Experts question coronavirus panic

[Gary K]

Here's an interesting couple of articles that question the reality of the issues surrounding all the panic and government over reactions to the coronavirus. The entire articles I am linking to are made up of the commentary of 22 experts in the medical field. So, I'm just going to give the links as there is no summary outside the quotes from the experts themselves. I originally found links to the articles on zerohedge but am just going straight to the original links.

https://off-guardian.org/2020/03/24/...FU1MuqEi8J9Cer

https://off-guardian.org/2020/03/28/...navirus-panic/

 

[Gary K]

As an aside, both my wife and I got sick and had most of the reported symptoms of the coronavirus in early January. There was no possibility of testing here as when you called the local hospital they just refused to test and said there was no coronavirus in our area. What we had went through our community like a flood. It seemed like everyone was sick, and many people stayed sick for a month or so. And some people would get over it only to come down with the same thing again. As a result I agree with these experts. The coronavirus has been in the wild for far longer than we have been told by official sources.

As to the strength of the bug we got it was about a bad a case of the flu I've ever had. My wife missed 3 weeks of work with it. I got over it much faster but I fought it off with my usual treatment for the flu in a week. I took massive doses of echinacea, goldenseal, garlic, vitamin D3, and zinc. I was well on the way to being completely over it in a week, but that isn't unusual for me as I have a history of recovering rapidly from the flu. But then I take a lot of supplements when I get sick.

Back in the early 90s there was a flu going around that most people who got it missed 1 to 2 weeks of work. I felt it coming on on a Friday so I went and bought a bottle of echinacea. I took that entire bottle of echinacea that weekend. I went to work Monday morning with no symptoms.

 

[jgarden]

Experts question coronavirus panic

The author must have sought out every "lunatic fringe" scientist in the world and the source, "ZeroHedge," is a ultra-right, libertarian site that is owned and operated by a Bulgarian who has been banned for insider trading by the securities commission!

All one need do is to compare the Italian COVID-19 death rate of approximately 11% with the 0.8% in Germany to realize that early testing and taking aggressive measures are crucial in limiting the spread and preventing the nation's healthcare system from being overwhelmed!

 

[Gary K]

Experts question coronavirus panic

The author must have sought out every "lunatic fringe" scientist in the world and the source, "ZeroHedge," is a ultra-right, libertarian site that is owned and operated by a Bulgarian who has been banned for insider trading by the securities commission!

All one need do is to compare the Italian COVID-19 death rate of approximately 11 with the 0.8% in Germany to realize that early testing and taking aggressive measures are crucial in limiting the spread and preventing the nation's healthcare system from being overwhelmed!

Just the kind of response I expected from you. Didn't even read the articles. If you had you would understand that many of these experts work in highly respected institutions and are well-known in their fields. The way I see it you're so brainwashed that anything that refutes the media's narrative must be false. They have been proven to have lied to you again and again on multiple subjects but you go around lapping up every word they say as absolute truth. You are such a lapdog that you won't even pretend to read and/or investigate what they say.

Zerohedge has time and time again scooped the mockingbird media and been shown to be one of best investigative sites around. That they are in the crosshairs of the entire deep state and the mockingbird media is to be expected. Those entities hate the truth being exposed and their own narratives being contradicted.

Zerohedge was the first site to report that the coronavirus is a bioweapon. Now that's well-accepted fact. They also report the truth on the economy on a regular basis. Anyone who actually understands economics knows this. Those of you who swallow the main stream media's pushing of Keynesian economics have no clue as to the world's actual economic condition.

Your prejudice so blinds you that truth seems to you like fairy tales. I actually feel sorry for you as you're so steeped in ignorance and deceptions.

 

[jgarden]

MEDIA BIAS/FACT CHECK

Overall, we rate Zero Hedge an extreme right biased conspiracy website based on the promotion of false/misleading/debunked information that routinely denigrates the left.

In a quote from the above New Yorker article they summarize the political stance of the blog, which Lokey told Bloomberg is:
“Russia=good.
Obama=idiot.
Bashar al-Assad=benevolent leader.
John Kerry= dunce.
Vladimir Putin=greatest leader in the history of statecraft.”

A factual search reveals a terrible track record with IFCN fact checkers. Below is just a small sample of the numerous failed fact checks by Zero Hedge.

