Is Jesus God?

[JudgeRightly]

Fair enough, but where and who did I call someone a denigrating name?

Not what Sherman said. Read it again.

I will not add you to my contacts because of your misuse of the conversation box. 1. You were argumentative when you got an infraction and 2. you were trying to 'convert' me. I am not open to being proselytized. People that try to proselytize me are very annoying. On other sites where I am just a regular member--people that do that get placed on ignore. You a free to your opinions, but remember TOL is a Trinitarian Christian site. You have to show a measure of respect in your posts. You cannot be calling mainline Christian doctrines denigrating names.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Senile, or advanced?

In what world is "senile" ever comparable to "advanced"? :dunce:

 

[Right Divider]

Not what Sherman said. Read it again.

Senile or just totally lacking cognitive skills.

 

[7djengo7]

READ:
Joh_20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Joh_20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Why can't you answer the questions?

Again, I asked Pierac:

• What (if anything) do you imagine you mean when you say "Jesus has a GOD"?
• Where, in the Bible, do we read, "Jesus has a GOD"?

Quoting John 20:17 is no answer to either question.

 

[nikolai_42]

Consider Heb 1, the Son is the express image of his creator. it/he is also first of all creation, firstborn in position and first to be created. Col 1:15 TELLS YOU THE SAME THING. THAT SON IS A SPIRIT, not a man. It became flesh when told to do so. It shared glory with his Father in heaven. When God sent his son it needed a body to dwell in, it came with the power of the most high for God was pleased that it contained his fullness. It was not a man that God used to create the Universe. This Son came to bring us light by speaking through the body he prepared for it.

Lon is more than capable of responding for himself, but you referred to Colossians 1:15 in an earlier post (August 8th, I believe) and paired that with your observation that an image must be a creation. Sounds good, but if you read the context of that verse, it denies that this must be so :

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Colossians 1:13-18

As John famously wrote :

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:1-3

There is no ambiguity here. If something was created, Jesus created it. Jesus may be the express image of the Father, but that doesn't make Him any less God (and, as Paul and John testify) NOT a created being.

 

[Lon]

Nope friend , it is an image of me , not me. I Created the image when I stood in front of it. ALL IMAGES ARE CREATIONS.

You are making this up, Bob. There is a reason you are making it up, but it is simply an ideal in your head. Read here: Image the one scripture says is third. You've a real problem now. Your 'idea' won't hold up any longer (I've told you this many times).

Consider Heb 1, the Son is the express image of his creator.

Yes, in keeping with the definition (and scripture) I just gave. You, above, are the one that made a mistake. READ IT. It is clear and you are mistaken.

it/he is also first of all creation,

You made this up. No scripture says this. You are 'inferring' it (means making it up, making pieces fit whether they do or not or even if they can). Such is very shaky theology. Why? Because it is in your head and not in scriptures. I try VERY hard to make sure whatever I believe, I CAN show in scripture from what it says and NOT from what I infer. I don't want you following me. I want you following God. I also don't want you following whatever you or someone else made up and cannot back up with scripture. There is NO scripture that says what you just said. :nono: Also, try not to use 'it' when talking of God, the Spirit, or Son. It isn't respectful.

firstborn in position and first to be created. Col 1:15 TELLS YOU THE SAME THING. THAT SON IS A SPIRIT, not a man.

Nope: Col 1:13 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

I'm befuddled these simple statements in these verses confuse you. Continue reading please:
Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,

It became flesh when told to do so.

So if I (or God) told a rock to "become flesh" a rock could become flesh??? "It" again, seems disrespectful to me. Further, several on TOL have received infractions for what is taken as a personal slight against the Being of the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ.

It shared glory with his Father in heaven.

If I called you an 'it', Bob, you'd be offended.

When God sent his son it needed a body to dwell in, it came with the power of the most high for God was pleased that it contained his fullness. It was not a man that God used to create the Universe. This Son came to bring us light by speaking through the body he prepared for it.

Again, 'it' is a large problem.

My thoughts run deep Lon but they are worth your time to study, they will give you a deeper understanding of who our Lord Jesus is. He is not the Alpha and Omega, his God is.

:nono: FRANKLY, no. I've read you and you just don't have a good grasp on scriptures. You just don't have the education or where-with-all for it. I'm not arrogant, I'm just very well-read in the scriptures and proper theology. I know what I talk about.

