IS CALLING UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD ONLY FOR ISRAEL ?

DougE

Well-known member
Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

This verse is often used in the context of proclaiming the gospel of salvation, but in the context of Romans 10 it is best viewed as being directed to Israel.

The subject of Romans 10 is the salvation of Israel (Romans 10:1).

While Paul acknowledges the church calling upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ in 1 Corinthians 1:2 he does so in a descriptive sense and in accord with Psalm 145:18; his citations of calling upon the Lord found in Romans 10 are strictly in regard to the believing remnant of Israel.

Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

2:15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.

2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

Peter was speaking to Israel in verse 14. Peter said in verse 16 that this occurrence was according to the prophet Joel (Joel 2:28-29). Peter quoted Joel 2:32 in Acts 2:21 in saying "whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved".

Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

In Joel it can be read that "whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered", which means they would be delivered to enter the Davidic kingdom on earth (Isaiah 2:2-3 Psalm 22:28 Luke 1:32). In Joel 2:32, calling on the name of the Lord is speaking in regard to the believing remnant of Israel.

Chapters 9, 10 and 11 of Romans are dealing with the salvation of Israel. The verses below in Romans further substantiate that Paul was speaking of the believing remnant of Israel and how calling on the Lord should therefore be viewed in this light.

Romans 10:19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Romans 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Israel, as can be seen in the above verses, would be provoked to jealousy by a foolish nation who are not a people (Deuteronomy 32:21); this foolish nation is the believing remant of Israel comprised of both Jew and Gentile (Romans 10:12); the people who were not a people, but called the children of God, the people of God (Hosea 1:10 Hosea 2:23 1 Peter 2:9-10).

Clearly, Romans 10:13 in speaking of calling on the name of the Lord is best applied to Israel.
 
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beloved57

Well-known member
douge

[h=2]IS CALLING UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD ONLY FOR ISRAEL ?[/h]

Yes, but not the israel you probably mean. The Israel Im speaking of is a Spiritual People comprised of both born again jews and gentiles. The Israel of God Gal 6:14-16


14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
 

DougE

Well-known member
douge



Yes, but not the israel you probably mean. The Israel Im speaking of is a Spiritual People comprised of both born again jews and gentiles. The Israel of God Gal 6:14-16


14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

Paul does not refer to the believers in the body as the Israel of God but as a new creature wherein there is neither Jew or Greek, circumcision or uncircumcision Galatians 6:15
 

Right Divider

Body part
Paul does not refer to the believers in the body as the Israel of God but as a new creature wherein there is neither Jew or Greek, circumcision or uncircumcision Galatians 6:15
It's almost surprising that folks like him cannot see that Paul refers to the body believers AND the Israel of God separately in that passage. But they have they doctrine that they must force upon the scripture.
 

DougE

Well-known member
You sound confused to me.

No you are conflating the new creature and the Israel of God. Paul is not saying the new creature is the Israel of God. He mentions the Israel of God as having peace and mercy being on them as well as to those walk according to the rule
 

beloved57

Well-known member
No you are conflating the new creature and the Israel of God. Paul is not saying the new creature is the Israel of God. He mentions the Israel of God as having peace and mercy being on them as well as to those walk according to the rule

I have the slightest idea what you talking about.
 

DougE

Well-known member
I have the slightest idea what you talking about.

Here is what you originally said:

"Yes, but not the israel you probably mean. The Israel Im speaking of is a Spiritual People comprised of both born again jews and gentiles. The Israel of God Gal 6:14-16


14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God."


The body of Christ is a new creature NOT the Israel of God.

In verse 15 Paul is saying the only thing that availeth is a new creature.

In verse 16 Paul is simply saying peace and mercy be upon 2 groups
A) them
B) the Israel of God
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Here is what you originally said:

"Yes, but not the israel you probably mean. The Israel Im speaking of is a Spiritual People comprised of both born again jews and gentiles. The Israel of God Gal 6:14-16


14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God."


