistle.ca/acts/evidence.html

Paul was not a hypocrite living one way teaching another...

There are records of Jewish Messianic Synagogues into the 2nd century A.D.
So, there were parallel congregations of Gentiles and Jews simultaneously for awhile.
After that, there was an effort by Gentiles to completely distance themselves from Judaism,
which led to Catholicism and the persecution of Jews. :)
 

clefty

New member
There are records of Jewish Messianic Synagogues into the 2nd century A.D.
So, there were parallel congregations of Gentiles and Jews simultaneously for awhile.
After that, there was an effort by Gentiles to completely distance themselves from Judaism,
which led to Catholicism and the persecution of Jews. :)

Indeed...known as “the Way” Paul affirmed he was a member...
Myriads of other believing jews were still zealous for the Law... Acts 21:20

Act 9:2 and asked him for letters to the synagogues at Damascus, so that if he found any belonging to the Way, men or women, he might bring them bound to Jerusalem.
Act 19:9 But when some became stubborn and continued in unbelief, speaking evil of the Way before the congregation, he withdrew from them and took the disciples with him, reasoning daily in the hall of Tyrannus.
Act 19:23 About that time there arose no little disturbance concerning the Way.
Act 24:14 But this I confess to you, that according to the Way, which they call a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the Law and written in the Prophets,
Act 24:22 But Felix, having a rather accurate knowledge of the Way, put them off, saying, “When Lysias the tribune comes down, I will decide your case.”

So Paul didnt even call himself Christian...maybe cuz they were already meeting Sundays and then for Ham dinners...
 
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