ECT NO, THE BIBLE IS NOT THE CHRISTIAN'S ONLY AUTHORITY

[CabinetMaker]

It would be extremely long (again, see Post #45). A good summary exists in the content of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. You can start there.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

If such a list existed, it would be fairly short. The traditions that Paul was refering to could not include those RCC traditions that didn't exist when He wrote his letter. Things like the Marian doctrines. Purgatory. Indulgences. The Eucharist in its Catholic interpretation. The list of traditions that Paul did not teach is indeed long.

 

[Cruciform]

If such a list existed, it would be fairly short. The traditions that Paul was refering to could not include those RCC traditions that didn't exist when He wrote his letter.

There's your fundamental error. In fact, the Traditions spoken of by Paul include all that has been, is now, and will be taught by the apostles and their ordained successors, the bishops (Ac. 16:4). It involves everything formally taught by the Magisterium of Christ's one historic Church for the past two millennia---not merely during the brief Apostolic Era. Your assumption here simply fails to comport with the teachings of the apostles themselves. Thus, both Totten and yourself are in error on this point, and my previous statements stand exactly as posted.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[CabinetMaker]

There's your fundamental error. In fact, the Traditions spoken of by Paul include all that has been, is now, and will be taught by the apostles and their ordained successors, the bishops (Ac. 16:4). It involves everything formally taught by the Magisterium of Christ's one historic Church for the past two millennia---not merely during the brief Apostolic Era. Your assumption here simply fails to comport with the teachings of the apostles themselves. Thus, both Totten and yourself are in error on this point, and my previous statements stand exactly as posted.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

No, that is the fundementally RCC error coupled with Roman arrogance. You know I'm right about the traditions Paul could not possibly have been refering to and you come back with this load of waffle. Totten nailed it and you have provided nothing that refutes hm to even the tiniest deference.

 

[dreadknought]

:chuckle: A canned anwer. j

 

[Jacob]

The scriptures as an authority for the Christian.

OR

The scriptures are the authority for the Christian.

The scriptures are an authority for the Christian.

Is there any other authority?

Obviously in terms of authority we have God and Jesus Christ His Son.

And we are to be subject to the governing authorities.

 

[Cruciform]

No, that is the fundementally RCC error coupled with Roman arrogance. You know I'm right about the traditions Paul could not possibly have been refering to and you come back with this load of waffle. Totten nailed it and you have provided nothing that refutes hm to even the tiniest deference.

TRANSLATION: "That's not what my chosen recently-invented man-made non-Catholic sect teaches, and I'm not allowed to think or believe otherwise!"

IN SHORT: "I don't like that!" :madmad:​

Post #62 stands exactly as posted.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[CabinetMaker]

TRANSLATION: "That's not what my chosen recently-invented man-made non-Catholic sect teaches, and I'm not allowed to think or believe otherwise!"

IN SHORT: "I don't like that!" :madmad:​

Post #62 stands exactly as posted.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

I'm sorry you don't like it but that doesn't make me wrong. Tell us, how could Paul reference traditions lime together assertion of Mary when Nary was still alive? How could he reference indulgences were not started until 1095 by Pope Urban II?

 

[PhilipJames]

The people you referenced lived far to long after Paul to be considered reliable.

Really? You think the opinions of men today that you follow are MORE reliable?

Let's look at the list again shall we?

You can start with the Didache here: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/didache.html .

Then I would suggest you read Polycarp, Ignatius, Clement, Justin Martyr, Iranaeus....

The Didache was written at about the same time as many of the books that are in the NT.

Polycarp was the Bishop of Smyrna, ordained by John, and certainly knew at least some of the apostles. Jesus Himself commends the Church in Smyrna here: Rev 2:8-9

Polycarp commends Ignatius who was the Bishop of Antioch


all of the men listed above were heroes of the Faith, martyrs who endured to the end!

you might want to consider what they had to say...

Peace!
PJ

 

[meshak]

And we are to be subject to the governing authorities.

Not if the government is not in line with God.