The body of Christ is a new creature NOT the Israel of God.

In verse 15 Paul is saying the only thing that availeth is a new creature.

In verse 16 Paul is simply saying peace and mercy be upon 2 groups
A) them
B) the Israel of God

I know what I said, after all I posted it
 

DougE

Well-known member
I know what I said, after all I posted it


I was only going back and starting all over since you didn't understand my response
BELOW IS MY RESPONSE which you apparently missed seeing

The body of Christ is a new creature NOT the Israel of God.

In verse 15 Paul is saying the only thing that availeth is a new creature.

In verse 16 Paul is simply saying peace and mercy be upon 2 groups
A) them
B) the Israel of God
 

beloved57

Well-known member
I was only going back and starting all over since you didn't understand my response
BELOW IS MY RESPONSE which you apparently missed seeing

The body of Christ is a new creature NOT the Israel of God.

In verse 15 Paul is saying the only thing that availeth is a new creature.

In verse 16 Paul is simply saying peace and mercy be upon 2 groups
A) them
B) the Israel of God

The them and the Israel of God are the same ! Israel of God is a characterization of the them !
 

God's Truth

New member
Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

This verse is often used in the context of proclaiming the gospel of salvation, but in the context of Romans 10 it is best viewed as being directed to Israel.

The subject of Romans 10 is the salvation of Israel (Romans 10:1).

While Paul acknowledges the church calling upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ in 1 Corinthians 1:2 he does so in a descriptive sense and in accord with Psalm 145:18; his citations of calling upon the Lord found in Romans 10 are strictly in regard to the believing remnant of Israel.

Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

2:15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.

2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

Peter was speaking to Israel in verse 14. Peter said in verse 16 that this occurrence was according to the prophet Joel (Joel 2:28-29). Peter quoted Joel 2:32 in Acts 2:21 in saying "whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved".

Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

In Joel it can be read that "whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered", which means they would be delivered to enter the Davidic kingdom on earth (Isaiah 2:2-3 Psalm 22:28 Luke 1:32). In Joel 2:32, calling on the name of the Lord is speaking in regard to the believing remnant of Israel.

Chapters 9, 10 and 11 of Romans are dealing with the salvation of Israel. The verses below in Romans further substantiate that Paul was speaking of the believing remnant of Israel and how calling on the Lord should therefore be viewed in this light.

Romans 10:19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Romans 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Israel, as can be seen in the above verses, would be provoked to jealousy by a foolish nation who are not a people (Deuteronomy 32:21); this foolish nation is the believing remant of Israel comprised of both Jew and Gentile (Romans 10:12); the people who were not a people, but called the children of God, the people of God (Hosea 1:10 Hosea 2:23 1 Peter 2:9-10).

Clearly, Romans 10:13 in speaking of calling on the name of the Lord is best applied to Israel.

Why do you keep going against what is written?

ALL WHO CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.

What is the name of the Lord?

Jesus is the name of the Lord.


Romans 10:13 for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."


Is that just to the Jews? NO.


Romans 9:24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?

Romans 3:29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,
 

God's Truth

New member
I was only going back and starting all over since you didn't understand my response
BELOW IS MY RESPONSE which you apparently missed seeing

The body of Christ is a new creature NOT the Israel of God.

In verse 15 Paul is saying the only thing that availeth is a new creature.

In verse 16 Paul is simply saying peace and mercy be upon 2 groups
A) them
B) the Israel of God

Jesus is the Israel of God.

And all who are put in Jesus are the body of Israel.

Exodus 4:22 Then say to Pharaoh, 'This is what the LORD says: Israel is my firstborn son,

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Galatians 6:16 Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule--to the Israel of God.


Look at that, Paul said that to GENTILES.
 

Bright Raven

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Jesus is the Israel of God.

And all who are put in Jesus are the body of Israel.

Exodus 4:22 Then say to Pharaoh, 'This is what the LORD says: Israel is my firstborn son,

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Galatians 6:16 Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule--to the Israel of God.


