What is holding us back?

[oatmeal]

I didn't say that.



I'm sure anyone would.



That wasn't what I said. I said they were done FOR the Jews. Because, the Jews required a sign. God went above and beyond to convince the Jews. He did it with the manna from heaven. He did it with the death angel passing over their houses.

But, you've brought up a very interesting subject, Oats.

What do miracles actually accomplish?

Remember, faith is based on things unseen.

Faith is based on things unseen? Really?

Have you ever read the Bible?

You have never seen a Bible? Is that what you are saying?

You have never read the Word with your eyes?

So Gentiles do not get to have signs and miracles and wonders to confirm the gospel preached unto them?

Are you saying God is a respecter of persons?

The Gentiles are not good enough for God to answer their prayers?

They are not good enough to have the sign that Jonah provided?

Yes, I know the verse you pointed out, but your misapplication of truth is what is hurting you

For that matter, if musterion is correct that what Jesus spoke in the gospels only applies to Israel, then John 10:30 is true only for Israel.

"I and my Father are one" is true only for Israel, not for Christianity.

How about love God with all your heart.... that is truth for Christians? We don't get to love God?

How about seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness.... we dont seek God first, who is Christianity supposed to seek first then? Idols, religion, well, you hard core trinitarians have excelled at that.

 

[oatmeal]

Your guesswork concerning what Musty said is downright silly. Please try to focus.
You already admitted that Jesus was speaking to the Jews when He walked among us.
Why then do you continue to think He was speaking to you?

You can't have it both ways. Or, maybe you don't know that Jesus Christ rose from the dead and appeared to Paul on the road to Damascus, and continued to appear to him with the words that would lead to OUR salvation. :think:



Yeah, anyone can pray to God, just like anyone can pray to the stars. No one is talking about sacrificing animals or keeping the Law. Try to avoid running down every rabbit trail that pops into your head.

Unless you recognize the DEITY of the Lord Jesus Christ, you'll be stuck trying to have a "relationship" with your Creator God. Not recognizing the Godhead has already got you in a world of hurt.

I copied and pasted what he said, if you don't like what he said, take that up with him, not me

 

[oatmeal]

Peter is clear:

“But in every nation WHOEVER fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him” Acts 10:35

“...WHOEVER believes in Him will receive remission of sins” Acts 10:43

Yah made no distinction between jews and goyim Acts 15:9

Thank you

 

[oatmeal]

Wow....so you're raising the dead and making the blind see?


Seriously, Oats, you have a real credibility issue going on. I would tell you it's simply an inability to rightly divide scripture, but you really don't want to hear that, do you?


BTW Get a video of your miracles and I'll watch with great interest.

Well, you said faith is about what you cannot see. Well, you are never going to see signs and wonders and miracles because your faith won't allow them to happen where you could see them

Well, I am trying to share the word so that you can see.

so far your unbelief is preventing you from seeing, seeing that the god of this world has blinded your mind

I have had plenty of results from believing God, God does not impose his signs and wonders and miracles upon those who refuse to believe to receive God's goodness.

Did Jesus heal everyone who was sick? What about all the Gentiles in Asia who were sick? Why didn't Jesus heal them? Why was his healing so localized?

Did Jesus raise everyone who ever died up to the time of his ministry?

Why not?

 

[clefty]

Irony? :chuckle:

What an active imagination you have.

imagination? It’s all in da good book...even Rome’s Pilate recognized His innocence and royalty...ironically

It's simply the easiest to spell. :duh:

no surprise from one who has raptured herself from works and fruit...doing what is easiest...rejecting all burdens and yokes no matter how light or easy...”wasn’t dispensed to me”

You aren't worth any further effort.

take your ball and go home...back to Rome its traditions...ha

Or Gael or Colossae or Ephesus or wherever you were when you received Paul’s epistle...

 

[clefty]

Thank you

No thank you for another opportunity to show that when this ekklessia was in the wilderness with Him at the head as poor stoned Stephen preached Acts 7:38 there were ALREADY goyim saved...the Sabbath commandment itself Exodus 20:10 being proof the strangers within their gates received inheritance and blessing...