Lon we can all be one with God if we love him enough, he tells you that in the book of John.

Nope, you are being obtuse. The Lord Jesus Christ said "That they may be one AS You and I are one." Point? He said PREVIOUSLY that He and the Father are One WHEN Philip asked to see the Father. John 14:8 Your 'deep' wisdom? Childish. You are saying we can be one like the Father and Son??? :nono: When you see 'me' you have NOT seen the Father bud. You are quite mistaken and your theology is immature and childish for it. You are equating with very poor grammatical skills. No scripture nor English structure allows people to 'spiritualize' the text. It isn't spiritual. it is childish and completely against what the passage says.

This is what you are doing, Bob:

1Ti 1:3 As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus so that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine,
1Ti 1:4 nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies, which promote speculations rather than the stewardship from God that is by faith.
1Ti 1:5 The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.
1Ti 1:6 Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion,
1Ti 1:7 desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions.

Do you get it???

Joh 17:22 I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one—
Joh 17:23 I in them and you in me—so that they may be brought to complete unity. Then the world will know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me.
Joh 17:24 "Father, I want those you have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory, the glory you have given me because you loved me before the creation of the world.

John 1:1 is the most misunderstood verse in the Bible, consider the WORD to be the spirit son, not Jesus. That son is a created form of God, a god. He has the fullness of his Father, he did nor need to grow in wisdom as Jesus did. This spirit son became flesh, Jesus was born flesh. I could go on and on, but......, God has been good to me Lon, he has taught me a lot over the years. I live in the comfort of his love,I hope you do also.

Nope, you don't get it. You are simply wrong. I JUST explained to you that this is a problem and poor reading skills as well as nothing but conjecture of made up stuff. You simply made this is as did any Arian/Unitarian before you. God has been BETTER to me because I know His Word AND can read English without making stuff up! YOU made a mistake. YOU did. It is a rookie, amature, and immature Christian (according to Timothy and Thessalonians) mistake and problem. Sorry, you are WAY too overconfident for someone with such poor reading skills as this. John 17 and John 14 have COMPLETELY different contexts. When you've seen me, you have NOT seen the Father. Arians are foolish for this AND Paul says to avoid these. Worse? He says they (like you) try to 'teach' and are to be dismissed. The Apostle Paul says that.

 

[keypurr]

Why can't you answer the questions?

Again, I asked Pierac:

• What (if anything) do you imagine you mean when you say "Jesus has a GOD"?
• Where, in the Bible, do we read, "Jesus has a GOD"?

Quoting John 20:17 is no answer to either question.

There is only ONE GOD and Jesus has a God.

Think

1Co 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

 

[Lon]

In what world is "senile" ever comparable to "advanced"? :dunce:

Advanced senility?

 

[keypurr]

You are making this up, Bob. There is a reason you are making it up, but it is simply an ideal in your head. Read here: Image the one scripture says is third. You've a real problem now. Your 'idea' won't hold up any longer (I've told you this many times).

Then show me ANY IMAGE that is not a creation

Yes, in keeping with the definition (and scripture) I just gave. You, above, are the one that made a mistake. READ IT. It is clear and you are mistaken.

Lon you do not see what I see for you have enclosed yourself in the box of tradition.

You made this up. No scripture says this. You are 'inferring' it (means making it up, making pieces fit whether they do or not or even if they can). Such is very shaky theology. Why? Because it is in your head and not in scriptures. I try VERY hard to make sure whatever I believe, I CAN show in scripture from what it says and NOT from what I infer. I don't want you following me. I want you following God. I also don't want you following whatever you or someone else made up and cannot back up with scripture. There is NO scripture that says what you just said. :nono: Also, try not to use 'it' when talking of God, the Spirit, or Son. It isn't respectful.

Wrong again Lon
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Man is made in the image of God, consider in what way. The ability to think and reason, but God is a spirit. There is only ONE ever made in the express image of God, the Son at the creation, God created everything through this spirit son. The Universe was not created by a man friend. This spirit son is the first of all creation/creatures. See Col 1;15, Trins seem to overlook that verse, here I will give it to you.

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Nope: Col 1:13 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Study verse 15 Lon, this Spirit son is the first of all creation for all things were created through it. This Son is firstborn in importance and first creation.

I'm befuddled these simple statements in these verses confuse you. Continue reading please:
Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,

Consider my past statements, Jesus became the Christ when Christ went into him. That is the Greek to English way of transcribing it. ARAMAIC say that that spirit son, the Miltha, came with the dove.

