SABBATH KEEPING

[DougE]

Exodus 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.

31:17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Israel alone was to keep the sabbath.

There is no commandment given to the church, the body of Christ to observe the sabbath.

The sabbath was a covenant. The covenants pertain only to Israel (Romans 9:4).

 

[clefty]

Exodus 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.

31:17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Israel alone was to keep the sabbath.

HalleluYah His Spirit is pricking another...

please read again Exodus 20:10 and realize that this commandment is the ONLY ONE that SPECIFICALLY includes the NON blood ISRAELITE...the stranger...

Next read:


https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topi...ded-In-The-Law

All these texts include the non blood related to Abraham but by faith adopted grafted in people saved from Egypt...following a new God they believed on...

So there you have it...both in the commandment itself and Yahushua affirming it with “the Sabbath was made for Man” not just jews but all who believe and become citizens of Israel...you man enough?

oh and Isaiah prophecies this in chapter 66:23 ALL flesh will worship new moon to new moon Sabbath to Sabbath...

so three witnesses are enough to establish a thing...the commandment itself including us...Isaiah concluding the end of it...and Yahushua affirming it is to ALL MAN...not just jews...

There is no commandment given to the church, the body of Christ to observe the sabbath.

then unlike you your rejection...why did Gentiles ask to hear the good news again the next Sabbath....Act 14:42

why too did James conclude the Acts 15 council that these crowding gentiles would keep hearing Moses preached every Sabbath? Acts 15:29

why do you claim as jews did desiring to stir up the people against Stephen that he taught Yahushua changed the customs Moses delivered? You claim the same as these slandering jews...Luke called this claim a FALSE WITNESS as Stephen was NOT teaching the customs Moses delivered was changed by Yahushua...Act 6:13-14 yours is a false witness...

Had Paul taught the Sabbath was done away with then he could not have claimed Acts 24:12 because Jews would have killed him even for bringing a gentile nearer the Temple...imagine if was claiming Sabbath is over...done...destroyed...oh and we can eat cats bats and wombats...LOL

Verse 13 nor could they prove that he did...no letters submitted no eyewitnesses...NOTHING to prove Paul taught the Sabbath was NO MORE...or NOT for the believing GENTILES...lol...that really made the jews mad...Paul was teaching the Sabbath WAS for gentiles NOT just for jews...that really mad them mad

you think if Paul taught the Sabbath was done away or we could eat SWINE Pharisees would agree Acts 23:9

you think if the apostles taught “the Sabbath is now destroyed and Israel can eat dog meat” zealous Jews would have agreed to Gamaliel’s advice to leave them alone? Acts 5:38-40

Luke concludes the book of Acts with Paul in Rome persuading jews that Isaiah INDEED taught the Gentiles were to receive the Righteousness of Yah Acts 28:25-28 Do you suppose Paul left out Isaiah writing about from Sabbath to Sabbath ALL flesh will worship Him?

The sabbath was a covenant. The covenants pertain only to Israel (Romans 9:4).

IS a covenant still to Israel...and you reject being made citizens of Israel grafted in...in Him the new creation from both jew and gentile...JOINED...the inner jew of circumcised heart? You reject all that?

How about woman? You reject her too? Made for man...before the fall...

How about marriage...is marriage jewish...just for jews? that was instituted for man too...and before jews and before the fall just like the Sabbath...


blood Israel was by ADOPTION ...from Jacob divinely ordained into Israel...spiritual...not by blood...is why adoption pertains to Israel as does the promise Romans 9:4....by faith...

finish that chapter and see how believing Gentiles are to be included...as it was in OT...as per the Sabbath commandment specifically to the stranger...

you no longer are a stranger but citizen of Israel...be grateful keep the House rules...His House rules...not man’s traditions that restored the wall between jews and goyim which He destroyed...

 

[KerimF]

I wonder what will happen to a Jew by blood if he lives with non-Jews and doesn't observe the Holy Sabbath as he is supposed to do.
Sorry, after reading what I wrote (line above) I recalled that a Jew by blood has no right to live with non-Jews far from his community (unless he is in a special mission ).

