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  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Your belief in the bible as God's infallible, inerrant word, is speculative at best. You need to receive a divine deposit of knowledge for the bible to be profitable to you for instruction or it will kill you. The bible will literally kill you. It's a two edged sword. Without the Holy Spirit, you will only increase your wickedness, if you study the bible.
    Lamont, you would have no objective knowledge, about the true LORD God of the universe, w/o the book, of objective, true words, the book by which He choose to reveal Himself to mankind, the book by which He deemed we objectively know Him. What? This YHWH tapped you on the shoulder, came to you in a dream ,through His Spirit? You confuse objective truth, through objective words, with interpretation/understanding/illumination, via the Holy Spirit of God.


    A Muslim to you: Allah is God. My Koran, and the Holy Spirit, confirmed it.


    You: Right on, "brother!"

    Leave a comment:


  • RealityJerk
    replied
    Originally posted by john w View Post
    You quote the bible, allegedly, and ask:





    Really, Lamont?

    Translation: Here is the bible, which I, Lamont, doubt, assert has errors, and yet I will quote it, as part of my premise("reasons for a conclusion").
    Yes, the bible contains God's word and much truth. It's a holy book for the children of God, and a stumbling block and source of condemnation for the wicked.

    Leave a comment:


  • RealityJerk
    replied
    Originally posted by john w View Post
    Source?
    Both the bible and the Holy Spirit.

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    The prerequisite for anyone to be saved from destruction, is Christ's work on the cross and His resurrection. It doesn't matter how good you are, if Christ hadn't died on that cross and risen from the dead, we would all be doomed to destruction, due to the original sin. The first Adam's fall, effected everyone, whether good or not, saint and sinner, all died and perished, without recourse of a resurrection.

    Now we're living in the age after Christ's resurrection, hence all people on earth, every human being, will be risen from the dead and judged. Saint and sinner, unlike before, now have an opportunity to inherit eternal life, in God's Kingdom. So, you and I will be judged according to our deeds. That's the standard established by Christ, the judge appointed by the heavenly Father. The infinite, eternal, Creator, YHWH, has appointed His Son, as King, Judge and High priest. Our deeds, the way we live, will determine our eternal destiny.

    If you are of the elect, born again/born from above, you will reign with Christ over the nations. You're a member of His royal family. You won't suffer the torment of the first death. You won't go to the abyss as most of humanity does. You will enter God's Kingdom, at the point of death, into a realm where you will wait for the resurrection. It's a pleasant rest and dream like environment. You won't be tormented by demons in the abyss. If you're not a Christian, born again, regenerated, then you will go to the dark abyss, where you might be summoned by demons, tormented. You will mostly sleep and also experience a nightmarish condition, when you are semi-awake.

    The demons and the living (human beings when alive, like necromancers, magicians), have the power to summon the human dead. The witch of Endor, summoned Samuel from his sleep or rest. He was a righteous prophet, but he was in the abyss. He was protected somewhat, but still vulnerable to being summoned. This ends with Christ. If you're in Christ, you don't have to worry about that.

    Everyone who is in the abyss, will not be thrown into the lake of fire. Only the wicked, those who were extremely evil, here on earth when alive, and those who might not have been so evil, but once summoned in the abyss they chose to serve the demonic forces, authorities that summoned them. To remain conscious, they do the bidding of the devil and his minions, becoming a demonic minion themselves.

    Those who get to the resurrection, without serving the devil, who died in this life, as relatively good people, and didn't serve the devil when in the abyss, will become part of the nations that are shepherd by the elect. The bride of Christ. Those who are part of Christ's royal family, His bride, will become angels. Like the angels/essentially. True Christians will become like Jesus and His angels. We will serve as ministering spirits. No flesh and blood will inherit the Kingdom Of God (We get resurrection bodies, unlike the nations). The nations will have access to the tree of life (what exactly that entrails is a mystery) and humanity will spread throughout the universe, as originally intended by YHWH.

    And like I just mentioned, the true Christians or elect, the Bride of Christ, will be the angels of that Aeon/Age. Eventually, many of the people of the nations will eventually inherit the same nature as the elect, becoming angels themselves. That is the eternal destiny of the living ones. YHWH is the Living God of the Living, not the dead. It's an eternal journey, form holiness to holiness, glory to glory, power to power, ascending, closer and closer to the Heavenly Father's Infinite Light.

    You quote the bible, allegedly, and ask:


    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    What evidence do you have for your bible?

    Really, Lamont?

    Translation: Here is the bible, which I, Lamont, doubt, assert has errors, and yet I will quote it, as part of my premise("reasons for a conclusion").

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    What "facts" are you referring to? What evidence "proves" the "facts" of the bible? It's not that difficult to reasonable assume that Julius Caesar existed.
    Scientific evidence-empirical-"taste, sight, touch, smell, and hearing."

    Have you ever seen, touched, smelled,tasted, heard Caesar?


