ECT Lust

[elohiym]

Romans 7:7 ... for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.​

When the word lust is use according to it's strict English definition, it means very strong sexual desire. However, when lust is used in the Bible, it means covet because the underlying Greek word means covet not strong sexual desire, as we see in the NASB translation:

Romans 7:7 ... I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."​

When Jesus used the word lust, he meant coveting, not strong sexual desire.

Matthew 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.​

Here's the Greek word he used:

1937 epithyméō (from 1909 /epí, "focused on" intensifying 2372 /thymós, "passionate desire") – properly, to show focused passion as it aptly builds on (Gk epi, "upon") what a person truly yearns for; to "greatly desire to do or have something – 'to long for, to desire very much' " (L & N, 1, 25.12).​

He was referring to the commandment:

Exodus 20:17 "You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor."​

If we were to interpret the word lust in Romans 7:7 KJV and Matthew 5:27-28 to mean lust strictly according to English definition of the word, a single man could not become sexually aroused by a single woman without sinning. Surely, Jesus didn't mean to convey such an idea but was rather magnifying the commandment to not covet.

Discuss.

 

[The Berean]

Lust has always had a broader meaning, no?

"Lust for power."

"Lust for money."

 

[meshak]

Lust has always had a broader meaning, no?

"Lust for power."

"Lust for money."

Yes.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Romans 7:7 ... for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.​

The KJV says "sin" instead of "lust".

Discuss.

It depends on what context you're using the word "lust" in. I doubt that many men sexually lust after their neighbor's nice sports car, but do covet it as in wanting it for their own.

On the other hand, since sexual desire is natural for mankind, lusting after your neighbor's wife would obviously mean having sexual desires for her.

 

[patrick jane]

Lust has always had a broader meaning, no?

"Lust for power."

"Lust for money."

All of the above goes back to self - selfishness. Every crime and every sin

 

[The Berean]

It depends on what context you're using the word "lust" in. I doubt that many men sexually lust after their neighbor's nice sports car, but do covet it as in wanting it for their own.

On the other hand, since sexual desire is natural for mankind, lusting after your neighbor's wife would obviously mean having sexual desires for her.

I was just going to post this. :up:

All of the above goes back to self - selfishness. Every crime and every sin

I agree.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I was just going to post this. :up:

Great minds think alike.

 

[The Berean]

Great minds think alike.

:chuckle:

 

[elohiym]

Lust has always had a broader meaning, no?

"Lust for power."

"Lust for money."

Yes, but when we say lust for women aren't we saying coveting them, like we mean coveting power or money?

 

[patrick jane]

Yes, but when we say lust for women aren't we saying coveting them, like we mean coveting power or money?

I think lust for a woman means sexual desire, no two ways about it.

 

[elohiym]

The KJV says "sin" instead of "lust".

I noted the meaning of the Greek word seems to equate to covetousness, not sexual attraction.

It depends on what context you're using the word "lust" in. I doubt that many men sexually lust after their neighbor's nice sports car, but do covet it as in wanting it for their own.

Yes, I agree. When they want it for their own: that's what Jesus meant by lust and adultery in your heart.

On the other hand, since sexual desire is natural for mankind, lusting after your neighbor's wife would obviously mean having sexual desires for her.

That's a valid point. I don't deny that sexual desire could be part of the man's covetousness, just question if sexual attraction or arousal equates to sexual desire in the sense of wanting to take another man's wife.

 

[elohiym]

I think lust for a woman means sexual desire, no two ways about it.

Does covetousness for another man's wife necessarily mean sexual desire? If it doesn't then lust, if it means covetousness, doesn't necessarily mean sexual desire. An example: a man wants another man's wife for her money, not for her body. Happens.

 

[elohiym]

Also, if lust for a woman means sexual desire, doesn't that imply that at least some lust isn't immoral? For example, if lust is sexual desire, I can lust my wife?

But ... Lust in the Bible is used in a strictly immoral sense, is it not? That's why I have to read it as covet, not lust.

 

[Crucible]

Lust is almost always meant as sexual desire.

But technically, it means 'an illicit and uncontrollable appetite'. We could call over eating a 'lust', but instead we call it 'gluttony'. Gluttony is over-indulgence.

It's all just semantics.