Anyway, I would be real surprised if Jesus whose message focuses on the Spirit (not of this world) advises me to also follow the sun and the moon and to have, therefore, a holy calendar (somehow like of my Muslims friends).
Fortunately, He didn't surprise me

 

[Huckleberry]

Collossians 2:16-17
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ

 

[Lon]

While I love fervor, Romans 10:2-3 ² For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

³ For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

"Work's already been done, not good news, the best news ever, Some say 'Don't ask for help, God helps those who help themselves! So press on! Get it right! Otherwise get left behind!' Some say "He's keeping score, so try hard then try a little more!' Hold up, if this were true, explain to me what the Cross is SUPPOSED to do!?"

Link full of O.T. that say "not just for Israel?" :nono: Every one of them says plainly "who live among you." NOT in fact every nation, ONLY the ones who live among them. Clear as day, except to those calling themselves 'Other.'

 

[Right Divider]

Collossians 2:16-17
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ

It's strange that those translators decided to use "substance" there instead of the literal "body".

 

[clefty]

Collossians 2:16-17
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ

Two things:

1) Do you notice the grammatical tense Paul used? He writes “which ARE a shadow of good things to come” and NOT “which WERE a shadow” the latter could easily be written in Greek if indeed all this was done away with...but Paul wrote these “ARE a shadow of good things to come”...even STILL...long after Yahushua’s ascension.

2) Do you notice that the first “s“ in the sabbaths you bolded is NOT capitalized? Did you also notice that sabbaths you bolded is plural? These sabbaths would be the annual ceremonial sabbaths and not the weekly Sabbath.



Perhaps this would help clarify what is going on here:

https://www.cogwriter.com/news/churc...the-holy-days/

Therefore, if all the translators were simply consistent with themselves, they would have translated Colossians 2:16-17 to state:

16 Therefore let NO MAN JUDGE YOU in eating and drinking or in respect of a festival or of an observance of the new moon or of a sabbath; 17 for those things are a shadow of the things to come, BUT THE BODY OF CHRIST.​

https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Colossians 2:17

Please note how many other translations acknowledge the “is” in “but the body [is] of Christ“ is indeed added.

2:17 Which 3739 are 2076 5748 a shadow 4639 of things to come 3195 5723; but 1161 the body 4983 [is] of Christ 5547. KJV

 

[Huckleberry]

Two things:

1) Do you notice the grammatical tense Paul used? He writes “which ARE a shadow of good things to come” and NOT “which WERE a shadow” the latter could easily be written in Greek if indeed all this was done away with...but Paul wrote these “ARE a shadow of good things to come”...even STILL...long after Yahushua’s ascension.

I think the context is obvious. Neither does the use of "are" require the immediate recognition of the sabbath; sabbath keeping was still going on, else there'd be no need for this verse at all.

2) Do you notice that the first “s“ in the sabbaths you bolded is NOT capitalized? Did you also notice that sabbaths you bolded is plural? These sabbaths would be the annual ceremonial sabbaths and not the weekly Sabbath.

I guess it depends on which translation you use. Many capitalize the sabbath in Colossians 2:16. One does wonder, according to your view, why the high sabbath is done away with and not the weekly. And why Paul wouldn't explain this oddity.


I'm curious, though. I must assume you're a proponent of keeping the sabbath law. If so, do you keep to the whole law and teach others to do so?

 

[clefty]

While I love fervor, Romans 10:2-3 ² For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

³ For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Funny how sore you are that you don’t even address me but everyone knows who you screeching at...lol

Yup blood Israel fell for works they (like you) ADDED to the law...or (like you) SUBTRACTED from it...Not the righteousness of Yah but with your every day sabbath rest...YOUR OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS...an addition to the Word exactly like that photo of the enmity Jews had of gentiles found in law of commandments contained in ordinances...were you able to read it?

It is so ironic that you ignorant of Yah’s righteousness claim the same as these self righteous false witnessing Jews claim: That Yahushua changed the customs Moses delivered to them Acts 6:13-14 Namely that the Sabbath was done away with...not for goyim...LOL

Blood Israel felt self righteousness came from adding purity laws even Yahushua broke or relaxing widow tithes...from even excluding the goyim and building walls of separation between Jews and goyim...which He tore down...but you RATHER put that wall up again claiming there is NO new one man of both Jews and gentiles JOINED in the kingdom of Israel...

