Empathy and Compassion for Mass Murderers, Rapists, Child Molesters

JudgeRightly

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Would Jesus?

He answered and said to them, [JESUS]“Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”—then he need not honor his father or mother.’ Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition.Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:‘These people draw near to Me with their mouth, And honor Me with their lips, But their heart is far from Me.And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”[/JESUS] - Matthew 15:3-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...9&version=NKJV
 

Trump Gurl

Credo in Unum Deum
unrepentant murderers, rapists, child molesters?

Nope

"Unrepentant" murderers, rapists, child molesters. That's different, a little bit, but then again not really. Even unrepentant sinners Jesus would sit down with and try to make them see they should repent.

It is only at the time of death and then judgement that they would be damned, but not before. But even then Jesus - who is also God let us remember - would still love them.

God's love is perfect because He is perfect. Can a love that perfect just stop loving someone? NO. God even loves those who went to Hell. He can not do otherwise and still be God.

I like you and I like your posts in the political section. I think that maybe you have not thought this one all the way through. God's love is too perfect to ever stop loving any of his creatures. God always hopes for repentance of all sinners even up until their last breath. We are called to be like Jesus so we can do no less.
 

JudgeRightly

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"Unrepentant" murderers, rapists, child molesters. That's different, a little bit, but then again not really. Even unrepentant sinners Jesus would sit down with and try to make them see they should repent.

Sitting down with unrepentant murderers, rapists, and child molesters to bring them to Christ should be done while they're awaiting their execution after conviction on the testimony of two or three witnesses.

It's the perfect time to do it. When people are faced with their death, they typically turn to God.

In fact, in the Bible, of the recorded examples, about 50% of those who were being executed repented before they died.

That's a pretty good repentance rate, compared to the repentance rate of today, where criminals openly mock their victims and the judges, all while hardening their hearts as they continue to live (which, concerning capital crimes, profanes God) in prison.

It is only at the time of death and then judgement that they would be damned, but not before.

Nope.

[JESUS]“He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.”[/JESUS] - John 3:18-21 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John3:18-21&version=NKJV

But even then Jesus - who is also God let us remember - would still love them.

God says to put the criminal guilty of a capital crime to death.

You're trying to be nicer than God.

https://kgov.com/nice

God's love is perfect because He is perfect. Can a love that perfect just stop loving someone? NO.

Love is the commitment to the good of someone. The best thing that can happen to a criminal is for him to be punished, swiftly and painfully, and the best thing that can happen to the victim of a crime is for that criminal to be punished, and to the extent possible, have the criminal make amends for their crime.

God even loves those who went to Hell. He can not do otherwise and still be God.

Please quote the scripture that says or describes God as loving those in hell.

I like you and I like your posts in the political section. I think that maybe you have not thought this one all the way through.

I'm not doser, but I know that Pastor Enyart has thought this through, and that his line of thought has been made into an article at the above link.

God's love is too perfect to ever stop loving any of his creatures.

Scripture? This sounds like an an appeal to emotion.

Stop trying to be nicer than God.

God always hopes for repentance of all sinners even up until their last breath.

And that's the cutoff point.

We are called to be like Jesus so we can do no less.

There's no point praying for dead people, which is what you'd do if you love someone who is alive who has not repented towards God.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Psalm 11:5
Proverbs 8:13
Psalm 5:5
etc



Proverbs 1:26 I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;

27 When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you.

 

Trump Gurl

Credo in Unum Deum
what did Jesus tell the apostles to do with those who reject His message?

We all rejected it, until we accepted. Do you know what I mean. Each person has a moment when they accept Jesus. Since you and I cannot see the future we must always hope for the best.

I am not defending criminals. They need to do their time in prison. I am just saying that God always wants them to repent and so should we. Is that really so hard to understand?

Do you know the story of Saint Augustine's mother Saint Monica? I learned it recently.

Her relationship with her son Augustine, a notoriously wayward youth, progressed along much the same path. Augustine pursued all manner of hedonistic delights, ultimately culminating in a mistress who bore him a son, Adeodatus. Indeed, it is Augustine who uttered the famous prayer to God: “Grant me chastity and continence, but not yet.”

