ECT Help needed. Best Rebuttals to Jews For Judaism

[Jerry Shugart]

Not if the "new" earth is the same old earth but "renewed". It's just semantics really but the result is the same. God said "see, I am making everything new" Revelation 21:5 and Acts 3:21 says " Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.". You see when God makes everything new again, he's probably just going to renew the existing earth, which means the existing land will still be there on the "new" earth.

So you think that the "new heaven and a new earth" spoken of at Revelation 21:1 is just the present earth and heaven restored. I would say that it is not restored but instead something entirely different:

"And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof" (Rev.21:24).​

The throne of God is in the new earth and the new heaven (Rev.21:5-7) and the LORD God dwells in the eternal state:

"For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones" (Isa.57:15).​

Are you willing to argue that the land which the LORD gave Jacob exists in the eternal state, which is described as "the high and holy place"?

Are you not aware that land is right here on the earth at the present time?

 

[7djengo7]

Don't you know that Jesus himself said he now has all power and authority?

He said all power and authority was given to him in heaven and on earth. (Matthew 28:18)

Matthew 28:18 KJV: And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Looks like I'm going to have to be a little bit more precise with my wording

I'll say! You aren't even careful about quoting Scripture.

No. I don't know that Jesus said "all power and authority". I know, from the Bible, that Jesus said "all power". Do you disagree?

Don't you know that Jesus Himself said that all power is given to him IN EARTH?

Why are you questioning me about it? If Jesus says he has all power and authority, then that means he has all power and authority.

Why are you questioning me about what Jesus said? You can't even quote Matthew 28:18 correctly, concerning what Jesus said.

You're still not making any sense. If you have a point to make, make it.

You're still playing stupid.

Did Jesus say all power is given to him IN EARTH? Yes or No?
Is the office of POTUS power IN EARTH? Yes or No?

Feel free to tell us why you imagine the verse that you failed to accurately quote has anything, whatsoever, to do with the question of whether or not Jesus will ever be a king on earth. Tell us why you imagine that, from Matthew 28:18, you've somehow learned that "No one can have all power and authority and not be king":

(Matthew 28:18) No one can have all power and authority and not be king.

Or, instead, if you want to continue to play stupid, be my guest.

 

[7djengo7]

I really don't know what you're going on about here with POTUS. Such a strange analogy.

Nah, you're just playing stupid is all. You're no idiot, which is why you knew you needed to stonewall against the question I asked you:

Can someone have ALL power and not be POTUS?

No one can have all power and authority and not be king.

You say that someone cannot have ALL power and authority and not be king. So, you have to explain why someone can have ALL power and authority and not be POTUS--unless you wish to say that the office of POTUS is neither power nor authority.

That's why you're playing stupid--for the purpose of trying (in futility) to hide the fact that you're stonewalling against the simple question I asked you:

Can someone have ALL power IN EARTH and not be POTUS? Yes or No?

 

[7djengo7]

This post is worse than useless.

Ah, you're mistaken. It served its purpose as a depth sounder. The report I received through it: "Shallow, very shallow."

 

[7djengo7]

Looks like I'm going to have to be a little bit more precise with my wording for you to understand.

Why would you not, as a matter of course, always strive to be as precise as you can be, in all your wording, insofar as you're trying to engage in polemic?

What I mean is that the only single reference in scripture to "the thousand years", does not say that Jesus will reign on earth during those thousand years, only that he will reign.

Oh? Then where--according to "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'"--will Jesus reign during those thousand years?

So you can not claim that scripture says he will reign on earth for a thousand years

But you can claim that "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'" says He will NOT reign on earth for a thousand years?

Scripture does not say this reign of Christ requires him to be on earth. It simply doesn't.

But "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'" says this reign of Christ requires Him to NOT be on earth?

I mean, we are currently living during the reign of Christ, that reign which we refer to as "the thousand years".

And this is according to what? Is it according to whatever it is you call "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'"? Please quote the entirety of whatever you are calling "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'", and then tell us why you imagine it says that "we are currently living during the reign of Christ, that reign which we refer to as 'the thousand years'".

And, no, Christ is not on earth during his reign, but we are.

Is it according to "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'" that you say so?

Remember what you said:

my point about there being no reference to earth during the thousand years

So, from whatever it is you call "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'", how is it that you have extracted your teachings that--

• Christ is not on earth during the 1,000 years, and that
• we are on earth during the 1,000 years

--despite your claim that "there is no reference to earth", therein?

If, in a passage, there is no reference to earth, then the passage, ipso facto, does not say that Christ is not on earth, and it does not say that we are on earth.

So, how does "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'" help you? That's right: it does not help you at all. Rather, it lets you down.

Jesus has all power and authority, which makes him King, but he doesn't have to be on earth in order to be that King.

Which makes him King of what? Quote whatever Scripture you'd say tells you that Jesus having ALL power and authority MAKES Him King. And, tell us why Jesus having ALL power and authority FAILS TO MAKE Him POTUS.

 

[7djengo7]

The thousand years is a symbolic term relating to an unspecified period of time. Don't you know that Jesus currently reigns? He said all power and authority was given to him in heaven and on earth. (Matthew 28:18) No one can have all power and authority and not be king. Therefore we know that the thousand years is now.

VS​

What I mean is that [highlight]the only single reference in scripture to "the thousand years"[/highlight], does not say that Jesus will reign on earth during those thousand years, only that he will reign.

Is Matthew 28:18 the passage to which you are referring as "the only single reference in scripture to 'the thousand years'", or not?

If not, then so much for your "therefore we know that the thousand years is now", inasmuch as you have admitted that Matthew 28:18 is no reference to the thousand years. Since Matthew 28:18 is no reference to the thousand years, then why are you trying to make what Jesus says in that passage to be a reference to the thousand years?

And, was Jesus not on earth when He spoke His words recorded in Matthew 28:18 KJV, where he said "All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth"?

Yet, remember what you said:

No one can have all power and authority and not be king.

AND​

And, no, Christ is not on earth during his reign, but we are.

Was the event of Jesus speaking the words He spoke in Matthew 28:18 ("All power is given...")--WHILE STILL ON EARTH--an event occurring during His reign, or not?

If it was during His reign that He spoke those words, WHILE ON EARTH, then why would you say that "Christ is not on earth during his reign"? For, in that case, He must have been on earth during a part of His reign, because He was standing there, face to face with His disciples, speaking those words to them, prior to His ascension.

Back to the drawing board for you.

 

[7djengo7]

Excellent posts!!!

Excellent posts!!!

David was anointed king long before he actually began to rule Israel.
The "throne" is about ruling as king, not just being a king.

Jeconiah (also called Jehoiachin and Coniah) was a king when he was taken away to Babylon, but he no longer ruled.

The risen Lord Jesus Christ has not yet ruled over Israel.

This goes very well with this:

Luk 19:12 KJV He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.​

:first::first:​

 

[7djengo7]

Good. So knowing that Jesus currently has all authority and power, you must then also believe that he's currently sitting on the throne of David. Correct?

You say that Jesus currently has all authority and power. Would you say that Jesus had all authority and power before His Ascension, while He was still on earth? If so, you must then believe that He was sitting on the throne of David while He was still on earth. Correct?

The thousand years is a symbolic term relating to an unspecified period of time. Don't you know that Jesus currently reigns?

So unspecified a period of time that you cannot even at least tell us exactly when you imagine it began--since you imagine it has already begun, and is currently in progress?

We're waiting to hear from you whether or not the thousand years commenced while Jesus was still ON EARTH.

 

[7djengo7]

***Accidentally replied to my own post when I intended merely to edit it. Sorry about that.***