The Late Great Urantia Revelation
- Thread starter Caino
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under constructionatrol:
...yummmmm, makes me want some popcorn.
Good to have you on the thread.
Caino
Aimiel
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The earth is fixed and doesn't move... the shadow of Venus proves this to be true. It cannot be explained any other way. The earth does not fly through space, rotate or even move at all.
1 Chronicles 16:30
Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved.
Psalm 93
The LORD reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the LORD is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved.
John Mortimer
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"Quantity may be identified as a fact, thus becoming a scientific uniformity. Quality, being a matter of mind interpretation, represents an estimate of values, and must, therefore, remain an experience of the individual. When both science and religion become less dogmatic and more tolerant of criticism, philosophy will then begin to achieve unity in the intelligent comprehension of the universe." UB
Young Graphite in Old Rocks Challenges the Earliest Signs of Life
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110518121227.htm
"ScienceDaily (May 21, 2011) — Carbon found within ancient rocks has played a crucial role developing a time line for the emergence of biological life on the planet billions of years ago. But applying cutting-edge technology to samples of ancient rocks from northern Canada has revealed the carbon-based minerals may be much younger than the rock they inhabit, a team of researchers report in the latest edition of the journal Nature Geoscience"....
"Scientists may some day measure the energy, or force manifestations, of gravitation, light, and electricity, but these same scientists can never (scientifically) tell you what these universe phenomena are. Science deals with physical-energy activities; religion deals with eternal values. True philosophy grows out of the wisdom which does its best to correlate these quantitative and qualitative observations. There always exists the danger that the purely physical scientist may become afflicted with mathematical pride and statistical egotism, not to mention spiritual blindness."
Caino
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I see you are optimistic that your own fantasy stories will find sympathy in science.
The problem is that science slays gods of the gaps. Mystery is essential for the scientist and the religionist alike, but while the scientist sees it as a challenge to overcome, the religionist must see it as a necessity to be maintained at all costs, lest the absurdity of his particular god delusion make it through all the barriers his cult puts up.
I will accept any unambiguous evidence for the existence of your god, and be amazed and change my mind.
Do you have any such unambiguous evidence?
Stuart
badp
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Oh, how I wish! The problem is that science is failing to either close or fill the gaps. It leaves them gaping open, waiting for some new imaginations to fill it. Like some of that Steven Hawking nonsense.
Lack of ambiguity is an interesting requisite. Theoretically, every piece of evidence can be called ambiguous because it's subject to whatever worldview you hold. Borrowing from another discussion, if you are a materialist, you may say consciousness stems from the physical brain. If you are not a materialist, you may say that consciousness exists outside the physical realm. Either way, you yet again hit the brick wall of induction. If lack of ambiguity in your eyes is a requirement, then so be it. But that's just another way of saying you have already made up your mind about what evidence you will and will not accept.
Lost Comet
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Ain't that the truth!? It's amazing what they will believe in order to disbelieve.
The funny thing is, weather one is religious or one claims the guidance of strict logic, neither one has a monopoly on reality.
RELATIVITY OF CONCEPT FRAMES
115:1.1 Partial, incomplete, and evolving intellects would be helpless in the master universe, would be unable to form the first rational thought pattern, were it not for the innate ability of all mind, high or low, to form a universe frame in which to think. If mind cannot fathom conclusions, if it cannot penetrate to true origins, then will such mind unfailingly postulate conclusions and invent origins that it may have a means of logical thought within the frame of these mind-created postulates. And while such universe frames for creature thought are indispensable to rational intellectual operations, they are, without exception, erroneous to a greater or lesser degree.
115:1.2 Conceptual frames of the universe are only relatively true; they are serviceable scaffolding which must eventually give way before the expansions of enlarging cosmic comprehension. The understandings of truth, beauty, and goodness, morality, ethics, duty, love, divinity, origin, existence, purpose, destiny, time, space, even Deity, are only relatively true. God is much, much more than a Father, but the Father is man's highest concept of God; nonetheless, the Father-Son portrayal of Creator-creature relationship will be augmented by those supermortal conceptions of Deity which will be attained in Orvonton, in Havona, and on Paradise. Man must think in a mortal universe frame, but that does not mean that he cannot envision other and higher frames within which thought can take place.
115:1.3 In order to facilitate mortal comprehension of the universe of universes, the diverse levels of cosmic reality have been designated as finite, absonite, and absolute. Of these only the absolute is unqualifiedly eternal, truly existential. Absonites and finites are derivatives, modifications, qualifications, and attenuations of the original and primordial absolute reality of infinity.
