ECT I should have initiated my threads here!
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oatmeal
Well-known member
Why a resurrection if all are alive not dead?
Why bother coming back for a body if you have been in heavenly bliss without a body for hundreds and hundreds of years?
For that matter, why should we rise from the dead if we are already alive?
Why should we rise from the dead if we are not dead?
If we are not dead when we die, why does god call the dead dead?
I Thessalonians 4:16
Does alive and dead then mean the same thing?
Then why doesn't good and evil mean the same thing?
Why does darkness and light mean the same thing?
Why doesn't love and hate mean the same thing?
Why bother coming back for a body if you have been in heavenly bliss without a body for hundreds and hundreds of years?
For that matter, why should we rise from the dead if we are already alive?
Why should we rise from the dead if we are not dead?
If we are not dead when we die, why does god call the dead dead?
I Thessalonians 4:16
Does alive and dead then mean the same thing?
Then why doesn't good and evil mean the same thing?
Why does darkness and light mean the same thing?
Why doesn't love and hate mean the same thing?
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Being alive does not imply consciousness.
Christ bestows eternal life on those who are his.
Eternal life is contrary to death, but not contrary to sleep.
"Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed — in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." (1 Corinthians 15:51-52)
Interplanner
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Study what it means to be 'asleep in the Lord' first.
Anyone seeking to chat rather than post here is welcome to write me at interplanner122@gmail.com.
"And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment" (Hebrews 9:27)
Everyone must die once ... it is appointed and is known as physical death.
But the emphasis is on the word once.
It is possible to die twice, but that's not necessary.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Even you scripture refers to the dead as dead.
the use of the term "sleep" is a euphemism for death.
For those of the believers who die, the word sleeps fits for they will awake, when I Thessalonians 4:13-17 occurs. then the dead in Christ shall rise first.
See, God refers them as dead, but the figure euphemism is less harsh than dead.
And why not use the euphemism?
oatmeal
Well-known member
Do those with eternal life die spiritually or physically?
"But concerning the dead, that they rise, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the burning bush passage, how God spoke to him, saying, 'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'? He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living. You are therefore greatly mistaken." (Mark 12:26-27)
Some of the dead are dead, but some of the dead live in sleep.
Interplanner
Well-known member
It is an attempt to synchronize heaven's time and our time. In relation to the final judgement, those believers who have died already are 'asleep in the Lord' and we will all be awake for that event when it comes.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Hebrews 9:7 is commonly quoted. It is mistakenly applied across the board to all humans that have ever lived or will live.
However, those of us in this age of grace are not included in those appointed to die once for our judgement is already accomplished, is it not?
Have we not already been judged and justified? Romans 5:1
Have we not received the righteousness of God? II Corinthians 5:21
How do find fault with someone who has the righteousness of God?
How righteous is God?
Who would dare find fault with God.
There is a bema that we will be judged at, but not for wrongdoings for we have been justified, but for rewards for our service to God.
However, the context of Hebrews 9:7 is the sacrifices required by the law and how because of judgement they were required to do so, but that Jesus had to sacrifice himself only once.
glorydaz
Well-known member
I think you're incorrect. This doesn't belong in ECT since it looks like you're in the mood for MOCKERY.
oatmeal
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I Thessalonians 4:13-18 is the promise of ever being with the Lord.
We have already been judged justified and righteous. Romans 5:1, II Corinthians 5:21
How do you read those verses?
oatmeal
Well-known member
I think you are erroneous in your criticism, aren't you?
Can you answer my questions from scripture?
Why not?
oatmeal
Well-known member
Scripture states that "I would that ye all speak with tongues..." I Corinthians 14:5
and that those that are spiritual.. I Corinthians 14:37
I say that believers speak in tongues is a commandment of the Lord
What do you say?
Yes, flesh and blood mortals die. We can die physically or we can die spiritually. It's our choice.
No one can be judged before they die according to Jesus. Since he died he would know.
"And if anyone hears My words and does not believe, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world but to save the world." (John 12:47)
We don't live until we die.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Those who are believers, yes, already have passed from death to life, from condemnation to justification. I think the 'asleep in the Lord' expression was given to help believers on earth understand what they needed to know in the meanwhile until death or the end of time.
The age of grace began with righteous Abel.
And if we judge ourselves by God's standard we won't be judged.
That standard is our Father's covenant.
Hi and I believe I know what you are asking !!
We do not get a new body unril Christ comes back for His BODY as written in 1 Cor 15:51 and 52 when we will be TRANSFORMED !!
Your question then is BUT what of those who die BEFORE Christ coming for the B O C ??
Is this your DILEMMA and your question ?
I believe if it is that 2 Cor 5:1 should be the answer !!
dan p
glorydaz
Well-known member
Sure I can answer, Oatmeal, but I hardly think your post deserves an answer.
The body is resurrected after we die physically.
You'll have no choice....even if you are one in "heavenly bliss". :chuckle:
asked and answered (above)
That verse is talking about those IN CHRIST (saved) who have already physically died before His return.
I guess they do to you, Oats. Try reading the verses in context next time.
Here is Oats mocking the Bible. Shame on you, Oatmeal. :nono:
The body is resurrected after we die physically.
Hebrews 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Acts 24:15And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.
You'll have no choice....even if you are one in "heavenly bliss". :chuckle:
1 Cor. 15:35-38 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain: But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
asked and answered (above)
That verse is talking about those IN CHRIST (saved) who have already physically died before His return.
I guess they do to you, Oats. Try reading the verses in context next time.
Here is Oats mocking the Bible. Shame on you, Oatmeal. :nono:
glorydaz
Well-known member
DAN, you're so much nicer than I am. :thumb:
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