He also abandoned the Christianity of his mother, instead flirting with paganism and a popular dualistic Eastern religion, Manichaeism, known for its mysterious cultic practices. These behaviors deeply grieved the faithful Monica, though she never gave up hope that God would make good out of this evil.

The Inexhaustible Intransigence of a Mother’s Love

Monica took her frustrations and parental misery to God, and ran after her son Augustine with abandon. She prayed, fasted, and wept over her son’s wayward ways. This led a local unnamed bishop to console her: “the child of those tears shall never perish.”

When Augustine secretly fled his mother for Rome, she followed after him. When he moved on to Milan, she kept on his trail. Like any good mother, Monica did not let her child’s stubbornness, stupidity, or blatant sin obscure her love for him. As Augustine writes,
.
Like all mothers, though far more than most, she loved to have me with her, and she did not know how much joy you were to create for her through my absence. She did not know, and so she wept and wailed, and these cries of pain revealed what there was left of Eve in her, as in anguish she sought the son whom in anguish she had brought to birth. Yet when she had finished blaming my deception and cruelty, she resumed her entreaties for me.​


In the end, her perseverance paid off. After 17 years of resistance, Augustine converted to Christianity under the wise instruction of St. Ambrose, bishop of Milan. Monica’s extended period of longsuffering for him matched her waiting for her husband, for whom she may have prayed for as long as 30 years.

https://thefederalist.com/2018/08/27...others-prayer/
 

Lon

Well-known member
thanks JR

and worth pointing out something that came up in the previous thread - the extent of my empathy and compassion for the wicked is to inform them of the path they've chosen and to urge them to accept Christ before they have justice meted out upon them

But that in and of itself is mercy and grace and, Christ in you, planting and watering. It is similar to how I view God who IS love: He is compassionate to all. Putting them to death does not mean you are not loving. Rather, the fact that you want them saved and changed by Christ's power is empathetic to your and my own need for a Savior. Not sure if that helps, but love is an action and I think you don't have to have loving feelings or emotions, just practice your Christianity consistently to all men, if that helps. [h=1]1 Corinthians 9:19-23[/h] That last part, 'to share in the gospel' simply means that we are consistent and Christ-like in 'our' walk with Christ. It really doesn't matter at that point how we feel about the criminal, but about rather, what Christ is producing 'in us.' 1 Corinthians 3:6 We don't treat the other well because they deserve it, but because it is in our nature to do so, thus a 'last meal' and etc. We have 'empathy' and 'mercy' simply because we 'are' creature remade of empathy and mercy. It doesn't mean we don't leave them in God's hands. It means we are lights on a hill that cannot be hid. In Him -Lon
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
But that in and of itself is mercy and grace and, Christ in you, planting and watering. It is similar to how I view God who IS love: He is compassionate to all. Putting them to death does not mean you are not loving. Rather, the fact that you want them saved and changed by Christ's power is empathetic to your and my own need for a Savior. Not sure if that helps, but love is an action and I think you don't have to have loving feelings or emotions, just practice your Christianity consistently to all men, if that helps. [h=1]1 Corinthians 9:19-23[/h] That last part, 'to share in the gospel' simply means that we are consistent and Christ-like in 'our' walk with Christ. It really doesn't matter at that point how we feel about the criminal, but about rather, what Christ is producing 'in us.' 1 Corinthians 3:6 We don't treat the other well because they deserve it, but because it is in our nature to do so, thus a 'last meal' and etc. We have 'empathy' and 'mercy' simply because we 'are' creature remade of empathy and mercy. It doesn't mean we don't leave them in God's hands. It means we are lights on a hill that cannot be hid. In Him -Lon

you're right, of course

not sure how to square that with artie's difficulty here: https://theologyonline.com/forum/po...torment-biblical-or-not?p=2386018#post2386018

... in a manner that he's able to understand

I believe Pneuma would say that artie never would or could, being lost himself

too lost to recognize that my empathy and compassion for him is shown in my attempt, futile though it must be
 
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