So if I (or God) told a rock to "become flesh" a rock could become flesh??? "It" again, seems disrespectful to me. Further, several on TOL have received infractions for what is taken as a personal slight against the Being of the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ

.

Are you aware that the early Bibles, Bishops and Geneva, use the word IT in John 1.
John 1:4
(Bishops) In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,
(Geneva) In it was life, and that life was the light of men.

IT became flesh in the body prepared for IT.

If I called you an 'it', Bob, you'd be offended.


Again, 'it' is a large problem.

I quoted you scripture Lon, I did not right it by myself.

:nono: FRANKLY, no. I've read you and you just don't have a good grasp on scriptures. You just don't have the education or where-with-all for it. I'm not arrogant, I'm just very well-read in the scriptures and proper theology. I know what I talk about.

True I do not have your education, but your educated is limited to the thoughts of your schools. My thoughts come from many sources. I have spent time with many Pastors, Dr. Karl O'Lander was my first and dearest Pastor and he was unable to answer questions I put to him. I feel that my studies have taken me where not to many get to.

Nope, you are being obtuse. The Lord Jesus Christ said "That they may be one AS You and I are one." Point? He said PREVIOUSLY that He and the Father are One WHEN Philip asked to see the Father. John 14:8 Your 'deep' wisdom? Childish. You are saying we can be one like the Father and Son??? :nono: When you see 'me' you have NOT seen the Father bud. You are quite mistaken and your theology is immature and childish for it. You are equating with very poor grammatical skills. No scripture nor English structure allows people to 'spiritualize' the text. It isn't spiritual. it is childish and completely against what the passage says.

Your thinking is shallow Lon, it is not easy to overcome what you have been taught over the years.

This is what you are doing, Bob:

1Ti 1:3 As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus so that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine,
1Ti 1:4 nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies, which promote speculations rather than the stewardship from God that is by faith.
1Ti 1:5 The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.
1Ti 1:6 Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion,
1Ti 1:7 desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions.

Do you get it???

Do you really believe that God's church has not been distorted by men?
Errors in translations, different languages, where is the church of the Apostles?
The Romans did a great job of pleasing the Pagans.

Nope, you don't get it. You are simply wrong. I JUST explained to you that this is a problem and poor reading skills as well as nothing but conjecture of made up stuff. You simply made this is as did any Arian/Unitarian before you. God has been BETTER to me because I know His Word AND can read English without making stuff up! YOU made a mistake. YOU did. It is a rookie, amature, and immature Christian (according to Timothy and Thessalonians) mistake and problem. Sorry, you are WAY too overconfident for someone with such poor reading skills as this. John 17 and John 14 have COMPLETELY different contexts. When you've seen me, you have NOT seen the Father. Arians are foolish for this AND Paul says to avoid these. Worse? He says they (like you) try to 'teach' and are to be dismissed. The Apostle Paul says that.

That is what they thought when they stoned Stephen. I am very over confident for I know the source of my teacher. I fear not what is ahead for me. Trust in the Lord with all your heart friend.

Have a good night Lon, its my bedtime.

 

[keypurr]

Lon is more than capable of responding for himself, but you referred to Colossians 1:15 in an earlier post (August 8th, I believe) and paired that with your observation that an image must be a creation. Sounds good, but if you read the context of that verse, it denies that this must be so :

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Colossians 1:13-18

As John famously wrote :

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:1-3

There is no ambiguity here. If something was created, Jesus created it. Jesus may be the express image of the Father, but that doesn't make Him any less God (and, as Paul and John testify) NOT a created being.

I have spent a lifetime studying these verses and I can see that you didn't. You didn't read mine also.
Jesus was not the Son at the creation. Suggest you look at "men made in the image of God', and the "express image of God". Jesus was Born, Christ the Miltha was SENT to dwell in the body prepared for it.

A study might be worth your time.

 

[Bright Raven]

I have spent a lifetime studying these verses and I can see that you didn't. You didn't read mine also.
Jesus was not the Son at the creation. Suggest you look at "men made in the image of God', and the "express image of God". Jesus was Born, Christ the Miltha was SENT to dwell in the body prepared for it.

A study might be worth your time.