In Romans 9 Hosea and Isaiah are quoted by Paul stating that Israel would fail and a new people would be His...and only a remnant of Israel you know “OTHER” not Jewish nor gentile would make it...prolly a people He would put His NOT NEW Law in their hearts and minds...a people with circumcised hearts the inner Jew...

What is the righteousness of Yah?...faith IN Him and then the faith OF Him which is an obedience to Him His Way His Faith

not adding or subtracting from His word...ask Eve...

Certainly by adding self purifying laws to make one self righteousness and exclude the goyim is NOT THE RIGHTEOUSNESS of Yah...for Christ is the EndZone of the Law for righteousness to EVERYONE who believes Romans 10:4 and not just for self purifying Jews...

Paul continues chapter 10:12 for there is NO DISTINCTION between Jew and goyim for the same Lord over ALL is rich to ALL who call upon His name 13 for WHOEVER calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.” See? not just self cleaning Jews...

Now you gonna tell me there is NO DISTINCTION between a people that keep the Sabbath and eat clean vs a people that rest everyday or Sunday power hour and then eat cat bat and wombat? LOL

IN HIM neither Jew nor gentiles but joined...one new man from the two...a citizen of Israel

Just like in the OT. Not by works but by belief and not to just Jews but WHOEVER calls On His name and in His house of prayer for ALL nations for ALL shall come worship SABBATH to SABBATH as per Isaiah...as it was in the sabbath commandment to the stranger in thy gates.

"Work's already been done, not good news, the best news ever, Some say 'Don't ask for help, God helps those who help themselves! So press on! Get it right! Otherwise get left behind!' Some say "He's keeping score, so try hard then try a little more!' Hold up, if this were true, explain to me what the Cross is SUPPOSED to do!?"

what is the cross supposed to do? Well...Just like the Passover you were passed over so now GRATEFULLY follow Him to the promised land...duh

Link full of O.T. that say "not just for Israel?" :nono: Every one of them says plainly "who live among you." NOT in fact every nation, ONLY the ones who live among them. Clear as day, except to those calling themselves 'Other.'

LOL you did note the gentiles were crowding INTO the synagogues and were told by James they were going to continue hearing Moses preached every Sabbath yes? Acts 15:21 maybe you noticed we are grafted into the trunk and not the trunk is grafted into us yes? How about we are adopted INTO Israel and NOT Israel is adopted into your Christlite every day rest?

Hey! did you ever stop your majority rules rants about man’s traditions and think that when that enmity against the goyim was destroyed (you know THAT PHOTO) and a new man was made from the two...which joined Jews and goyim...that this one new man WAS NOT a Jew? But a citizen of Israel?

And with NO DISTINCTION as the Sabbath was made for man...not just Jews...

a man with a circumcised heart...an inner Jew...

oh and ALL flesh will worship from Sabbath to Sabbath in His house of prayer for ALL nations ask Isaiah...

See? In Him we live among them after all...as citizens of Israel “OTHER” to the world and to Jews and Christlites...

 

[clefty]

I think the context is obvious.

most do not...most forget this letter was to gentiles coming into, being grafted into, becoming citizens of not by blood Israel and were learning the ways of the sect known as “the Way” Acts 24:14, 28:22

Neither does the use of "are" require the immediate recognition of the sabbath;

sure it does...because most read it as “was/were” and thus done away with...the same claim Jews charged poor Stephen with “For we have heard him say...Yahushua will...change the customs which Moses delivered to us” Acts 6:14 Luke called them false witnesses (verse 13) as poor Stephen was NOT teaching “these shadows “were” now done away with...”

sabbath keeping was still going on,

HalleluYah and not just by Jews but by His people Heb 4:9 and not just Sabbath but obviously Pentecost and Passover and the fall Atonement Acts 27:9 and not just Peter continued abstain from unclean foods...and as the Jerusalem Council Acts 15 concluded no strangled meat or with blood...Sabbath continuance affirmed by James verse 21

else there'd be no need for this verse at all.

sure is useful for MOST which use it to claim these shadows were done away with or NOT FOR US...the need if you understand as you do is to encourage these gentiles not to be swayed by their KEEPING “Jewish” ways...their fellow Gentile countrymen would ask why would they no longer ate swine? Also Jews who did NOT believe He abolished the enmity or destroyed the wall between Jews and goyim would NOT encourage these idolatrous goyim into keeping New Moons when gentiles had their own calendar...

