Undocumented immigrants crowd California DMV offices for new licenses

[The Berean]

I don't know how California's tests are written, but in Indiana many of the questions are so ambiguous that I know several bright native speakers who nearly gave up after failing 3-4 times. For years I held a public passenger CDL to drive a bus, yet I remember prior to that I never aced a written driving exam. I always missed at least one answer since, depending how you interpreted the poorly structured questions, there might be more than one possible answer and you had to guess what they meant. I can't imagine how a language barrier might affect it, even if the test was written in Spanish. One might also have to consider who might have structured the test and whether or not they might have any ulterior motives as to the outcomes.

One issue is that the many of the immigrants have very poor reading skills due to lack of education. One of my friends at church is a teacher and we have had long discussions on the plight of immigrant and low income children and their struggles in school. One point that my friend made was that parental involvement is important to a child's educational success. He further made the point that the immigrant parents not only do not speak English but their Spanish writing and reading comprehension is also very poor. My friend is half Chinese/half white and his Spanish is far better than the majority of immigrant parents he meets at student-parent meetings. People with 2nd-3rd grade education will probably have great difficulty in reading the written driver's test which are written at an 8th grade reading level I believe. Here is a sample written test.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/d...1QdTLH5U/dl5/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/?lang=en

 

[annabenedetti]

One issue is that the many of the immigrants have very poor reading skills due to lack of education. One of my friends at church is a teacher and we have had long discussions on the plight of immigrant and low income children and their struggles in school. One point that my friend made was that parental involvement is important to a child's educational success.

Your friend is so right. This is a very good look at the importance of not just parental involvement, but parental interaction with their children at the earliest age, before age four and most critically in the first year:

The First Year: A baby’s brain needs love to develop. What happens in the first year is profound.

...More than two decades ago Todd Risley and Betty Hart, both child psychologists then at the University of Kansas in Lawrence, recorded hundreds of hours of interactions between children and adults in 42 families from across the socioeconomic spectrum, following the kids from the age of nine months to three years.

Studying the transcripts of these recordings, Risley and Hart made a surprising discovery. Children in well-off families—where the parents were typically college-educated professionals—heard an average of 2,153 words an hour spoken to them, whereas children in families on welfare heard an average of 616 words. By the age of four this difference translated to a cumulative gap of some 30 million words. Parents in poorer homes tended to make shorter, more perfunctory comments, like “Stop that,” and “Get down,” whereas parents in wealthier homes had extended conversations with their kids about a variety of topics, encouraging them to use their memory and imagination. The kids in low socioeconomic families were being raised on a poor linguistic diet.

The amount of talking parents did with their children made a big difference, the researchers found. The kids who were spoken to more got higher scores on IQ tests at age three. They also performed better in school at ages nine and ten...​

Socioeconomics does matter, it does have a huge impact on the way kids learn, adjust to and relate to society, form human bonds, learn empathy, determine right and wrong, see goals as obtainable and worth working for... so many things work against kids growing up in disadvantaged homes and neighborhoods. It's tragic.

 

[resodko]

Not only do I think that this should be done, but once they do this, they should:

1. Build an electric wire fence along the Mexican-American border and
2. Fill the Rio Grande with piranha.

how about creating electric piranhas?

I suspect the water in the Rio Grande is far too cold for a tropical fish like piranha.

they could have electric heaters built in! :banana:

 

[resodko]

Parents in poorer homes tended to make shorter, more perfunctory comments, like “Stop that,” and “Get down,” ....

..."put down that crack pipe", "don't play with the welfare check"......

 

[Tinark]

Abolish drivers licenses and immigration restrictions. You shouldn't need permission from government to travel, either domestically or internationally.

Incompetent drivers on the road is a public safety issue. If there were no danger to anyone else from an incompetent driver, I'd be with you.

As far as immigration goes, there should at least be a system in place to document who is entering and living in the country and do background checks on them (no prevent those with criminal backgrounds or those with criminal or terrorist associations from entering and living here). I do believe that immigration quotas should be lifted and eventually eliminated, but those living here should at least be documented.

 

[The Berean]

..."put down that crack pipe", "don't play with the welfare check"......

And don't forget the food stamps and government cheese.