Jesus was at creation. You just don't understand John 1:1

John 1:1 King James Version (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John opened by saying, "the Word was God." And to remove any doubt about which god, he further clarified, "All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made." Paul made the same point. "For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers". Jesus is the true God. The Creator God

 

[Lon]

I have spent a lifetime studying these verses and I can see that you didn't. You didn't read mine also.
Jesus was not the Son at the creation. Suggest you look at "men made in the image of God', and the "express image of God". Jesus was Born, Christ the Miltha was SENT to dwell in the body prepared for it.

A study might be worth your time.

Such would be two beings, not one, right?

Then show me ANY IMAGE that is not a creation

All images are simply representations of those who 'already' exist. Your mirror image is NOT created. its reflected. The mirror was already there. YOU were already there. NO creation.

Lon you do not see what I see for you have enclosed yourself in the box of tradition.

Luke 6:40 Matthew 10:24 When you can show you are capable of reading properly for comprehension, including not jumping to amature conclusions about mods actions, you and I THEN can talk about what you do and do not understand correctly concerning scriptures. Your track record is tainted with amature imature interpretation. You are NOT above the teacher. Sorry Bob. You aren't old enough nor this studied. You make mistakes and think they are gold :nono: God CAN forgive our incorrect conclusions but READ those scriptures I gave you then read this one too James 3:1 READ IT!

Wrong again Lon

Repeatedly, Bob, you've been shown your reading skills are poor. You've been SHOWN this by me, by mods in this very thread, and by others. You've been SHOWN. Sorry, your 'wrong' means diddly. You CANNOT properly comprehend grammar rules AND you've been demonstrably poor at conclusions (you've been wrong).

Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Yup and NONE of this applies to you or me. Nice try Bob, you just do not display adequate reading comprehension. You are then being arrogant beyond your ability for something you 'think' is right but is demonstrably shown incorrect. Nikolai just showed you another verse where you TOTALLY missed it: He was quoting scriptures FROM Colossians 1 that showed his point. You? Nadda. You just said 'nuh uh.'

Man is made in the image of God, consider in what way.

I know and I am NOT a god. I've created nothing. I've brought nothing to life. I've never spoken and life came into existence.... I'm not God. I'm not 'a' god. :nono: I am the creation of God and He has given me some traits that I happen to share with Him. This then is 'godly' but NOT 'god.' When the Lord Jesus Christ said this, He was not telling you that you were a god but had His touch in your nature. Sorry, you'll never be your own god of your own universe. There are serious ramifications of 'missing it' in this case. Jehovah Witnesses are not gods either. :nono:

The ability to think and reason, but God is a spirit.

"In His image He created them (Adam and Eve). They lost much of their 'imago deo' (image of God) the day they sinned and so did we.

There is only ONE ever made in the express image of God, the Son at the creation, God created everything through this spirit son. The Universe was not created by a man friend. This spirit son is the first of all creation/creatures. See Col 1;15, Trins seem to overlook that verse, here I will give it to you.

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

He was with the Father before creation but the Lord Jesus Christ also equivocates Himself as with the Father before Creation.
I'm not sure you are far off on this, because Trinitarians believe in the pre-incarnate Christ. What this means? It means this isn't, at least on the face of discussion so far, a point of disagreement.

Study verse 15 Lon, this Spirit son is the first of all creation for all things were created through it. This Son is firstborn in importance and first creation.

Again, this is where you and others have gotten infractions before. "It" describing you, would be 'offensive.' "It" describing God, Spirit, or Son is derogatory and offensive, and lacks honor and respect by sentiment.

You'd BETTER make a VERY good reason for doing so ever again. It IS offensive, disrespectful, and derogatory toward those who esteem God, Father, Spirit, Son as anything but 'it.'

You are being purposefully offensive by never addressing why you insist on 'it' for anything appropriate regarding God.

Consider my past statements, Jesus became the Christ when Christ went into him. That is the Greek to English way of transcribing it. ARAMAIC say that that spirit son, the Miltha, came with the dove.

It is a fancy dance amounting to nothing. It is simply the word for "Spirit" descending 'like a dove.' There is no 'with' here. There was no dove (The Peshitta says so too see Luke 3:22, Matthew 3:16, ). Note too, the Peshitta NT wasn't written and certainly not even complete until after the 5th century. You are not a scholar yet young student.

.

Are you aware that the early Bibles, Bishops and Geneva, use the word IT in John 1.
John 1:4
(Bishops) In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,
(Geneva) In it was life, and that life was the light of men.