Paul was instructing “let no one judge you...but the body of Christ”

and the following verse with “let no one defraud you” as Jews were becoming more gnostic superstitious into asceticism “worship of angels”

But yes from an early “superstitious Jewish cult“ as the Romans called them to becoming the official religion of the empire was a long and bitter divorce of gentiles from Jews. Two Sundays were celebrated in the first century ekklesia 1)First Fruits after Passover more popularly known as Easter and 2) Shavuot or Pentecost. Surely you know the anti Semitic struggle to even change the calendar to avoid these “Christ killing Jews”...“their Jewish ways” now obviously “WERE” shadows pointing to good things to come...but Paul did not write that...

Even the little non Roman council of Laodicea had to deal with sabbath keepers still in 364...Laodicea the irony Rev 3:17

I guess it depends on which translation you use. Many capitalize the sabbath in Colossians 2:16. One does wonder, according to your view,

you did agree “sabbath keeping was still going on”...

why the high sabbath is done away with and not the weekly.

the list of parties for Yah’s calendar year is found in Lev 23...the weekly Sabbath has pole position around the clock...it was Made Holy and enshrined in the 10 Words or descriptions or more popularly know as Decalogue or 10 commandments.

The other annual feasts to Israel include high holy days or days of awe. Scripturally there are 3 pilgrimage high holidays: Passover Pentecost Atonement. These are “no work day” holidays and include other “no work” days. Thus “high sabbaths” came to be known as these yearly festivals as well. It is from John 19:31 KJV that we get a high sabbath as it was Passover (high holiday) and ALSO the weekly Sabbath...so two parties on the same day is understood as a high Sabbath.

And why Paul wouldn't explain this oddity.

As shown earlier Paul did not have to explain the oddity of the annual sabbaths abrogated and the weekly Sabbath continued as they ARE a shadow of good things to come...still...in 2020...

I'm curious, though. I must assume you're a proponent of keeping the sabbath law. If so, do you keep to the whole law and teach others to do so?

I don’t keep it...break it all the time...is WHY I need Him...it keeps me though and pointed closer to and more like Him His ways...

...can’t teach the unwilling LOL...wish I could but spend too much time dodging stones and dusting my sandals...

I do however attempt to teach those who realizing what was done for them to save them are so grateful they wish to, WANT TO, do something anything FOR Him...and which pleases Him...and shows the world they are not of it but an “OTHER” kingdom...namely HIS...according to His perpetual sign...and to live into that perpetuity...Isaiah 66:23

 

[clefty]

I wonder what will happen to a Jew by blood if he lives with non-Jews and doesn't observe the Holy Sabbath as he is supposed to do.
Sorry, after reading what I wrote (line above) I recalled that a Jew by blood has no right to live with non-Jews far from his community (unless he is in a special mission ).

Anyway, I would be real surprised if Jesus whose message focuses on the Spirit (not of this world) advises me to also follow the sun and the moon and to have, therefore, a holy calendar (somehow like of my Muslims friends).
Fortunately, He didn't surprise me

you remind me of Pilate after hearing John 18:37...a real tough guy...a believer too as Romans were known for god men kings...quite a few running around then...even now lol...but just believing is not a follower of Him His way...

 

[KerimF]

you remind me of Pilate after hearing John 18:37...a real tough guy...a believer too as Romans were known for god men kings...quite a few running around then...even now lol...but just believing is not a follower of Him His way...

Here is an analogy of believing versus doing.
Even if one studied and memorized 'all' scientific books (extreme case) and didn't (or couldn't) work on 'any' scientific project to take advantage of what he knows, only naïve persons see in him a Scientist who deserves being in the Realm of Science

Here is an analogy of school books versus most advanced studies.
Every professional scientist started to learn (when kid) from certain school books. But, after finishing his high studies, his school books become souvenirs; no more the sources of information which his projects may need.