    How do you know he existed? Offer evidence.

    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Many heads of states, kings, emperors have existed in the past and it's not an extraordinary proposition.
    So? How is that evidence of the existence of a specific person, named "Julius Caesar?" Because you deem it :reasonable"-below?"

    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    A man lived thousands of years ago who was emperor of an empire. Yeah? Big deal. If you tell me Caesar had a pet dragon and shot lasers out of his eyes, that's unreasonable, unless you have some really really good evidence.
    So, Lamont, your "evidence, is that "it seems reasonable?" Really? That's it, Lamont? Reasonable tou you, eh, Lamont?
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    What evidence do you have for your bible?
    Seems reasonable.


    See how that works, Lamont? You taught me that-I learned that from you.
    Last edited by john w; December 6th, 2017, 05:16 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • RealityJerk
    replied
    Originally posted by john w View Post
    Made up. There is more evidence of the facts of the bible, than that Julius Caesar existed.


    Prove wind exists.
    What "facts" are you referring to? What evidence "proves" the "facts" of the bible? It's not that difficult to reasonable assume that Julius Caesar existed. Many heads of states, kings, emperors have existed in the past and it's not an extraordinary proposition. A man lived thousands of years ago who was emperor of an empire. Yeah? Big deal. If you tell me Caesar had a pet dragon and shot lasers out of his eyes, that's unreasonable, unless you have some really really good evidence.

    What evidence do you have for your bible?

    Leave a comment:


  • meshak
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post

    Your belief in the bible as God's infallible, inerrant word, is speculative at best. You need to receive a divine deposit of knowledge for the bible to be profitable to you for instruction or it will kill you. The bible will literally kill you. It's a two edged sword. Without the Holy Spirit, you will only increase your wickedness, if you study the bible.
    make sense and insightful.

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Exactly, you just proved my point. I can't absolutely prove to you that I exist, but it's quite reasonable to assume I do, don't you think?

    Why do you believe the bible is the inerrant, infallible word of God? How is that a reasonable assumption?
    So, you cannot offer evidence, "proof," that you/Washington exists/existed?

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    The prerequisite for anyone to be saved from destruction, is Christ's work on the cross and His resurrection. It doesn't matter how good you are, if Christ hadn't died on that cross and risen from the dead, we would all be doomed to destruction, due to the original sin. The first Adam's fall, effected everyone, whether good or not, saint and sinner, all died and perished, without recourse of a resurrection.

    Now we're living in the age after Christ's resurrection, hence all people on earth, every human being, will be risen from the dead and judged. Saint and sinner, unlike before, now have an opportunity to inherit eternal life, in God's Kingdom. So, you and I will be judged according to our deeds. That's the standard established by Christ, the judge appointed by the heavenly Father. The infinite, eternal, Creator, YHWH, has appointed His Son, as King, Judge and High priest. Our deeds, the way we live, will determine our eternal destiny.

    If you are of the elect, born again/born from above, you will reign with Christ over the nations. You're a member of His royal family. You won't suffer the torment of the first death. You won't go to the abyss as most of humanity does. You will enter God's Kingdom, at the point of death, into a realm where you will wait for the resurrection. It's a pleasant rest and dream like environment. You won't be tormented by demons in the abyss. If you're not a Christian, born again, regenerated, then you will go to the dark abyss, where you might be summoned by demons, tormented. You will mostly sleep and also experience a nightmarish condition, when you are semi-awake.

    The demons and the living (human beings when alive, like necromancers, magicians), have the power to summon the human dead. The witch of Endor, summoned Samuel from his sleep or rest. He was a righteous prophet, but he was in the abyss. He was protected somewhat, but still vulnerable to being summoned. This ends with Christ. If you're in Christ, you don't have to worry about that.

    Everyone who is in the abyss, will not be thrown into the lake of fire. Only the wicked, those who were extremely evil, here on earth when alive, and those who might not have been so evil, but once summoned in the abyss they chose to serve the demonic forces, authorities that summoned them. To remain conscious, they do the bidding of the devil and his minions, becoming a demonic minion themselves.

    Those who get to the resurrection, without serving the devil, who died in this life, as relatively good people, and didn't serve the devil when in the abyss, will become part of the nations that are shepherd by the elect. The bride of Christ. Those who are part of Christ's royal family, His bride, will become angels. Like the angels/essentially. True Christians will become like Jesus and His angels. We will serve as ministering spirits. No flesh and blood will inherit the Kingdom Of God (We get resurrection bodies, unlike the nations). The nations will have access to the tree of life (what exactly that entrails is a mystery) and humanity will spread throughout the universe, as originally intended by YHWH.