IT became flesh in the body prepared for IT.

Yes. Two points: 1) It wasn't the same derogatory name/reference it is today, "It" could have once been said with respect but no longer. 2) The KJV 'corrected' the translation. The pronoun used is most often 'personal.' At one time 'it' may have been personal but today such conveys no intelligence or personality so it is offensive. Pay attention to both reasons it isn't acceptable today, Robert.

I quoted you scripture Lon, I did not right it by myself.

You interpreted incorrectly. By yourself.

True I do not have your education, but your educated is limited to the thoughts of your schools. My thoughts come from many sources. I have spent time with many Pastors, Dr. Karl O'Lander was my first and dearest Pastor and he was unable to answer questions I put to him. I feel that my studies have taken me where not to many get to.

Your thinking is shallow Lon, it is not easy to overcome what you have been taught over the years.

Says the guy with no ability to the PhD lain: It is simply blowhard ignorance on your part young one. When it comes to the Bible, you are the child, not me.

Do you really believe that God's church has not been distorted by men?
Errors in translations, different languages, where is the church of the Apostles?
The Romans did a great job of pleasing the Pagans.

God has always preserved His church. The Catholics were shadowed by Eastern Orthodox and far away Coptic Churches and anabaptists. Look where they all agree, THEN determine what they ALL believed independently was true. You are making another rookie mistake and YOUR thinking is SHOWN on TOL to be wrong and shallow. Its been SHOWN in just this thread, Robert! How prideful (and wrong) can one uneducated old guy be??? And you have the audacity to 'try' and assert my understanding is shallow??? :doh: You are arrogant. Sadly so.

That is what they thought when they stoned Stephen. I am very over confident for I know the source of my teacher. I fear not what is ahead for me. Trust in the Lord with all your heart friend.

Contrasts? You are trying to contrast yourself with me? The Apostle Paul pulled out his credentials to shame those who opposed him. I could do the same here. You are just a little tiny fish in a huge pond and TOTALLY ignorant of what is in those theological waters to be going on so like this. Its sad, really. The JW's do it also. They are proud (sadly) of their ignorance (as are most Cults). They think "God chose the simple things to confound the wise" means they have it. Okay, you and an Arian and a Mormon, a Bahá'í, and a Muslim can all argue which one of all the rest of the obscure cults are supposedly the 'ignorant' but 'right' ones.

Have a good night Lon, its my bedtime.

Can you be taught? Have you learned anything from me in this post today? :think:

I have spent a lifetime studying these verses and I can see that you didn't. You didn't read mine also.

Er, "Either." Come on Robert. If you are going to ridicule someone, try not to show your lack of the same ability you are criticizing your opponent for! :doh:

A study might be worth your time.

You've a long way to go, Robert. Proverbs 5:13 Are you reading these scriptures and letting them sink in, Robert?

 

[keypurr]

Jesus was at creation. You just don't understand John 1:1

John 1:1 King James Version (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John opened by saying, "the Word was God." And to remove any doubt about which god, he further clarified, "All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made." Paul made the same point. "For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers". Jesus is the true God. The Creator God

BR, how many time must I tell you that Jesus was born to Mary in Bethlehem?
Jesus did not preexist, the Miltha did. And the Miltha spoke through Jesus.
Jesus was born flesh, he did not become flesh.
Jesus is not the word, the Miltha is.
The Miltha is a created form of God, first of all creatures.

Believe what you will BR. I bring you light to consider and you shun away from it.

No one knows it all, so do not stop learning, I haven't.

 

[Bright Raven]

BR, how many time must I tell you that Jesus was born to Mary in Bethlehem?
Jesus did not preexist, the Miltha did. And the Miltha spoke through Jesus.
Jesus was born flesh, he did not become flesh.
Jesus is not the word, the Miltha is.
The Miltha is a created form of God, first of all creatures.

Believe what you will BR. I bring you light to consider and you shun away from it.

No one knows it all, so do not stop learning, I haven't.

you absolutely and unequivocally refuse to believe the TRUTH when it is placed right in front of your eyes.

John 1:1 King James Version (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


John 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

 

[keypurr]

Such would be two beings, not one, right?

Two became one. Jesus became the Christ when the logos went to dwell IN him at his anointing. Acts 10:38

All images are simply representations of those who 'already' exist. Your mirror image is NOT created. its reflected. The mirror was already there. YOU were already there. NO creation.