Look at that, Paul said that to GENTILES.

Jesus is God's Son, not Israel.
 

God's Truth

New member
Jesus is God's Son, not Israel.

Are you denying the 'types' of Jesus in the old testament?

A 'type' of Jesus was the ROCK in the desert.

A type of Jesus was the bronze snake.

A type of Jesus was Israel.

Crossing over the Jordan, being baptized in the Jordan...all types of Jesus.
 

Bright Raven

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Are you denying the 'types' of Jesus in the old testament?

A 'type' of Jesus was the ROCK in the desert.

A type of Jesus was the bronze snake.

A type of Jesus was Israel.

Crossing over the Jordan, being baptized in the Jordan...all types of Jesus.

Just telling you that Jesus is not Israel.
 

God's Truth

New member
Luke 24:27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.

John 12:41 Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus' glory and spoke about him.

Acts 3:18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer.

Acts 3:24 "Indeed, beginning with Samuel, all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days.

Acts 13:27 The people of Jerusalem and their rulers did not recognize Jesus, yet in condemning him they fulfilled the words of the prophets that are read every Sabbath.

God the Father's promises---about Jesus
Passover---about Jesus
The Rock in the desert---about Jesus
The bronze snake Moses made---about Jesus
The manna from heaven---about Jesus
The old Law---about Jesus
The purification/ceremonial works---about Jesus
Circumcision, special days, animal sacrifices---about Jesus
Crossing the Jordan---about Jesus
Baptized in the Jordan---about Jesus
The promised land---about Jesus
Redeemer, Savior, Deliverer, Shepherd, High Priest---about Jesus
Isaac and Ishmael---about Jesus
Jacob and Esau---about Jesus
All the Law and the Prophets---about Jesus
All the Old Testament Scriptures---about Jesus
John 5:39 ...These are the very Scriptures that testify about me,

...and so much more.


The Old Testament was about earthly man, and earthly things.
The Old Testament was about prophesies and mysteries hidden.
The New Testament is about the spiritual man, about spiritual things.
The New Testament is about prophesies fulfilled and mysteries revealed.

​​​
 

DougE

Well-known member
Luke 24:27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.

John 12:41 Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus' glory and spoke about him.

Acts 3:18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer.

Acts 3:24 "Indeed, beginning with Samuel, all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days.

Acts 13:27 The people of Jerusalem and their rulers did not recognize Jesus, yet in condemning him they fulfilled the words of the prophets that are read every Sabbath.

God the Father's promises---about Jesus
Passover---about Jesus
The Rock in the desert---about Jesus
The bronze snake Moses made---about Jesus
The manna from heaven---about Jesus
The old Law---about Jesus
The purification/ceremonial works---about Jesus
Circumcision, special days, animal sacrifices---about Jesus
Crossing the Jordan---about Jesus
Baptized in the Jordan---about Jesus
The promised land---about Jesus
Redeemer, Savior, Deliverer, Shepherd, High Priest---about Jesus
Isaac and Ishmael---about Jesus
Jacob and Esau---about Jesus
All the Law and the Prophets---about Jesus
All the Old Testament Scriptures---about Jesus
John 5:39 ...These are the very Scriptures that testify about me,

...and so much more.


The Old Testament was about earthly man, and earthly things.
The Old Testament was about prophesies and mysteries hidden.
The New Testament is about the spiritual man, about spiritual things.
The New Testament is about prophesies fulfilled and mysteries revealed.

​​​

Sorry the new testament did not reveal mysteries, they were revealed to Paul Ephesians 3:3
 

DougE

Well-known member
Are you denying the 'types' of Jesus in the old testament?

A 'type' of Jesus was the ROCK in the desert.

A type of Jesus was the bronze snake.

A type of Jesus was Israel.

Crossing over the Jordan, being baptized in the Jordan...all types of Jesus.

I agree with the rock and snake but do you have a verse for Israel being a type?
 
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