• Says China “stole Coronavirus from Canada and weaponized it into a Bioweapon.” – False
• Is a Craigslist ad proof that counterprotesters at a white nationalist rally were “paid to make chaos”? – False
• It’s now against the law in California to shower and do laundry on the same day. – Mostly False
• A “newly uncovered” photograph reveals Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez was crying over an empty parking lot, not detained migrant children, at a protest in Texas. – False
• “The Ukrainian government just indicted the Burisma gas company & named Hunter Biden for accepting millions of dollars from a slush fund.” – False

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/zero-hedge/#prettyPhoto

************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** **********************************

It would appear that I'm in good company when I assert that "ZeroHedge" is a less than reputable source!

 

[chair]

Here's an interesting couple of articles that question the reality of the issues surrounding all the panic and government over reactions to the coronavirus. The entire articles I am linking to are made up of the commentary of 22 experts in the medical field. So, I'm just going to give the links as there is no summary outside the quotes from the experts themselves. I originally found links to the articles on zerohedge but am just going straight to the original links.

https://off-guardian.org/2020/03/24/...FU1MuqEi8J9Cer

https://off-guardian.org/2020/03/28/...navirus-panic/

These theories sound oh-so-reasonable. But then you think "Italy" or "Spain" or "New York"- and it all falls apart.

 

[User Name]

These theories sound oh-so-reasonable. But then you think "Italy" or "Spain" or "New York"- and it all falls apart.

Ah, but have you gone to Italy, Spain, or New York, and investigated the impact of coronavirus yourself? (Hint: It's all a conspiracy!)

Come to think of it, I've never been to Italy myself, so I doubt that it really exists. It's just another conspiracy.

 

[ok doser]

These theories sound oh-so-reasonable. But then you think "Italy" or "Spain" or "New York"- and it all falls apart.

I'm going to keep my 93 year old parents locked up in the long term care facility - Dad has only two risk factors (his age and his location, ironically), but Mom has 5

 

[chair]

Ah, but have you gone to Italy, Spain, or New York, and investigated the impact of coronavirus yourself? (Hint: It's all a conspiracy!)

Come to think of it, I've never been to Italy myself, so I doubt that it really exists. It's just another conspiracy.

Well, I've been to Northern Italy a number of times, and it certainly exists (unless of course I am being paid by Evil Aliens to say that).
I wonder how the statistics of the Spanish Flu worked out. It was just another Flu, after all.

 

[Gary K]

MEDIA BIAS/FACT CHECK

Overall, we rate Zero Hedge an extreme right biased conspiracy website based on the promotion of false/misleading/debunked information that routinely denigrates the left.

In a quote from the above New Yorker article they summarize the political stance of the blog, which Lokey told Bloomberg is:
“Russia=good.
Obama=idiot.
Bashar al-Assad=benevolent leader.
John Kerry= dunce.
Vladimir Putin=greatest leader in the history of statecraft.”

A factual search reveals a terrible track record with IFCN fact checkers. Below is just a small sample of the numerous failed fact checks by Zero Hedge.

• Says China “stole Coronavirus from Canada and weaponized it into a Bioweapon.” – False
• Is a Craigslist ad proof that counterprotesters at a white nationalist rally were “paid to make chaos”? – False
• It’s now against the law in California to shower and do laundry on the same day. – Mostly False
• A “newly uncovered” photograph reveals Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez was crying over an empty parking lot, not detained migrant children, at a protest in Texas. – False
• “The Ukrainian government just indicted the Burisma gas company & named Hunter Biden for accepting millions of dollars from a slush fund.” – False

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/zero-hedge/#prettyPhoto

************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** **********************************

It would appear that I'm in good company when I assert that "ZeroHedge" is a less than reputable source!

You're an idiot. The I posted links don't even go to Zerohedge. And, snopes, factcheck.org, and politifact are a bunch of scam artists who push a specific agenda.

 

[Gary K]

Now here is the report coming from the University of Oxford. Wow. What an oddball, unknown source which is a group of uneducated idiots. Right? Right?

Dr. Sunetra Gupta et al. are an Oxford-based research team constructing an epidemiological model for the coronavirus outbreak, their paper has yet to be peer-reviewed, but the abstract is available online.

Dr Gupta is a Professor of Theoretical Epidemiology at the University of Oxford with an interest in infectious disease agents that are responsible for malaria, HIV, influenza and bacterial meningitis. She is a recipient of the Sahitya Akademi Award, the Scientific Medal by the Zoological Society of London and the Royal Society Rosalind Franklin Award for her scientific research.