God's first teachings (related to spiritual realm) that were addressed to ancient Jews (kids of humanity) are equivalent to a good school teachings (but related to physical realm instead).

Jesus teachings (related to spiritual realm) that were addressed to all humans are equivalent to the uppermost updated versions of scientific ideas (learnt in highest studies and related to physical realm).

Whoever has ears... he 'may' hear

 

[clefty]

Here is an analogy of believing versus doing.
Even if one studied and memorized 'all' scientific books (extreme case) and didn't (or couldn't) work on 'any' scientific project to take advantage of what he knows, only naïve persons see in him a Scientist who deserves being in the Realm of Science

Here is an analogy of school books versus most advanced studies.
Every professional scientist started to learn (when kid) from certain school books. But, after finishing his high studies, his school books become souvenirs; no more the sources of information which his projects may need.


God's first teachings (related to spiritual realm) that were addressed to ancient Jews (kids of humanity) are equivalent to a good school teachings (but related to physical realm instead).

Jesus teachings (related to spiritual realm) that were addressed to all humans are equivalent to the uppermost updated versions of scientific ideas (learnt in highest studies and related to physical realm).

Whoever has ears... he 'may' hear

Nice very clever Pilate...you crucify logic as well...

When you were in primary school they taught you 2+2=4 right?

Also that C A T spells cat so far so good right?

Tell me

When you graduated from primary and all your fancy degrees and scholarly books did any of that change 2+2=4?

Or C A T spells CAT?

Did all your education change 2+2 into 5 or the color red or water?

Did all your fancy smart books tell you that C A T no longer spells CAT?

What MOST claim is that He changed Sabbath into every day any day or NOT FOR ME

and clean meats into eating cats bats and wombats is ok...

You see the error in you logic? It is not that it went from physical to spiritual but that it was CHANGED by the transference.

He never changes! What is taught in OT is demonstrated in the NT.

Do THAT what He demonstrated IF you Love Him...

The Law IS Spiritual BECAME MATERIAL as in a literal seventh day rest

Just as the WORD/LAW/SPIRIT become flesh at His birth.

FLESH PROFITS NOTHING it is the SPIRIT that gives life through the material and His Flesh.

So that One begotten in Spirit is reborn into flesh THAT WE born in the flesh MIGHT become begotten in the Spirit

You dare separate what He brought together?

As if the world came out of itself and not through His Spirit?

As if your Salvation came out of your flesh (lofty clever scholarly mind as it is) and not through His flesh of the Spirit.

2+2=4 no matter how many graduations you have. The law is written in your heart and mind. From Spiritual into flesh...and back again

The Sabbath remains seventh day no matter how many covenants are made and this law is written in the “circumcised hearts of the inner Jew”

Even Satan believes the Spirit became flesh and is Son of God King of Kings...but like you Pilate he does NOT follow Him His ways...

you may now wash your hands of this...lol...

not to be clean outwardly or inwardly but to be rid of this spiritually...and physically to return to your no rules love...

 

[clefty]

Jesus teachings (related to spiritual realm) that were addressed to all humans are...

Oh that you really truly believed that...then you would observe what Yahushua taught:

“the Sabbath was made for man”...

An exercise of rest from spiritual to physical to return to spiritual and before man even needed it...

Whoever has ears... he 'may' hear

https://biblehub.com/romans/2-13.htm

 

[KerimF]

Nice very clever Pilate...you crucify logic as well...
When you were in primary school they taught you 2+2=4 right?
Also that C A T spells cat so far so good right?

Let us revise this a bit deeper:

Did we really learn at school that "two straights are parallel if they intersect at infinity"?

First, we were told: "Two straights are parallel if they don't intersect". Don't you remember it? But this definition is wrong

So, a few years later (always at school), it was corrected by adding: "... and are on the same plane".
The updated definition is enough for those who don't like going further in their studies.

But, geometry doesn't stop here. To work on any project which is related to perspective geometry, the notion of infinity has to be introduced (as on the first line above).

This example (there are many) shows clearly that even learning science (much easier than learning spiritual truths) has to follow a progressive process; step by step.

So I am sorry for not going on, as Jesus said to Nicodemus:
"If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?"

Salut,

 

[clefty]

Let us revise this a bit deeper:

oh boy the rebellion in you is strong...