All reflected images are created by the subject matter.

Luke 6:40 Matthew 10:24 When you can show you are capable of reading properly for comprehension, including not jumping to amature conclusions about mods actions, you and I THEN can talk about what you do and do not understand correctly concerning scriptures. Your track record is tainted with amature imature interpretation. You are NOT above the teacher. Sorry Bob. You aren't old enough nor this studied. You make mistakes and think they are gold :nono: God CAN forgive our incorrect conclusions but READ those scriptures I gave you then read this one too James 3:1 READ IT!

You do not seem to be a spiritual person Lon, you have had five years to disprove my understanding but you are unable to do so. My teacher is above all, he wrote the book. But you will never understand it if your in a church box.

Repeatedly, Bob, you've been shown your reading skills are poor. You've been SHOWN this by me, by mods in this very thread, and by others. You've been SHOWN. Sorry, your 'wrong' means diddly. You CANNOT properly comprehend grammar rules AND you've been demonstrably poor at conclusions (you've been wrong).

Understanding is much more important that grammar Lon, content should be what you need to seek. You ability to use your quality words to look down on some one that you have no idea what he knows is showing again.

Yup and NONE of this applies to you or me. Nice try Bob, you just do not display adequate reading comprehension. You are then being arrogant beyond your ability for something you 'think' is right but is demonstrably shown incorrect. Nikolai just showed you another verse where you TOTALLY missed it: He was quoting scriptures FROM Colossians 1 that showed his point. You? Nadda. You just said 'nuh uh.'
I know and I am NOT a god. I've created nothing. I've brought nothing to life. I've never spoken and life came into existence.... I'm not God. I'm not 'a' god. :nono: I am the creation of God and He has given me some traits that I happen to share with Him. This then is 'godly' but NOT 'god.' When the Lord Jesus Christ said this, He was not telling you that you were a god but had His touch in your nature. Sorry, you'll never be your own god of your own universe. There are serious ramifications of 'missing it' in this case. Jehovah Witnesses are not gods either. :nono:
"In His image He created them (Adam and Eve). They lost much of their 'imago deo' (image of God) the day they sinned and so did we.

Sweep it under the rug if you wish, but the words are still there.

He was with the Father before creation but the Lord Jesus Christ also equivocates Himself as with the Father before Creation.
I'm not sure you are far off on this, because Trinitarians believe in the pre-incarnate Christ. What this means? It means this isn't, at least on the face of discussion so far, a point of disagreement.

Jesus was NOT with the Father at the creation.
The EXPRESS IMAGE was, Jesus was born to Mary.

Again, this is where you and others have gotten infractions before. "It" describing you, would be 'offensive.' "It" describing God, Spirit, or Son is derogatory and offensive, and lacks honor and respect by sentiment.

If what I see in scripture is offensive then you do not have truth. The Jews did not like it either.

You'd BETTER make a VERY good reason for doing so ever again. It IS offensive, disrespectful, and derogatory toward those who esteem God, Father, Spirit, Son as anything but 'it.'

You are being purposefully offensive by never addressing why you insist on 'it' for anything appropriate regarding God.

I am not overly concerned about my judgement. God loves me for trying.

It is a fancy dance amounting to nothing. It is simply the word for "Spirit" descending 'like a dove.' There is no 'with' here. There was no dove (The Peshitta says so too see Luke 3:22, Matthew 3:16, ). Note too, the Peshitta NT wasn't written and certainly not even complete until after the 5th century. You are not a scholar yet young student.

Many disagree with that.

Yes. Two points: 1) It wasn't the same derogatory name/reference it is today, "It" could have once been said with respect but no longer. 2) The KJV 'corrected' the translation. The pronoun used is most often 'personal.' At one time 'it' may have been personal but today such conveys no intelligence or personality so it is offensive. Pay attention to both reasons it isn't acceptable today, Robert.

I question the KJV as being the pure word of God.

You interpreted incorrectly. By yourself.

Don't we all?






Says the guy with no ability to the PhD lain: It is simply blowhard ignorance on your part young one. When it comes to the Bible, you are the child, not me.




God has always preserved His church. The Catholics were shadowed by Eastern Orthodox and far away Coptic Churches and anabaptists. Look where they all agree, THEN determine what they ALL believed independently was true. You are making another rookie mistake and YOUR thinking is SHOWN on TOL to be wrong and shallow. Its been SHOWN in just this thread, Robert! How prideful (and wrong) can one uneducated old guy be??? And you have the audacity to 'try' and assert my understanding is shallow??? :doh: You are arrogant. Sadly so.