 

[DAN P]

Romans 7:7 ... for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.​

When the word lust is use according to it's strict English definition, it means very strong sexual desire. However, when lust is used in the Bible, it means covet because the underlying Greek word means covet not strong sexual desire, as we see in the NASB translation:

Romans 7:7 ... I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."​

When Jesus used the word lust, he meant coveting, not strong sexual desire.

Matthew 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.​

Here's the Greek word he used:

1937 epithyméō (from 1909 /epí, "focused on" intensifying 2372 /thymós, "passionate desire") – properly, to show focused passion as it aptly builds on (Gk epi, "upon") what a person truly yearns for; to "greatly desire to do or have something – 'to long for, to desire very much' " (L & N, 1, 25.12).​

He was referring to the commandment:

Exodus 20:17 "You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor."​

If we were to interpret the word lust in Romans 7:7 KJV and Matthew 5:27-28 to mean lust strictly according to English definition of the word, a single man could not become sexually aroused by a single woman without sinning. Surely, Jesus didn't mean to convey such an idea but was rather magnifying the commandment to not covet.

Discuss.

Hi and it is only fair to say , that the Greek word EPTHYMIA is a transliterated word and can also be translated DESIRE and has the following meaning in English :

#1 , Desire

#2 , Craving

#3 , Longing

#4, A desire for what is Forbidden

#5 , Lust

See G1939 , and that is why DESIRE is Preferred as in Ex 20:17 and Deut 5:21

dan p

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Just out of curiosity elohiym, is the purpose behind this thread to legitimize all loving sexual relationships as long as coveting/lust isn't involved?

And when I say "all", based on dealing with you under the username of Doormat, you know what I'm referring to.

 

[elohiym]

Just out of curiosity elohiym, is the purpose behind this thread to legitimize all loving sexual relationships as long as coveting/lust isn't involved?

No. The purpose of this thread is to figure out what Jesus meant by lusting a woman. Did he mean coveting, as I believe, or did he mean being sexually attracted? Did he mean what he said only in reference to married women or all women?

 

[aCultureWarrior]

...The purpose of this thread is to figure out what Jesus meant by lusting a woman. Did he mean coveting, as I believe, or did he mean being sexually attracted? Did he mean what he said only in reference to married women or all women?

In regards to Matthew 5:27-28, what else could it mean other than sexual lust i.e. attraction? The use of the word "adultery" gives the meaning away immediately. Is it natural for a single man to have a sexual attraction for a single woman? Yes! That sexual attraction (along with other very important things such as friendship, love, respect, etc.) leads to God's design for human sexuality: marriage.

 

[patrick jane]

Romans 7:7 ... for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.​

When the word lust is use according to it's strict English definition, it means very strong sexual desire. However, when lust is used in the Bible, it means covet because the underlying Greek word means covet not strong sexual desire, as we see in the NASB translation:

Romans 7:7 ... I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."​

When Jesus used the word lust, he meant coveting, not strong sexual desire.

Matthew 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.​

Here's the Greek word he used:

1937 epithyméō (from 1909 /epí, "focused on" intensifying 2372 /thymós, "passionate desire") – properly, to show focused passion as it aptly builds on (Gk epi, "upon") what a person truly yearns for; to "greatly desire to do or have something – 'to long for, to desire very much' " (L & N, 1, 25.12).​

He was referring to the commandment:

Exodus 20:17 "You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor."​

If we were to interpret the word lust in Romans 7:7 KJV and Matthew 5:27-28 to mean lust strictly according to English definition of the word, a single man could not become sexually aroused by a single woman without sinning. Surely, Jesus didn't mean to convey such an idea but was rather magnifying the commandment to not covet.

Discuss.

Both verses are speaking of adultery. We can lust after material things, power, fame etc., but to lust for a person is purely sexual. I would use the covet for material earthly things and lust as sexual attraction/desire.

Jesus is saying, if it would be adultery to have relations with a particular person, then even thinking about it and lusting is adultery.

Matthew 5:27, 28 -

 

[glorydaz]

Just out of curiosity elohiym, is the purpose behind this thread to legitimize all loving sexual relationships as long as coveting/lust isn't involved?

And when I say "all", based on dealing with you under the username of Doormat, you know what I'm referring to.

Good catch....this is from another thread where Elo claims he can be physically "aroused" by a woman other than his wife, and it isn't a sin...it isn't lusting.