True!
WHICH CHURCH WAS HEBREWS WRITTEN TO?
- Thread starter DougE
- Start date
True!
God's Truth
New member
This is good to have agreement.
Jesus taught that one and only way to the Jews and for all.
Paul taught the same thing.
Do you still agree?
Glad to see the insight of rare differentiation
Jesus taught this by revelation to Paul, before that this grace was not made known
God's Truth
New member
Jesus taught it when he walked the earth and so did his apostles before Paul.
What on God's earth do you think Peter was doing having that dream and telling the saved Jews that he went to the Gentiles and they received the Holy Spirit just as they all did?
God's Truth
New member
Peter preached THE GOSPEL to the GENTILES and they received the Holy Spirit just as the Jews did. SAME WAY SAME GOSPEL.
Peter was preaching that how by the grace of God, Israel could be forgiven the transgressions committed under the first covenant and be delivered into the kingdom on earth. The Gentiles could be saved through Israel.
Paul was preaching that both Jew and Gentile could be justified freely by the redemption of Christ.
God's Truth
New member
You speak some mumbo jumbo. Peter preached THE ONE AND ONLY GOSPEL that saves ALL, EVERYONE, and WHOMEVER.
Peter taught that Jesus forgives those who sinned under the old law and EVERYONE, ALL, EVERYWHERE.
The Gentiles could be saved though Israel? You want to be released from your confusion or not?
Mark 9:31 For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.
9:32 But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him.
1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
Compare Mark and 1 Corinthians....how could the twelve be preaching the same gospel as Paul when they didn't understand his death and resurrection?
The twelve were preaching the gospel of the kingdom same as Jesus taught them Mark 1:14-15
God's Truth
New member
THEY EVENTUALLY UNDERSTOOD IT.
They still taught what Jesus told them to teach!
They did understand.
John 6:12 "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear.
John 12:16 At first His disciples did not understand these things, but after Jesus was glorified they remembered what had been done to Him, and they realized that these very things had also been written about Him.
John 2:22 After He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this. Then they believed the Scripture and the word that Jesus had spoken.
John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Advocate to be with you forever--
John 14:25 All this I have spoken to you while I am still with you.
God's Truth
New member
DougE
Jesus taught that he would die and rise again.
That teaching did not originate from Paul.
Matthew 16:21 From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.
Matthew 12:40
For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Matthew 17:23
They will kill Him, and on the third day He will be raised to life." And the disciples were deeply grieved.
Matthew 20:18
"Look, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and scribes. They will condemn Him to death
Matthew 20:19
and will deliver Him to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. And on the third day He will be raised to life."
Matthew 28:6
He is not here; He has risen, just as He said! Come, see the place where He lay.
This is what even the enemies of Jesus knew:
Matthew 27:63
"Sir," they said, "we remember that while He was alive that deceiver said 'After three days I will rise again.'
Even Jesus' enemies KNEW HE WOULD DIE AND RISE AGAIN.
No such thing what you claim about two different gospels and the apostles teaching the Gentiles some other way to get saved.
Jesus taught that he would die and rise again.
That teaching did not originate from Paul.
Matthew 16:21 From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.
Matthew 12:40
For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Matthew 17:23
They will kill Him, and on the third day He will be raised to life." And the disciples were deeply grieved.
Matthew 20:18
"Look, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and scribes. They will condemn Him to death
Matthew 20:19
and will deliver Him to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. And on the third day He will be raised to life."
Matthew 28:6
He is not here; He has risen, just as He said! Come, see the place where He lay.
This is what even the enemies of Jesus knew:
Matthew 27:63
"Sir," they said, "we remember that while He was alive that deceiver said 'After three days I will rise again.'
Even Jesus' enemies KNEW HE WOULD DIE AND RISE AGAIN.
No such thing what you claim about two different gospels and the apostles teaching the Gentiles some other way to get saved.
My understanding was that these letters were written to specific communities. Like Romans, or Corinthians. So this was written to a community of Jewish Christians, i.e. Hebrews. This is a separate concept than the larger Christian Community which included all of these smaller communities.
Do I have this right?
Do I have this right?
Close, but no. Non-Christian Jewish believers.
I think you are wrong. As far as I understand it, in the times of the early Church there weren't clear lines between Jews and Christians. So "Jewish believers" weren't a non-Christian group, just a type of believer, not any different than Corinthian or Roman believers, which you call "Christians".
Yes, after Christ rose they understood, but that only verifies the fact that before the resurrection they could not have been preaching salvation by the cross as does Paul and therefore they were not all preaching the same gospel.
Paul did not originate the death and resurrection as you stated that he did......that was in the scriptures of the prophets.
Paul revealed the redemption provided by the death and resurrection for all.
God's Truth
New member
SALVATION THROUGH JESUS!. Did you want Jesus to come and die first then preach the gospel?
Jesus taught salvation through him. HE is the good news. NO ONE could receive the Holy Spirit until he died. That is what Jesus taught. It was the way for any and all to be saved.
God's Truth
New member
What are you talking about? Show where I said it originated with Paul.
JESUS DID THAT WITH HIS APOSTLES.
Sorry, but I guess I misread you and thought you were refuting the idea that Paul originated it
You said "Jesus taught that he would die and rise again.
That teaching did not originate from Paul."
God's Truth
New member
It didn't originate with Paul.
That is right, it did NOT originate from Paul.