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The Barbarian

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WASHINGTON — Confusion over President Trump’s order to allow migrant families to remain together after they illegally enter the United States led to a tense argument at the White House late Thursday as senior officials across the federal government clashed over how to carry it out, according to several people briefed on the meeting.

The dispute continued Friday morning as Kevin K. McAleenan, the commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, returned to the White House to hash out his agency’s ability to detain families with children and refer all of the adults for prosecution under the president’s “zero tolerance” policy.

The bureaucratic clash threatened to undermine Mr. Trump as his administration scrambles to escape an escalating political crisis and heartbreaking images and audio recordings of migrant children separated from their parents and dispatched to government detention facilities.

It also echoed the chaos at American airports that Mr. Trump plunged the government into, days after taking office, with his ban on travel from predominantly Muslim countries that surprised Border Patrol agents and State Department consular officials.

Officials at the southwest border are struggling to obey Mr. Trump’s demand to prosecute people who illegally enter the United States — ending what the president has reviled as a “catch and release” policy — while also following an executive order he issued Wednesday to keep migrant parents and their children together as they are processed in courts.

But as with the case of the travel ban, the reality of a vastly complicated bureaucratic system is colliding head-on with Mr. Trump’s shoot-from-the-hip use of executive power.

The whiplash-inducing move caught several people by surprise. Just a day earlier, one person close to the president said, Mr. Trump told advisers that separating families at the border was the best deterrent to illegal immigration and said that “my people love it.”

On Wednesday, Mr. Trump repeatedly changed his mind about precisely what he wanted to do, and how, according to people familiar with the discussions. The president vacillated about whether to do it until a short time before he signed the order, one person said.

Thursday night’s meeting was held in the White House Situation Room and lasted at least 90 minutes, according to three people briefed on the discussion who described it on the condition of anonymity.

They said Customs and Border Protection officials argued forcefully that agents who are apprehending migrant families at the border cannot refer all of the adults for prosecution because the Justice Department does not have the resources to accept all of the cases.

As a result, the officials from Customs and Border Protection told White House and Justice Department officials that they have had to issue fewer prosecution referrals of adults with children despite the president’s zero-tolerance policy.

Justice officials shot back, maintaining that the department has made no changes to its hard-line stance on illegal border crossings as it continues to receive referrals for prosecutions from Customs and Border Protection agents.

Government lawyers will “prosecute adults who cross our border illegally instead of claiming asylum at any port of entry,” Sarah Isgur Flores, a Justice Department spokeswoman, said Thursday in a statement.

The Justice Department has been combating reports about its ability or willingness to enact the zero-tolerance policy. Rumors of case dismissals forced federal prosecutors to deny that they have dismissed immigration violation cases in South Texas.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/22/us/politics/donald-trump-immigration-midterms.html

We need Casey Stengel:
"Can't anybody here play this game?"

How can something that worked so effectively two years ago, be botched so badly now?

Record numbers of illegal aliens were being sent back; asylum seekers were being promptly processed, and no kids were being abused. Now, it's a swamp. And the powers that be are hiring more alligators.
 
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Danoh

New member
All of that reads exactly like a description of the same kind of massive mismanagement found by Auditors, Regulators, and Bankers, and so on, back when Trump's hand was busy running each Casino they so blindly loaned him all those hundreds of millions on, to the ground.

The man remains an incompetent fraud.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
How can something that worked so effectively two years ago, be botched so badly now?

Record numbers of illegal aliens were being sent back; asylum seekers were being promptly processed, and no kids were being abused. Now, it's a swamp. And the powers that be are hiring more alligators.

Wrong on all counts. You continue to fall for the Dem. talking points.
 

The Barbarian

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Barbarian observes:
How can something that worked so effectively two years ago, be botched so badly now?

Record numbers of illegal aliens were being sent back; asylum seekers were being promptly processed, and no kids were being abused. Now, it's a swamp. And the powers that be are hiring more alligators.

Wrong on all counts.

Well, let's take a look...

deport-chart.jpg


President Barack Obama has often been referred to by immigration groups as the "Deporter in Chief."

Between 2009 and 2015 his administration has removed more than 2.5 million people through immigration orders, which doesn’t include the number of people who "self-deported" or were turned away and/or returned to their home country at the border by U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP).

How does he compare to other presidents?
According to governmental data, the Obama administration has deported more people than any other president's administration in history.

In fact, they have deported more than the sum of all the presidents of the 20th century.

President George W. Bush's administration deported just over two million during his time in office; and Obama’s numbers don’t reflect his last year in office, for which data is not yet available.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/obamas-deportation-policy-numbers/story?id=41715661

I thought you wanted illegal immigration to stop. Obama was removing more people than Bush did.

And here's something just as important:
FY%202008-2016%20ICE%20Removals%20by%20Criminality.jpg


During the Obama administration, deportation of illegal aliens with criminal convictions rose significantly as Obama emphasized getting dangerous criminals first. Trump has abandoned that objective in favor of jailing people seeking asylum and taking their kids away.

With the expected result.

You continue to fall for whatever Trump tells you.
 

The Barbarian

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As you see, the definition used by Obama is the same as is being used now. The difference is, as you see above, is that Obama's focus was on getting dangerous criminals deported as a priority.

Notice the marked increase in deportation of aliens with convictions under Obama. Trump reversed that in favor of focusing on mothers bringing their children in and applying for asylum. (they're easier to catch)
 

lifeisgood

New member
I did not want Trump as president, however, the hate and vilification against him, his family, his associates, people associated with him, or those who even pronounce President Trump's name, has been so visceral that I was made to look at President Trump and try to see what the fuss is all about.

There is not having a rational conversation face-to-face with some people because their hate is so visceral, if you ask them, 'why do you hate President Trump?' they cannot give a rational answer.

Generalities? yes. But they cannot tell me concrete reasons as to why they hate, vilify him, his family, his children, his associates, his friends, etc. They simply stump their feet, walk away, insult, or never wants to speak to me again.

It is impossible from where I am sitting that you can hate all of these people. I can see not liking one person in particular. But their whole family, friends, and anyone that even say anything good about him?
 

The Barbarian

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It would be wrong to think of Trump as pure evil. He's weak and venial. I doubt very much if he ever wanted to harm anyone, unless he thought it could benefit him in some way.

Tearing kids away from their parents might even have bothered him, but the key element was that he thought his base would like it. And when it became clear that decent Americans were horrified and angered by it, he caved quickly.

He's not the devil. He's the personification of what is known as the "banality of evil."
 
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