 

[The Berean]

Incompetent drivers on the road is a public safety issue. If there were no danger to anyone else from an incompetent driver, I'd be with you.

As far as immigration goes, there should at least be a system in place to document who is entering and living in the country and do background checks on them (no prevent those with criminal backgrounds or those with criminal or terrorist associations from entering and living here). I do believe that immigration quotas should be lifted and eventually eliminated, but those living here should at least be documented.

I actually agree with all of this. :up:

 

[Tinark]

what?

that is just SOO not true

illegals take jobs (and benefits from the gov, but i hate calling them benefits.. when they foster dependency, etc..) but in any case, they take these away from legal Americans

they also commit violent crime, especially if they feel they are being targeted for deportation and may feel they have nothing to lose...

"Taking jobs" is such BS. Jobs aren't fixed in number, they are created all the time. Do you similarly complain about people having children that they will "take jobs from all the adult Americans" or that colleges should close down because the graduates will "take away jobs" from all the current graduates?

All human groups commit crimes and violent crimes. So I'm not exactly sure what your point is that sometimes violent criminals happen to be undocumented immigrants.

 

[Morpheus]

One issue is that the many of the immigrants have very poor reading skills due to lack of education. One of my friends at church is a teacher and we have had long discussions on the plight of immigrant and low income children and their struggles in school. One point that my friend made was that parental involvement is important to a child's educational success. He further made the point that the immigrant parents not only do not speak English but their Spanish writing and reading comprehension is also very poor. My friend is half Chinese/half white and his Spanish is far better than the majority of immigrant parents he meets at student-parent meetings. People with 2nd-3rd grade education will probably have great difficulty in reading the written driver's test which are written at an 8th grade reading level I believe. Here is a sample written test.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/d...1QdTLH5U/dl5/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/?lang=en

Up until about three years ago when politics interfered and she had to leave for ethical reasons, my wife was an lcsw (mental health therapist) in an inner-city Indianapolis school for ten years. That particular high school has the largest Hispanic population in the city, mixed with low-income Black and White students. She didn't limit her involvement at the school to just her clients; her office become a hanging place for students after school, and many non-clients eventually ended up at our home 55 miles away in the country for paintball, dirt bikes and horseback riding. One thing we learned about many of the Latinos was that frequently Spanish was the language used in the home, but English was used most other places, so many of the kids became proficient in either unless an outsider cared enough to get involved in tutoring or encouragement. Living split between cultures seemed to be overwhelming for most. Just too many expectations. How are parents, especially those who have to work 12 or more hours a day to survive, expected to give help and support to their kids in learning English when the either don't speak it or have limited skills themselves? Of all their parents I met, and I came to know most of them, all of them were loving and attentive to their kids. Their inability to help with English would be better compared to an average high school educated American trying to help their kid with calculus. They might like to do it, but lack the knowledge good so.

On a personal note, I'm sure glad that we weren't expected to afford quinceañeras. We're far from poor, but a couple of those might have made us poor. Yes, my wife ended up a Godmother to several little sisters.

 

[Zeke]

:sigh:

My home state continues to lose its mind. :nono:

Undocumented immigrants crowd California DMV offices for new licenses

Thousands of immigrants in the country illegally on Friday took a big step into California life -- and its clogged freeway commutes -- by completing an American rite of passage: waiting in line at the DMV.

The first business day of 2015 was also the first time in more than two decades that they could sign up for a driver's license in this state. California is now the 10th state, and by far the largest, to permit immigrants living in the country illegally to drive.

Whats even worse for the fraudulent system is that many are cutting up all their Babylonian ID for Ill and Legal registered dead men, and traveling like reborn free spirits above the debt scheme constructed for paper controlled slaves and sinners, the immigrants will now become slaves and Ill-Legally from being host for the systems parasites sucking on the body of those using a legal name.

And given time they will complain about more immigrants coming to join the dead men with paper spirits who have lost their humanity before they were born. Wake up and lose the name or keep going deeper into false, and temporal security slavery.

 

[resodko]

:idunno:

 

[Christian Liberty]

Incompetent drivers on the road is a public safety issue. If there were no danger to anyone else from an incompetent driver, I'd be with you.