 

[meshak]

Are you an administrator on this forum? In any case, I re-posted the OP in a smaller font just for you (I agree, it was pretty huge!).

It is still huge.

 

[Jacob]

Not if the government is not in line with God.

But that is not our job. We are to lay our lives down in love without a fight against authority. In fact, all people deserve our respect. It is Christ in us that compels us to live for God and look out for the best interests of all we come into contact with. It is not up to us to determine that when God says the authorities that exist exist by God that we can then say that we won't listen or heed that authority that He has set up because we think they are not doing things God's way.

I do hope that all come to understand the love of God and Christ as their Savior. But this will always be by peaceful means if we are truly representing Christ.

 

[meshak]

But that is not our job. We are to lay our lives down in love without a fight against authority.

Christians are to lay their lives for Jesus, not for the government.

Soldiers lay their lives for the government, that's why the military is not of Jesus.

You need to get priority strait.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Christians are to lay their lives for Jesus, not for the government.

Soldiers lay their lives for the government, that's why the military is not of Jesus.

You need to get priority strait.

You need to learn what "Paul's Gospel" is teaching today! You need
to become a "Child of God and a member of the Body of Christ,"
that's what you need! The park might be clean now but, you need to
be cleansed of ALL your sin! Otherwise, you'll stand before God
someday, and be judged according to your "works," then, cast
into the "Lake of Fire!" Start reading and studying the writings
of the Apostle Paul! Your eternal destination depends on receiving
and accepting Paul's Gospel!

Romans 2:16 "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men
by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

 

[Jacob]

Christians are to lay their lives for Jesus, not for the government.

Not on behalf of the government meshak. But it may be the government that asks someone who is not in government or even someone who is in government, and we are to do what we have been asked so long as it does not violate God's law.

Matthew 5:41 NASB - "Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two.

This is not an opportune time for people to ask you to be obedient to this verse... it is if something like this happens we are to do what is right and not retaliate but actually do more than what they have asked, even for their good.

Soldiers lay their lives for the government, that's why the military is not of Jesus.

You have made two statements here. I am not in the military. But I am called to love soldiers, the government, and the military, with the love of God and the love of Christ.

You need to get priority strait.

I believe serving Christ in this way is the priority.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

It is still huge.

Your understanding isn't!

 

[Cross Reference]

You need to learn what "Paul's Gospel" is teaching today! You need
to become a "Child of God and a member of the Body of Christ,"
that's what you need! The park might be clean now but, you need to
be cleansed of ALL your sin! Otherwise, you'll stand before God
someday, and be judged according to your "works," then, cast
into the "Lake of Fire!" Start reading and studying the writings
of the Apostle Paul! Your eternal destination depends on receiving
and accepting Paul's Gospel!

Romans 2:16 "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men
by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

. . and you need to practice what you 'preach'.

 

[CabinetMaker]

Really? You think the opinions of men today that you follow are MORE reliable?

Certainly far more reliable and Christ centered than any teaching coming out of Rome.

Let's look at the list again shall we?


The Didache was written at about the same time as many of the books that are in the NT.

Polycarp was the Bishop of Smyrna, ordained by John, and certainly knew at least some of the apostles. Jesus Himself commends the Church in Smyrna here: Rev 2:8-9

Polycarp commends Ignatius who was the Bishop of Antioch


all of the men listed above were heroes of the Faith, martyrs who endured to the end!

you might want to consider what they had to say...

Peace!
PJ

I find it very interesting that you are working so very hard to deflect the question away from Paul and substitute others. Why is that? Why don't you just answer the question I asked?

 

[Cruciform]

I'm sorry you don't like it but that doesn't make me wrong.

Not liking my statements doesn't make you right (Post #66).

Tell us, how could Paul reference traditions lime together assertion of Mary when Nary was still alive? How could he reference indulgences were not started until 1095 by Pope Urban II?

Already answered (Post #62).



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[Cruciform]

It is still huge.

Feel free to post elsewhere.

 

[meshak]

Feel free to post elsewhere.

I am saying because there are many people doing it. You need consideration for the readers. It is the least of Christian thing to do.