    And like I just mentioned, the true Christians or elect, the Bride of Christ, will be the angels of that Aeon/Age. Eventually, many of the people of the nations will eventually inherit the same nature as the elect, becoming angels themselves. That is the eternal destiny of the living ones. YHWH is the Living God of the Living, not the dead. It's an eternal journey, form holiness to holiness, glory to glory, power to power, ascending, closer and closer to the Heavenly Father's Infinite Light.
    Source?

    Leave a comment:


  • RealityJerk
    replied
    Originally posted by john w View Post
    Prove you exist.

    Prove George Washington existed.
    Exactly, you just proved my point. I can't absolutely prove to you that I exist, but it's quite reasonable to assume I do, don't you think?

    Why do you believe the bible is the inerrant, infallible word of God? How is that a reasonable assumption?

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Your belief in the bible as God's infallible, inerrant word, is speculative at best. You need to receive a divine deposit of knowledge for the bible to be profitable to you for instruction or it will kill you. The bible will literally kill you. It's a two edged sword. Without the Holy Spirit, you will only increase your wickedness, if you study the bible.
    Made up. There is more evidence of the facts of the bible, than that Julius Caesar existed.


    Prove wind exists.

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Really? Your "biblical faith" is based on facts and evidence? Prove it.


    Prove you exist.

    Prove George Washington existed.

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Subjective doesn't equate "relative".
    Lamont just has no clue as to the difference between knowing objective truth, confusing faith with absolute knowledge...........................and clueless as to the objective definition of faith, and the term "subject," mixing belief, with the existence of objective truth.

    I'm done. A 6 year old can see his self refuting "argument."
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Exactly, it's all subjectivity. Everything is subjective, the only reality that isn't is you. Everything else outside of you is an assumption and on faith….. The only objective truth is your own experience and consciousness, everything outside of you is subject to faith and belief… All truth is perceived and known subjectively, not objectively…… Because you can't know anything, other than subjectively……. I said the truth can only be known subjectively. That is a true statement…]

    Translation: Everything he posts, is his subjective truth, cannot be known objectively.

    Leave a comment:


  • RealityJerk
    replied
    Originally posted by john w View Post
    Wrong biblical definition of "faith," and subjectivity/objectivity. All biblical faith, and most "secular" faith, is based upon facts/evidence.
    Really? Your "biblical faith" is based on facts and evidence? Prove it.

    Originally posted by john w View Post

    You confuse objectivity, with the concept of "absolute knowledge," that humans do not have.
    The only absolute knowledge or fact, that we know absolutely, is that we exist. That's a subjective truth, but truth nonetheless. It's only relative to whether you exist or not. Subjective reality, that which can not be proven absolutely, outside of yourself, is on faith. Belief.


    Originally posted by john w View Post
    I do not have to know, "absolutely," all the scientific reasons as to why an airplane can fly, i.e., lift..................But, based upon the facts, evidence, i.e., I see it take off, witnesses tell me(eyewitness testimony)...................that airplanes fly-objective truth, not subjective truth.
    It's objectively true, relative to there being a sentient, conscious being to allow it to be "true". Consciousness is the substrate or root of reality, that conceived and sustains the laws of physics, allowing that plane to fly. So a plane flies thanks to a subjective, sentient reality, not an "objective" one. All is sentience and relative, to God allowing the conditions for that perceivable, objective reality to exist. I never proposed that objective reality, truth, doesn't exist outside of human awareness or consciousness.

    The most basic truth is your own existence. That's the absolute point of certainty within your experience, and that's where God will commune with you, provided you're actually in a position to receive from Him.

    Your belief in the bible as God's infallible, inerrant word, is speculative at best. You need to receive a divine deposit of knowledge for the bible to be profitable to you for instruction or it will kill you. The bible will literally kill you. It's a two edged sword. Without the Holy Spirit, you will only increase your wickedness, if you study the bible.

    Leave a comment:


  • john w
    replied
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    I never said all truth is relative. That's your straw man.
    Vs.

    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    Exactly, it's all subjectivity. Everything is subjective, the only reality that isn't is you. Everything else outside of you is an assumption and on faith….. The only objective truth is your own experience and consciousness, everything outside of you is subject to faith and belief… All truth is perceived and known subjectively, not objectively…… Because you can't know anything, other than subjectively……. I said the truth can only be known subjectively. That is a true statement…
    The idiot confuses knowing objective truth, vs. the fact whether objective truth exists.


    You're new name is Lamont.


    Watch:
    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    All truth is perceived and known subjectively, not objectively..
    Is the above statement subjective/relative, or objective?


    If all truth is relative/subjective,then the statement itself,"all truth is relative/subjective," would be relative/subjective, and not objectively true. In other words, you are arguing that it is objectively true that all truth is relative.

    I ask: "Is that a relative truth?"

    Originally posted by RealityJerk View Post
    I said the truth can only be known subjectively. That is a true statement.

    Is your assertion that "the truth can only be known subjectively" an objectively true statement?

    Kaboom!


    A 6 year old can see your argument that commits suicide.

    Leave a comment:

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