As far as immigration goes, there should at least be a system in place to document who is entering and living in the country and do background checks on them (no prevent those with criminal backgrounds or those with criminal or terrorist associations from entering and living here). I do believe that immigration quotas should be lifted and eventually eliminated, but those living here should at least be documented.

I don't think people should have to have permission from the government to drive the roads. That doesn't mean dangerous driving should be tolerated, only that people should be left alone until they actually do something wrong, rather than being presumed incompetent until proven otherwise. I think the Golden Rule demands such.

I also don't think the government has the right to be aware of everyone who is in the country. The State is not God. As a nation we trust it far too much, when it really has no right to even know or control these things.

 

[Traditio]

One issue is that the many of the immigrants have very poor reading skills due to lack of education. One of my friends at church is a teacher and we have had long discussions on the plight of immigrant and low income children and their struggles in school.

No...kidding? This isn't at all relevent to another thread you posted in, is it?

 

[resodko]

I don't think

yes, that does appear to be one of your problems

people should have to have permission from the government to drive the roads. That doesn't mean dangerous driving should be tolerated, only that people should be left alone until they actually do something wrong, rather than being presumed incompetent until proven otherwise.

so in your world, we can put every breathing, sentient human in front of a steering wheel and see if they run into a tree and then take away their permission to drive?

 

[Christian Liberty]

yes, that does appear to be one of your problems



so in your world, we can put every breathing, sentient human in front of a steering wheel and see if they run into a tree and then take away their permission to drive?

No I believe it should be up to the parents. But liberals like you cannot imagine any ordered solution but the state, because you are idolaters.

 

[resodko]

No I believe it should be up to the parents. But liberals like you cannot imagine any ordered solution but the state, because you are idolaters.

my 97 year old neighbor's parents have been dead for quite a while

and my other neighbor is seven years old, wants to drive and her father is in jail and her mother is a crack addict who doesn't care


now what?

 

[rexlunae]

...liberals like you...

:rotfl:

 

[Angel4Truth]

According to the article many were not driving out of fear of being pulled over. I wonder what percentage of illegal immigrants drive without a license?

I am a child of legal immigrants so this immigration issue is very personal to me especially since the vast majority of the illegal immigrants are from Mexico (my ancestral homeland). However I disapprove of illegal immigration for the following reasons:

1) The continued influx of illegal immigrants will eventually cause a growing resentment severe backlash from native born Americans. This will lead to more and more "hate" crimes. At some point in time someone will come to political power and use the illegal immigrants as a scapegoats for people's problems. Shoot, my father believes that one day all the illegal immigrants will be rounded up forcibly and deported and if that happens it will be an ugly scene.

There is currently a case in Philadelphia where a Honduran woman has moved into a church so avoid being deported. She was given a deportation order 10 years ago. Since then she has married and had two children.

Facing Deportation, Undocumented Immigrant Takes Sanctuary in Philly Church

Reading the comment section you can see the obvious frustration and anger from many people over cases like this. It doesn't help that this woman after being in the US for 10 years still doesn't speak any English. The woman keeps saying that she doesn't want to be separated from her family by being sent back to Honuras. One person commented why doesn't the entire family move to Honduras? Cases like this will only fuel this frustration and anger among native born Americans.

This woman and her family have made a youtube video to appeal to Obama directly.

.

2) Illegal immigrants have few if any worker rights. Businesses that hire them can underpay them and fire them almost at will. Illegal immigrants have little legal recourse if they are abused or exploited. Legal immigrants would have full worker rights and legal recourse against abuse and exploitation.

3) Illegal immigration floods the job market and undercuts salaries. Labor activist Cesar Chavez (strong pro union and leftist to the core) was against illegal immigration as he knew it would undercut his union's fight for increased pay and benefit from the deep pocketed politically connected farmers.

My father moved to the US in 1961 under the Bracero Program. This program was an agreement between the US and Mexican governments to allow Mexican laborers to enter the US legally and work the farms. This program was active from 1946-64. Every Mexican worker was given documentation allowing them to enter the US. Why a similar program hasn't been considered today is a mystery.

Excellent post. I often wonder why liberals are so against legal immigration.