EVERY knee would bow not just jews...His house was a house of prayer for ALL nations...not just jews...ALL mankind would come worship...Sabbath to sabbath Isaiah 66:23

Yet some here get so MAD they rapture themselves from burdens and yokes with a new gospel and different Christ which was NEVER dispensed...let alone to them alone...

To avoid a seventh day of rest Sabbath they would rather divide His people, teach the jewish false witness that He changed the customs of Moses...and deny that Yah so loved the WORLD...but just jews


Yup...when that church was in the wilderness it was already full of goyim...ONE LAW FOR BOTH

Leviticus 19:34
Verse Concepts
'The stranger who resides with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt; I am the LORD your God.

Exodus 12:49
Verse Concepts
"The same law shall apply to the native as to the stranger who sojourns among you."

Leviticus 24:22
Verse Concepts
'There shall be one standard for you; it shall be for the stranger as well as the native, for I am the LORD your God.'"

Numbers 9:14
Verse Concepts
'If an alien sojourns among you and observes the Passover to the LORD, according to the statute of the Passover and according to its ordinance, so he shall do; you shall have one statute, both for the alien and for the native of the land.'"

Numbers 15:14
Verse Concepts
'If an alien sojourns with you, or one who may be among you throughout your generations, and he wishes to make an offering by fire, as a soothing aroma to the LORD, just as you do so he shall do.

Numbers 15:15
Verse Concepts
'As for the assembly, there shall be one statute for you and for the alien who sojourns with you, a perpetual statute throughout your generations; as you are, so shall the alien be before the LORD.

Numbers 15:16
Verse Concepts
'There is to be one law and one ordinance for you and for the alien who sojourns with you.'"

Numbers 15:29
Verse Concepts
'You shall have one law for him who does anything unintentionally, for him who is native among the sons of Israel and for the alien who sojourns among them.

Deuteronomy 1:16
Verse Concepts
"Then I charged your judges at that time, saying, 'Hear the cases between your fellow countrymen, and judge righteously between a man and his fellow countryman, or the alien who is with him.

Deuteronomy 24:14
Verse Concepts
"You shall not oppress a hired servant who is poor and needy, whether he is one of your countrymen or one of your aliens who is in your land in your towns.

Leviticus 18:26
Verse Concepts
'But as for you, you are to keep My statutes and My judgments and shall not do any of these abominations, neither the native, nor the alien who sojourns among you

Exodus 12:19
Verse Concepts
'Seven days there shall be no leaven found in your houses; for whoever eats what is leavened, that person shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he is an alien or a native of the land.

Exodus 20:10
Verse Concepts
but the seventh day is a sabbath of the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you.

Deuteronomy 5:14
Verse Concepts
but the seventh day is a sabbath of the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant or your ox or your donkey or any of your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you, so that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you.

Leviticus 16:29
Verse Concepts
"This shall be a permanent statute for you: in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall humble your souls and not do any work, whether the native, or the alien who sojourns among you;

Leviticus 17:8
Verse Concepts
"Then you shall say to them, 'Any man from the house of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, who offers a burnt offering or sacrifice,

Leviticus 17:10
Verse Concepts
'And any man from the house of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, who eats any blood, I will set My face against that person who eats blood and will cut him off from among his people.

Leviticus 22:18
"Speak to Aaron and to his sons and to all the sons of Israel and say to them, 'Any man of the house of Israel or of the aliens in Israel who presents his offering, whether it is any of their votive or any of their freewill offerings, which they present to the LORD for a burnt offering--

Leviticus 17:13
Verse Concepts
"So when any man from the sons of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, in hunting catches a beast or a bird which may be eaten, he shall pour out its blood and cover it with earth.

Leviticus 24:16
Verse Concepts
'Moreover, the one who blasphemes the name of the LORD shall surely be put to death; all the congregation shall certainly stone him. The alien as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.

Numbers 15:26
'So all the congregation of the sons of Israel will be forgiven, with the alien who sojourns among them, for it happened to all the people through error.


This makes them so MAD they wish to rebuild the wall between jew and goyim to separate His people and divide His house...

and yes they also wish to rapture themselves from the house chores they are expected to do as a sovereign citizen of Israel...

 

[clefty]

Liar.

Resorting to that already?

Why not share where you think the Son contradicts the Father...? Where the NT contradicts the OT...where there is jew and goyim IN HIM seperated by a wall of contradictions?