Did we really learn at school that "two straights are parallel if they intersect at infinity"?

no...my art teacher merely said “they just look like they cross“...“oh” we said...we were so young...

First, we were told: "Two straights are parallel if they don't intersect". Don't you remember it? But this definition is wrong

starting to wonder about your school

So, a few years later (always at school), it was corrected by adding: "... and are on the same plane".
The updated definition is enough for those who don't like going further in their studies.

and yet...

But, geometry doesn't stop here. To work on any project which is related to perspective geometry, the notion of infinity has to be introduced (as on the first line above).

wut? wait! that’s it?! A simple vanishing point? A point at which they APPEAR to intersect to the unfamiliar eye? How does that CHANGE the fact that two equidistant lines are constant in a plane and do not intersect?

This example (there are many) shows clearly that even learning science...has to follow a progressive process; step by step.

Is why I started with 2+2=4 of course there remains progression and advancement (discovery of zero) to [a^n + b^n = c^n for any integer value of n greater than 2] but NONE of this changes 2+2=4...I would like to see the point those parallel lines actually intersect...could you take me there into that infinity? That vanishing point? Where what we learned in art class is CHANGED and disproven—->That parallel lines do NOT intersect. Where they cross?

Hmmmm where they CROSS...well that is ironic because I CAN show you where at a CROSS it APPEARS an IMMUTABLE LAW is CHANGED proven WRONG...and at a point of infinity...but again this may be progression but it is NOT CHANGED as it only APPEARS to be altered...actually getting to that infinite point (The Cross) we would see the Law remains constant...even as we continue to move down the lines...into our futures

learning science (much easier than learning spiritual truths)

Odd...as even mankind his history has learned spiritual truths LONG before science...but yes either functionally applied might be harder take longer ...LOL

perhaps you WANT to learn science more? And apply it in your life?

So I am sorry for not going on, as Jesus said to Nicodemus:
"If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?"

Salut,

Aaaah yes...using the material world to teach spiritual truths...was there a change in Law as the spiritual became material? Or was He the same Character on earth as He was in heaven? No change.

Are we born of the flesh who are reborn and begotten in the Spirit some how different than the Spirit begetting us? Is there a familial distinction between we the grafted branches and the trunk which bears us now? Which is even IMPOSSIBLE a biological differing of genum/families in grafting fruit trees.

How does Yahushua end His teaching of spiritual to material back to spiritual?

“But he who DOES the truth comes to the light that his deeds may be CLEARLY SEEN that they have been DONE IN YAH” John 3:21

Our deeds are to be clearly seen AS His...NOT falsely based on some vanishing point that appears to alter the Law...to change what is expected of us...

Your claims of a “no rules love” and “higher Spiritual no physical 7th day rest” are NOT deeds IN YAH...but based on some APPEARANCE as though the Law changed...was wrong...not for you...

And just like in geometry actually getting to that point in infinity where the parallel lines seem to intersect (the Cross) now there that point is actually an awareness that these lines (our line of mortal material and His line Immortal Spiritual) do NOT cross...there is no change of Law...the lines are indeed parallel with a constant distance...His line and our line however are restored to as it was before the fall...He Perfect Immortal and we made into His Perfect Image mortal..never actually Him...finally we are equidistant forever re-made to be with Him where He is...halleluYah


There was one who actually thought His parallel Law Could change and intersect the lines...that he could BE Him...it didn’t work out for him and now he wants the same for all of us...to think to change both times and laws...that parallel line DO intersect...and we mortals will never die but be immortal...but it’s an appearance an illusion and an idol...a vanishing point...

The Torah is the Way Ps.119:1 the Truth Ps. 119:142 and the Life Deut. 32:46-47

It became flesh as He was the goal of the Law Romans 10:4 And called Himself all three...the way the truth and the life...follow Him do His commandments His Father’s will...IF you Love Him AS He loved you...THIS LOVE will fulfill the Law...


Wow it’s late...

gute nacht!

 

[KerimF]

oh boy the rebellion in you is strong...
Wow it’s late...

I really don't see where the issue to be solved is.

You like observing Sabbath, there is nothing wrong in doing it. In fact, you do well if this lets you feel in peace with our Creator, the way you perceive Him.