What they say:
Importantly, the results we present here suggest the ongoing epidemics in the UK and Italy started at least a month before the first reported death and have already led to the accumulation of significant levels of herd immunity in both countries. There is an inverse relationship between the proportion currently immune and the fraction of the population vulnerable to severe disease.
– Fundamental principles of epidemic spread highlight the immediate need for large-scale serological surveys to assess the stage of the SARS-CoV-2 epidemic, 24th March 2020

– – –​

The research presents a very different view of the epidemic to the modelling at Imperial College London […] “I’m surprised that there has been such unqualified acceptance of the Imperial model”, Dr Gupta said.
[…]
The Oxford results would mean the country had already acquired substantial herd immunity through the unrecognised spread of covid19 over more than two months.
Although some experts have shed doubt on the strength and length of the human immune response to the virus, Prof Gupta said the emerging evidence made her confident that humanity would build up herd immunity against Covid19
– “Coronavirus may have infected halt the population”, Financial Times, 24th March 2020

Wow. What an bunch of idiots these guys are. Right? Oxford is just such a well-known group of wild-eyed fools and idiots? Right? Right?

 

[Gary K]

Dr Karin Mölling is a German virologist whose research focused on retroviruses, particularly human immunodeficiency virus (HIV). She was a full professor and director of the Institute of Medical Virology at the University of Zurich from 1993 until her retirement in 2008 and received multiple honours and awards for her work.

What she says:
You are now told every morning how many SARS-Corona 2 deaths there are. But they don’t tell you how many people already are infected with influenza this winter and how many deaths it has caused.
This winter, the flu is not severe, but around 80,000 are infected. You don’t get these numbers at all. Something similar occurred two years ago. This is not put into the right context.
[…]
Every week a person dies in Berlin from multi-resistant germs. That adds up to 35,000 a year in Germany. This is not mentioned at all. I believe that we have had situations like this several times and that the measures are now being taken too far.
I am of the opinion that maybe one should not do so much against young people having parties together and infecting each other. We have to build immunity somehow. How can that be possible without contacts? The younger ones handle the infection much better. But we have to protect the elderly, and protect them in a way that can be scrutinized; is it reasonable what we are doing now, to stretch out the epidemic in a way that almost paralyzes the entire world economy?
[…]
The Robert Koch Institute provides the figures. Then you sit there as a listener or spectator: 20 dead again, how terrible! Do you know when I would start to panic? If there are 20,000. Then we get close to what went on completely quietly two years ago.
The 2018 influenza epidemic, with 25,000 deaths, never disconcerted the press. The clinics had to deal with an additional 60,000 patients, which was no problem in the clinics either!
[…]
That is the main fear: the disease is presented as a terrible disease. The disease per se is like the flu in a normal winter. It is even weaker in the first week.
– Interview on Anti-Empire.com, 23rd March 2020

Do you economically retarded posters realize what is happening to the US economy? The best experts are saying a 34% decline in the US GDP in just a single month. Do you understand what that means? It means there is going to be one third fewer products and services are going to happen. In other words food is going to be very scarce. And what there is a whole lot of people are not going to have the money to buy it. It means starvation and homelessness like we have never seen. We have already passed the collapse of the economy in 1929. Think about that and take a look at the food lines and people suffering from malnutrition and starvation back then.

And you bunch of ignorant clowns condemn Trump for desiring to put people back to work to limit the effects of a complete economic meltdown that is going to destroy millions upon millions of people's lives.

 

[User Name]

The Oxford results would mean the country had already acquired substantial herd immunity through the unrecognised spread of covid19 over more than two months.
Although some experts have shed doubt on the strength and length of the human immune response to the virus, Prof Gupta said the emerging evidence made her confident that humanity would build up herd immunity against Covid19
– “Coronavirus may have infected halt the population”, Financial Times, 24th March 2020

This might be correct but we won't know until new case numbers and deaths drop. They're still spiking up currently.

 

[Gary K]

This might be correct but we won't know until new case numbers and deaths drop. They're still spiking up currently.

Yeah, we don't absolutely know. But that's the point. The government's are acting on wild guesses and curtailing liberties and the ability to earn a living based upon nothing but guesswork, and ignoring the new research. Plus, look at the response here. Because it was a contrarian point of view I was accused of being a conspiracy nut. People are being indoctrinated at an incredible level and speed. The entire world needs to slow down and think and then react. The press, and the governments around the world, want us to go even further into panic. Ask yourself why they would have such an agenda. Think about what that means for the individual.