115:1.4 The realms of the finite exist by virtue of the eternal purpose of God. Finite creatures, high and low, may propound theories, and have done so, as to the necessity of the finite in the cosmic economy, but in the last analysis it exists because God so willed. The universe cannot be explained, neither can a finite creature offer a rational reason for his own individual existence without appealing to the prior acts and pre-existent volition of ancestral beings, Creators or procreators." UB
Caino
You haven't got the faintest clue what you are talking about, have you.
Not if you are an empiricist. It is pretty clear that there is unambiguous evidence that the brain is AT LEAST electrochemical in its nature, but there is NO unambiguous evidence that it is anything more than that. Ignoring those who claim there is woo attached is as logically valid a response as humouring them with a reply, because they are making no testable claim, and therefore no meaningful claim. The claim is as valid as any crackpot's untestable fantasy concept.
No, it's a way of you demonstrating that Eros and Chaos of the Roman creation myth are not actually responsible for the creation. You have every other crazy creation myth to take on as well as real evidence-based scientific theory. It is also an expectation that you have properly discounted all the other well-established reasons that human brains take Imaginary Friends and celestial conspiracy theories seriously.
I stand by my statement that I will listen to unambiguous evidence.
Stuart
Aimiel
Well-known member
The reason that religion fails is men try to make it something it's not. God designed His commands to protect us from ourselves. Men invent religious dogma to bring themselves up to God's Level. The best we can do is filthy rags. God came down in The Form of Flesh (Jesus) to accept us just as we are and give us eternal life. Rejecting His Offer is simply stupid.
When one is in a relationship with Jesus (Who is Truth), He can reveal whatever truth He wishes (or that we're in need of). Spiritual reality isn't what most religions project.
I agree with 82.6% of what you said, will highlight what I don't agree with.
* dogma is an attempt to preseve what religious culture thought important......but yes, once petrified spiritual truth dies.
When theology masters religion, religion dies; it becomes a doctrine instead of a life. The mission of theology is merely to facilitate the self-consciousness of personal spiritual experience. Theology constitutes the religious effort to define, clarify, expound, and justify the experiential claims of religion, which, in the last analysis, can be validated only by living faith. In the higher philosophy of the universe, wisdom, like reason, becomes allied to faith. Reason, wisdom, and faith are man’s highest human attainments. Reason introduces man to the world of facts, to things; wisdom introduces him to a world of truth, to relationships; faith initiates him into a world of divinity, spiritual experience.
* filthy rags? thats a position of low self esteem. Before Jesus even began the public phaze of his teaching he had (as a human) pleased God. He taught that we can to.
"The Universal Father never imposes any form of arbitrary recognition, formal worship, or slavish service upon the intelligent will creatures of the universes. The evolutionary inhabitants of the worlds of time and space must of themselves — in their own hearts — recognize, love, and voluntarily worship him. The Creator refuses to coerce or compel the submission of the spiritual free wills of his material creatures. The affectionate dedication of the human will to the doing of the Father’s will is man’s choicest gift to God; in fact, such a consecration of creature will constitutes man’s only possible gift of true value to the Paradise Father. In God, man lives, moves, and has his being; there is nothing which man can give to God except this choosing to abide by the Father’s will, and such decisions, effected by the intelligent will creatures of the universes, constitute the reality of that true worship which is so satisfying to the love-dominated nature of the Creator Father."
Caino
Aimiel
Well-known member
Yes, filthy rags:
Isaiah 64:6
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.
All the 'works' that men do cannot be any better than filthy rags in God's Sight. ONLY Jesus is worthy of ANY praise.
Luke 14:11
For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
We cannot please God, in any way, shape or form. Only Christ's Blood will satisfy God's demand of perfection. Only Jesus is worthy of any praise.
We are His slaves, not by command, but by His very Presence inside of us. He causes the desires of our hearts to change to be pleasing to Him. There is nothing good in any man, except God be in him.
God is The Only One Who is capable of putting anything at all good into anyone. No one will have a single thing to brag about in Heaven, except what God did for them.
Aimiel
Well-known member
HOGWASH. The very currency of Heaven is humility. Your philosophy is the exact opposite of a Godly conscience. We are nothing in His Sight. We are less than a speck of dust to The King of The Universe. The Lord, while in human form, called Himself: "The Son of Man," not even, "The Son of God." He demonstrated for us Godly humility. Each of us is lost in our own ego trip, until we become saved by His Blood.
Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
I have the measure of faith in my Redeemer; I have no faith in my own arm of flesh. His Arm supplies all my needs according to His Riches in glory by Christ Jesus. I can do nothing of myself.
That may be your religion, but Jesus never taught human sacrifice to change a changeless God, there was already salvation and forgiveness before Jesus submitted to the shared human experience of death and then raised himself from the dead.
Jesus had a religion and taught a gospel long before the cross and the new gospel of impulsive Peter and Pagan Paul.
Blood sacrifice is the primitive teachings from Paul's Mithraic childhood leanings.
Caino
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