On the other hand, I wonder how knowing that I don't feel the need to observe Sabbath (or else) could affect negatively your life or of anyone else.
Of course, if I will visit your home someday and be your guest, I will not only observe Sabbath but any other ritual you see holy if it doesn't hurt anyone... though it is okay if it hurts me

Thank you.

 

[clefty]

I really don't see where the issue to be solved is.

your claims you follow Jesus but have a no rules love and that He does not expect you to actually walk as He did or when He did...

you actually willfully reject what was made for you...

You like observing Sabbath, there is nothing wrong in doing it. In fact, you do well if this lets you feel in peace with our Creator, the way you perceive Him.

On the other hand, I wonder how knowing that I don't feel the need to observe Sabbath (or else) could affect negatively your life or of anyone else.

hey bro this is HOW we love...if we think our sibling is doing something wrong to displease our heavenly Parent like claim...”nawww that ain’t for me”...well I am just trying to spare you some surprises ya dig?

Of course, if I will visit your home someday and be your guest, I will not only observe Sabbath but any other ritual you see holy if it doesn't hurt anyone... though it is okay if it hurts me

you say that TO ME?
THIS is what you should be saying TO HIM...

I did little for you but challenge your assumptions...He made you and created all this FOR you and sent His own FLESH FOR you...and to die to SAVE you...but you can’t take a day off in return for Him but as my guest you would?

Why you refuse to live as He does in His home where He wants you to live one day?...doing what you already know to do...having learned and practiced here...now

Thank you.

No thank YOU Pilate for reminding me there are some who believe but still wash their hands of it and do not follow...not sure they would truly respect ANYONE’S house rules...Even if they claimed they would...

This is exactly about manners and civility and you seem cordial enough...your Muslim friends when you pot luck with them do you bring ham? And when they object do you claim but I don’t yada yada yada...rude right? How about if you insist the Pig was slaughtered HALAL and has no blood? You see the confusion?

This is what was happening in Acts 15 as Europeans wished to fellowship with Jews but didn’t realize the meat they brought to potlucks despite being clean was made unclean for being strangled or full of blood. The Europeans civilized and well mannered did NOT insist they bring cats bats or wombats because the cross abrogated the law...they merely did not realize that a clean meat can be made unclean...

it’s called MANNERS...civility...but you run around with no rules love...lol

SATAN...His adversary...hopes we forget we are on a detour...we were created to live forever NOT IMMORTAL but eating from the tree of life...we were to tend a garden and live WITH Him...SINLESS...we were meant to live forever...beauty and joy...harmony...do you notice we would be loving and keeping a law NATURALLY...you know house rules BECAUSE we are loving we ARE well mannered...complying and not claiming a no rules love or NOT FOR ME...

was there need to covet In Eden? to LIE? to steal in the garden? To kill? Only when sin was manifest and thus revealed the Law...

Fast forward to Sinai the Law revealed...the Heavenly Parent was desperately trying to tell them who they were and where they were supposed to be headed and why...they wouldn’t hear it...“You voice is too loud...write it down “

so He did...house rules to where He lives if they wanted to be with Him...

translators of course had difficulty applying that into the future as Biblical Hebrew is limited in its law of grammar

”thou shalt not” was agreed by Jimmy’s translators as the most appropriate for their intent...but is it a prediction? “Thou shalt not“ from now on?

or rather is it a faulty attempt to Articulate what a heavenly Parent was actually teaching His family...we don’t do this...this is what we do...

Young’s translation picks up on that

13‘Thou dost not murder.

14‘Thou dost not commit adultery.

15‘Thou dost not steal.

16‘Thou dost not answer against thy neighbour a false testimony.

https://biblehub.com/ylt/exodus/20.htm

So with great subtleness the tone changes back to a Parent reminding Israel (BOTH NATIVE AND NON BLOOD descendants of Abraham) of who they are and where they are to live...because they had faith and believed and were SAVED...they now WANT to keep His house rules...you know MANNERS...civility hospitality...

Now the Parent is not predicting or demanding but describing His family lifestyle of who they belong...

You who are mine do NOT do this as there is no need for you to do any of this where I AM...here in My house...