Show us where His people are seperated and His house divides...

It remains His Will be done on earth as it is in heaven...

But here you think you are raptured from that...LOL

 

[clefty]

God loves the world, but it was through the Jews that the world was to hear the gospel. Which is why Jesus was speaking to the Jews....not you. I repeat.... Which is why, AND YOU ADMITTED, Jesus was speaking to the Jews. "Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers." Not you, but the "fathers"....Abraham etc. That is NOT YOU, Oats.

But, you folks don't understand that, do you? Not everything is about you.


Since the Jews failed, (people like you don't understand that) then God turned to the Gentiles.

Perhaps you need to read the whole book instead of this silly dabbling you persist in. :think:

...read the whole book? Why? None of it was dispensed to him or you...or how old are you?

 

[JudgeRightly]

...read the whole book? Why? None of it was dispensed to him or you...or how old are you?

So then let's just discard it all, based on your reasoning.

Is that what you want?

Go through your house and throw out every Bible. See how far you get, both in that task, and in explaining to God why you rejected His word.

Because you clearly don't want anything to do with God.

 

[clefty]

So then let's just discard it all, based on your reasoning.

Is that what you want?

Go through your house and throw out every Bible. See how far you get, both in that task, and in explaining to God why you rejected His word.

Because you clearly don't want anything to do with God.

Lol...ok how about just the old testaments? LOL

This is your and yours reasoning...

So throw it all out...I get told all the time the OT is destroyed anyway...

Now it’s parts of the NT aren’t dispensed specifically to us...

As if any of us are Romans or Colossians or Galatians or Ephesians etc

Did you personally receive a letter from Paul?

How old are you?

This latest MADness is only another rebellion against Him His Word His way...which has been around a long long time...old indeed...how long you been in that rebellion?

 

[JudgeRightly]

Lol...ok how about just the old testaments?

Nope. It's all or nothing. You have to throw out the whole Bible, or none of it at all.

Because the ENTIRE BIBLE is one story, one narrative.

Or what, do you regularly throw out the first half of every novel you read, and completely ignore it?

This is your and yours reasoning...

So throw it all out...I get told all the time the OT is destroyed anyway...

Now it’s parts of the NT aren’t dispensed specifically to us...

As if any of us are Romans or Colossians or Galatians or Ephesians etc

Did you personally receive a letter from Paul?

How old are you?

This latest MADness is only another rebellion against Him His Word His way...which has been around a long long time...old indeed...how long you been in that rebellion?

Once again, you have to do pretzals to try to make your beliefs work.

Whereas I simply accept the Bible as is, and let it speak for itself. I don't try to make it say anything, I don't force any meaning on the text.

I simply read it, and listen to what it says.

And here is what it says:

But on the contrary, when they saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me, as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter(for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles),and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised. - Galatians 2:7-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Galatians2:7-9&version=NKJV

You need to start from scratch. Go, read the Bible, understand which part is written to whom, and then you'll understand why I quoted that passage.

 

[clefty]

Nope. It's all or nothing. You have to throw out the whole Bible, or none of it at all.

Because the ENTIRE BIBLE is one story, one narrative.

Or what, do you regularly throw out the first half of every novel you read, and completely ignore it?



Once again, you have to do pretzals to try to make your beliefs work.

Whereas I simply accept the Bible as is, and let it speak for itself. I don't try to make it say anything, I don't force any meaning on the text.

I simply read it, and listen to what it says.

And here is what it says:

But on the contrary, when they saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me, as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter(for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles),and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised. - Galatians 2:7-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Galatians2:7-9&version=NKJV

You need to start from scratch. Go, read the Bible, understand which part is written to whom, and then you'll understand why I quoted that passage.

None of it is written to you...despite following much Roman tradition you are not Roman or from Ephesus or galatian or colossal...certainly not that ha

 

[JudgeRightly]

None of it is written to you...

I never claimed it was.

On the contrary, I DO claim that it was written FOR all.

despite following much Roman tradition you are not Roman or from Ephesus or galatian or colossal...certainly not that ha

:blabla:

Never claimed to be.

 

[glorydaz]

I hardly think that the Body of Christ can get the job done that's set before us without His Spirit giving us the power needed to arise in faith and become what is described in Scripture...

Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: that we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; but speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: from whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

The measure of every part making increase of the body (of Christ) unto the edifying of itself in love; that, to me, seems impossible, especially seeing how divided the Body of Christ is worldwide, without the guidance and intercession of The Holy Ghost. We haven't yet come to be a 'perfect man' befitting the fullness of Christ, but I do believe that He is coming for a victorious church, so we must.

On the contrary. We are perfectly equiped to "get the job done".

Each member, individually....preaching the Gospel of Salvation to the lost.

That is our mission during this age. That and no other.

2 Corinthians 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.​

The scripture you quote has NOTHING to do with our performing any kinds of signs and wonders. Instead it speaks of our edifying one another through the Scripture. The mature members of the body instructing the babes to rightly divide the word of God. To speak up when someone claims we are to do mighty deeds like the Apostles did.

The only problem is with those who refuse to be taught....those who refuse to grow in the knowledge of the truth.

 

[glorydaz]

no surprise from one who has raptured herself from works and fruit...doing what is easiest...rejecting all burdens and yokes no matter how light or easy...”wasn’t dispensed to me”

take your ball and go home...

No, I think I'll take that FALSE ACCUSATION to the Woodshed.

 

[glorydaz]

No thank you for another opportunity to show ....

You've already showed us you're a long-winded fool who has no idea how to discuss the Bible.

Your attempt to mix Law and Grace puts you in the heretic chunk of humanity. And, speaking of walls, you have a horrible wedgie from trying to straddle the wall between law and grace. Pick a side, any side, but get off that darn wall.

Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.​

YOU, clefty, are so weak in the faith, I can't help but feel some sympathy. Some, I say.

Romans 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.​

 

[clefty]

No, I think I'll take that FALSE ACCUSATION to the Woodshed.

False? If it is false how come you are so triggered? If I called you a two headed hippo is that true? No...you shouldnt be flustered at all about that...

But instead you red card my reputation with an additional message of “you swine”...LOL poor girl...settle down...no need for the histrionics...especially if it false...LOL

Instead we do have on record that you dont accept most of the NT as dispensed to you...certainly none of the house rules...yup you raptured yourselves of not only the times of trouble but responsibility to do His House chores...His easy yokes light burden stuff...not for you you claim...

No need to be so MAD ok?

 

[Ktoyou]

False? If it is false how come you are so triggered? If I called you a two headed hippo is that true? No...you shouldnt be flustered at all about that...

But instead you red card my reputation with an additional message of “you swine”...LOL poor girl...settle down...no need for the histrionics...especially if it false...LOL

Instead we do have on record that you dont accept most of the NT as dispensed to you...certainly none of the house rules...yup you raptured yourselves of not only the times of trouble but responsibility to do His House chores...His easy yokes light burden stuff...not for you you claim...

No need to be so MAD ok?

I do not think it matters, or you can be sure she is mad. How do you know her mood? Maybe she is having a little laugh about it.

 

[glorydaz]

False? If it is false how come you are so triggered?

Lies have that effect on anyone who is falsely accused.



Did you rape your daughter today or do you save that for your Sabbath service?

 

[clefty]

You've already showed us you're a long-winded fool who has no idea how to discuss the Bible.

Your attempt to mix Law and Grace puts you in the heretic chunk of humanity. And, speaking of walls, you have a horrible wedgie from trying to straddle the wall between law and grace. Pick a side, any side, but get off that darn wall.

Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.​

YOU, clefty, are so weak in the faith, I can't help but feel some sympathy. Some, I say.

Romans 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.​

Mix Law and grace? Hardly...its only by Grace I am saved...is why I wish to do the works...same ones the church did since their time in the wilderness...neat eh? When it was saved by faith back then...and then wished to do works to reveal that gratitude for being saved...

That text in Romans 14:5 is about fasting...not Sabbath...stop adding to the word and removing from it...as if the Sabbath wasn’t dispensed to the strangers within their gates...obviously the Sabbath is not a doubtful disputation...

Remember it is FALSE WITNESS that claims Yahushua changed the customs delivered by Moses Acts 6:13-14

Why you follow false witness? Mixing the Word with man’s traditions? You Roman?

Well good then the epistle to the Romans is for you...establish the Law then...it is good Paul insists...