Contrasts? You are trying to contrast yourself with me? The Apostle Paul pulled out his credentials to shame those who opposed him. I could do the same here. You are just a little tiny fish in a huge pond and TOTALLY ignorant of what is in those theological waters to be going on so like this. Its sad, really. The JW's do it also. They are proud (sadly) of their ignorance (as are most Cults). They think "God chose the simple things to confound the wise" means they have it. Okay, you and an Arian and a Mormon, a Bahá'í, and a Muslim can all argue which one of all the rest of the obscure cults are supposedly the 'ignorant' but 'right' ones.


Can you be taught? Have you learned anything from me in this post today? :think:


Er, "Either." Come on Robert. If you are going to ridicule someone, try not to show your lack of the same ability you are criticizing your opponent for! :doh:




You've a long way to go, Robert. Proverbs 5:13 Are you reading these scriptures and letting them sink in, Robert?[/QUOTE]

 

[keypurr]

you absolutely and unequivocally refuse to believe the TRUTH when it is placed right in front of your eyes.

John 1:1 King James Version (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


John 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Speak for yourself BR.

How could Jesus be made flesh if he was flesh?

The true Son is the spirit son, IT/HE became flesh.

Jesus was anointed with this SPIRIT (Acts 10:38) that became flesh to speak through the body (Jesus) prepared for IT. See Heb 10:5

 

[JudgeRightly]

Two became one. Jesus became the Christ when the logos went to dwell IN him at his anointing. Acts 10:38



All reflected images are created by the subject matter.




You do not seem to be a spiritual person Lon, you have had five years to disprove my understanding but you are unable to do so. My teacher is above all, he wrote the book. But you will never understand it if your in a church box.




Understanding is much more important that grammar Lon, content should be what you need to seek. You ability to use your quality words to look down on some one that you have no idea what he knows is showing again.




Sweep it under the rug if you wish, but the words are still there.



Jesus was NOT with the Father at the creation.
The EXPRESS IMAGE was, Jesus was born to Mary.



If what I see in scripture is offensive then you do not have truth. The Jews did not like it either.




I am not overly concerned about my judgement. God loves me for trying.




Many disagree with that.



I question the KJV as being the pure word of God.






Don't we all?






Says the guy with no ability to the PhD lain: It is simply blowhard ignorance on your part young one. When it comes to the Bible, you are the child, not me.




God has always preserved His church. The Catholics were shadowed by Eastern Orthodox and far away Coptic Churches and anabaptists. Look where they all agree, THEN determine what they ALL believed independently was true. You are making another rookie mistake and YOUR thinking is SHOWN on TOL to be wrong and shallow. Its been SHOWN in just this thread, Robert! How prideful (and wrong) can one uneducated old guy be??? And you have the audacity to 'try' and assert my understanding is shallow??? :doh: You are arrogant. Sadly so.


Contrasts? You are trying to contrast yourself with me? The Apostle Paul pulled out his credentials to shame those who opposed him. I could do the same here. You are just a little tiny fish in a huge pond and TOTALLY ignorant of what is in those theological waters to be going on so like this. Its sad, really. The JW's do it also. They are proud (sadly) of their ignorance (as are most Cults). They think "God chose the simple things to confound the wise" means they have it. Okay, you and an Arian and a Mormon, a Bahá'í, and a Muslim can all argue which one of all the rest of the obscure cults are supposedly the 'ignorant' but 'right' ones.


Can you be taught? Have you learned anything from me in this post today? :think:


Er, "Either." Come on Robert. If you are going to ridicule someone, try not to show your lack of the same ability you are criticizing your opponent for! :doh:




You've a long way to go, Robert. Proverbs 5:13 Are you reading these scriptures and letting them sink in, Robert?[ / QUOTE ]

Fix your formatting.

 

[Right Divider]

Fix your formatting.

... and his doctrine...:french:

 

[keypurr]

you absolutely and unequivocally refuse to believe the TRUTH when it is placed right in front of your eyes.

John 1:1 King James Version (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


John 1:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

BR you do not know truth.

The KJV is not a perfect translation.

 

[keypurr]

... and his doctrine...:french:

All my

,

were in the post. ????????????????









































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