Conversely

this IS what my family does...as where I AM this is already being done...it’s My House and you are welcome...to DO AS I do...

Finally He sent His only begotten Son (the rest of us His brothers were created on the sixth day)...to actually demonstrate for the world to see what was written on the family gate stone so many years ago...that if we understand ourselves to be His brother well we not only hear and have faith and believe but we DO...the will of Yah our heavenly parent...just as His son our brother demonstrated...

You know...manners hospitality civility...as you offered to me as my guest even doing with me what He asked of us...

Maybe some day...

But remember this world is not our home...He has gone to prepare a place for us...in His kingdom not of this world...and He knows those which are His by their fruits...those that dost not and those that dost...His will not their own...

Shalom...you are most welcome to my home...I will email you MY house rules...so don’t ya come with a “no rules love” cuz my wife don’t believe that either...LOL...

but brother... I would actually prefer seeing you in our Father’s home...ya dig?

 

[KerimF]

your claims you follow Jesus but have a no rules love and that He does not expect you to actually walk as He did or when He did...
you actually willfully reject what was made for you...
hey bro this is HOW we love...if we think our sibling is doing something wrong to displease our heavenly Parent like claim...”nawww that ain’t for me”...well I am just trying to spare you some surprises ya dig?
I would actually prefer seeing you in our Father’s home...ya dig?

My problem is that I can't see my Creator and me having different natures, if not opposite, speaking spiritually.

[1] Even if I am right, I am given the right or I have all the means to impose certain rules on some others, I simply let my rules be advices instead, and those who trust me will have the chance to apply them in their life when necessary.

[2] My relation to every person with whom I live and/or work is not formal in any way. So, every person in my life (none is a relative) is totally free to leave me (or come back) anytime he likes. Yes, I am single, because a real good marriage has to be formal and be blessed/confirmed by a certain authority, based on a certain Law... religious or civil

[3] If someone is worried about the survival of my living flesh, I used believing that if my lawless love towards all others cannot protect it, nothing else in the world can.

So thanks to Jesus, the only one who agrees with me on how I live, I don't see myself a weird/abnormal being in the world's jungle

But I also understand that the way you understand Jesus lets you see Him in total disagreement about how I believe and work

 

[clefty]

My problem is that I can't see my Creator and me having different natures, if not opposite, speaking spiritually.

Not seeing the divide between Creator and fallen creation? that is a real problem to be sure...Lucifer himself thought he might even be better than his Creator...believed in Him but did not follow...instead set out on his own...

A good indication is to check the fruits...the CREATOR follows His Law and that of Love...but you have a no rules love...NOT AT ALL LIKE HIS

[1] Even if I am right,

doubtful as I already see a great difference between Creator and you...

I am given the right or I have all the means to impose certain rules on some others,

wait wut? By whom? You are like a pirate...

I simply let my rules be advices instead, and those who trust me will have the chance to apply them in their life when necessary.

hmmm why didn’t He think of that...already you seem better than He...

[2] My relation to every person with whom I live and/or work is not formal in any way. So, every person in my life (none is a relative) is totally free to leave me (or come back) anytime he likes.

that is love then is it? Freedom to come and go as they please? which YOU allow? How benevolent of you...Dog owners do more for the pets they love.

Yes, I am single,

no surprise here...

because a real good marriage has to be

the following list is insufficient as coming from both a heart and mind which have no experience to what love actually is...

formal and be blessed/confirmed by a certain authority, based on a certain Law... religious or civil

see? Insufficient...no real experience... I am sure your no rules love would chaff rage then wither under ANY request or obligation of another...

[3] If someone is worried about the survival of my living flesh, I used believing that if my lawless love towards all others cannot protect it, nothing else in the world can.

your sins of omission grow

So thanks to Jesus, the only one who agrees with me on how I live,

you allow Him even that do you? Very generous of you...

I don't see myself a weird/abnormal being in the world's jungle

because you are quite like all the rest of the world who has heard of Him claim to love Him and determined that is enough...

But I also understand that the way you understand Jesus lets you see Him in total disagreement about how I believe and work

Well good glad we had this time you seem to have it figured out to your liking...but even pagans have stories about those that fly too high...bon voyage your flight from law...