 

[chair]

Yeah, we don't absolutely know. But that's the point. The government's are acting on wild guesses and curtailing liberties and the ability to earn a living based upon nothing but guesswork, and ignoring the new research. Plus, look at the response here. Because it was a contrarian point of view I was accused of being a conspiracy nut. People are being indoctrinated at an incredible level and speed. The entire world needs to slow down and think and then react. The press, and the governments around the world, want us to go even further into panic. Ask yourself why they would have such an agenda. Think about what that means for the individual.

There are definitely economic costs to lock-down. Temporary, but real. There are death and economic costs to not locking down. It is not possible to both protect the economy and lives perfectly- choices have to be made.

Most countries have chosen to go in the lock-down, social-distancing way. Even ones that thought differently at first, like GB, have changed their minds. Why? Because the cost in human life the other way is high, and there is a huge economic cost to "business as usual" as well. The faster and harder you lock down, the faster this will be under control, and life can go back to normal. As it is in China and Korea. Or you can just do "business as usual", like in Spain, and see how well that works for your country.

 

[ok doser]

There are definitely economic costs to lock-down. Temporary, but real. There are death and economic costs to not locking down. It is not possible to both protect the economy and lives perfectly- choices have to be made.

Most countries have chosen to go in the lock-down, social-distancing way. Even ones that thought differently at first, like GB, have changed their minds. Why? Because the cost in human life the other way is high, and there is a huge economic cost to "business as usual" as well. The faster and harder you lock down, the faster this will be under control, and life can go back to normal. As it is in China and Korea. Or you can just do "business as usual", like in Spain, and see how well that works for your country.

what the heck is going on in India? Second largest country in the world and they have fewer cases than Luxembourg.

Are they immune to this?

 

[User Name]

Yeah, we don't absolutely know. But that's the point. The government's are acting on wild guesses and curtailing liberties and the ability to earn a living based upon nothing but guesswork, and ignoring the new research..

Trump is not acting on guesswork, he is acting on the numbers of sick and dying. The information you posted does not contradict that. What it does suggest is that this pandemic may end in months rather than a year or more.

 

[chair]

what the heck is going on in India? Second largest country in the world and they have fewer cases than Luxembourg.

Are they immune to this?

What's going on is:
1. The more developed a country is, the more international traffic they have, and the faster the virus reaches them. The less developed country will get exposed later and slower.
2. The more undeveloped a country is, the harder time they'll have testing people, so they won't know what's going on. We in the developed world hardly know what is really happening.
3. The poorer a country is, the harder it is to lock-down and prevent the spread of the disease. People have to work every day just to survive.

My expectation is that places like India and most of Africa are going to get hit late- and hard. I don't even want to think about Venezuela. I hope I am wrong about this.

 

[User Name]

My expectation is that places like India and most of Africa are going to get hit late- and hard. I don't even want to think about Venezuela. I hope I am wrong about this.

Also, India is on a police enforced lock-down, scheduled to last 3 weeks at this point.

Mexico seems largely unfazed for the time being. No idea about Venezuela.

 

[Gary K]

Trump is not acting on guesswork, he is acting on the numbers of sick and dying. The information you posted does not contradict that. What it does suggest is that this pandemic may end in months rather than a year or more.

Trump announced a reopening of the economy around Easter so people could get back to earning. What was the media's and Democrat's response to that? Extreme criticism. And upon what basis? A real basis such as the links to the research I posted, or manufactured hype by the media, as usual? They keep on pushing the fear button as hard and fast as they can.

There is a lot of info out there that if a person listens/reads only the mockingbird media they will never hear or read about it. And that information tells stories that never, and I mean, never, make it into the mockingbird media other than claims that it is all lies. They have an established narrative and agenda and everything else gets suppressed so that people do not see a balanced point of view. And the politicians are making full use of that ignorance of the public to take away liberty and the right for the common man to pay his bills. I wonder how many people are going to lose their homes and transportation before this is all over, let alone be able to feed themselves.

Here's an interesting link. Think about the implications of what you learn here. https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/it...ing-clients-wyoming-sour-price-turns-negative

Here's more really interesting news. Ford just shut down all their production facilities, indefinitely. https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/ford-delaying-north-american-production-indefinitely