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Has Jesus returned with His kingdom? NO... He has not.
Believe your Bible.
Luke 19:12 (AKJV/PCE)
(19:12) He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
ECT Moment of Salvation Compared to Water Baptism
- Thread starter turbosixx
- Start date
Believe your Bible.
turbosixx
New member
Like I said poor description. From my viewpoint, to say there is more than one gospel or more than one church is to divert to something different when they are actually the same.
To say that the church that Paul persecuted and the church that he calls the body are different is wrong. I still don't understand why mad says their different. All I get is, "there is more than one church". That doesn't explain anything but diverts.
turbosixx
New member
I believe my bible. In that parable what happens when he returns? Does he set up his kingdom? No, he judges. That's the way I understand it. We are in his kingdom now and when he comes again it's game over.
Col. 1:13 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
You do believe Jesus saying the kingdom is a hand is a false statement. 2,000 years is not at hand.
turbosixx
New member
I don't believe they did disobey Jesus. You have put something together here that isn't true. If it is true, then all you have to do is point to a passage where the 12 taught the people to observe the old law as instructed.
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Right Divider
Body part
So you're just going to keep riding the lie. Some Christian principles there turbosixx.
When will you retract this false statement?
I guess that you've never considered that you viewpoint is incorrect.
Wrong as usual. God can do things any way that He wants... and He decided to have a kingdom on the earth and a kingdom in heaven.
He will bring them together in HIS time and not yours.
Eph 1:10 (AKJV/PCE)
(1:10) That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; [even] in him:
We are NOT in the dispensation of the fullness of times yet.
Right Divider
Body part
The KING judges when He RETURNS with His KINGDOM.
So now you think that there was a time when there was no heavenly kingdom. THAT is the kingdom that the body of Christ occupies.
It was at hand, God was not lying. But God has OTHER plans that you reject.
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Right Divider
Body part
So before all of TOL you are going to CONTINUE to make another FALSE claim that Matthew 23 was NOT one of the ALL THINGS that Jesus had taught them?
Your dishonesty to support your fairy tale is disgusting. Churchianity makes liars!
God's Truth
New member
Show from the scriptures in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John where Jesus gives instructions on when and how to do circumcision, special days, animal sacrifices, etc.
Animal sacrifices were a part of the old purification works. Jesus is the Lamb of God. So now what? You think Jesus died once and for all but keep obeying the old purification works to be right with God?
Right Divider
Body part
Remain clueless if you like, it suits you well.
- In Matthew 23, Jesus told them to keep the law of Moses
- In Matthew 28, Jesus told them to teach all nations TO OBSERVE ALL THING WHATSOEVER I HAVE COMMANDED YOU.
- 1+1=2
So why didn't the Apostles teach the law of Moses? There's no New Testament record of them doing so, nor any other evidence. What's your explanation?
Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Micah 4:2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
Acts 1:12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
Leviticus 23:15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: 23:16 Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD.
Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Leviticus 23:17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals: they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD. 23:18 And ye shall offer with the bread seven lambs without blemish of the first year, and one young bullock, and two rams: they shall be for a burnt offering unto the LORD, with their meat offering, and their drink offerings, even an offering made by fire, of sweet savour unto the LORD.
And that is just one sample of the obvious...
Acts 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
Another example, out of others that can also be cited is...
Acts 9:10 And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.
Acts 22:12 And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
Why was it that the Believing Remnant had been REMINDED of their continued responsibility to the Law?
Exodus 19:3 And Moses went up unto God, and the LORD called unto him out of the mountain, saying, Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel; 19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself. 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.
Deuteronomy 4:5 Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. 4:6 Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. 4:7 For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?
Why? Because the Law is their "wisdom and...understanding in the sight of the nations..."
Romans 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, 2:18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law; 2:19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, 2:20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
Romans 9:4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises; 9:5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Which was why He commissioned the Twelve to begin "at Jerusalem" Luke 24:47.
Because after this...
Matthew 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved. 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
This was to have followed...
Isaiah 2:1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem. 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 2:5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.
But for this temporary interruption...
Romans 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5, in memory of Rom. 5:6-8.
Matthew 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Micah 4:2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
Acts 1:12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
Leviticus 23:15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: 23:16 Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD.
Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Leviticus 23:17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals: they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD. 23:18 And ye shall offer with the bread seven lambs without blemish of the first year, and one young bullock, and two rams: they shall be for a burnt offering unto the LORD, with their meat offering, and their drink offerings, even an offering made by fire, of sweet savour unto the LORD.
And that is just one sample of the obvious...
Acts 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
Another example, out of others that can also be cited is...
Acts 9:10 And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.
Acts 22:12 And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
Why was it that the Believing Remnant had been REMINDED of their continued responsibility to the Law?
Exodus 19:3 And Moses went up unto God, and the LORD called unto him out of the mountain, saying, Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel; 19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself. 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.
Deuteronomy 4:5 Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. 4:6 Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. 4:7 For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?
Why? Because the Law is their "wisdom and...understanding in the sight of the nations..."
Romans 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, 2:18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law; 2:19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, 2:20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
Romans 9:4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises; 9:5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Which was why He commissioned the Twelve to begin "at Jerusalem" Luke 24:47.
Because after this...
Matthew 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved. 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
This was to have followed...
Isaiah 2:1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem. 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 2:5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.
But for this temporary interruption...
Romans 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5, in memory of Rom. 5:6-8.
Right Divider
Body part
- I'm just believing what scripture says.
- Why does there need to be a record of them observing the law?
- James says that thousands of Jews were still "zealous of the law" in Acts 21:20 as a good thing.
- The law of Moses contains a lot more than sacrifices for sin.
- Israel's new covenant says that they will have the law written in their hearts.
God's Truth
New member
I already explained that to you. Are you going to pretend I did not? Deal with what I said.
Jesus did not teach the law, he even fulfilled it and changed it.
Jesus told them to do what those in Moses' seat say because the temple was still standing.
God's Truth
New member
Hahahaha Do you think the Pharisees listened to the apostles and said let's do what they say, no more stoning people to death for adultery, no more saying this food and that food is unclean, no more circumcision, and Jesus is the last lamb to be sacrificed?
So you are basing what the LORD GOD THE CREATOR came to earth to do as postponed and to only the Jews because of what disobedient Jews did?!!!
HOW CAN YOU SAY Jesus taught the old law when HE CHANGED IT AND FULFILLED IT?
God's Truth
New member
Jews and Gentiles have the new law written on their hearts and minds. That is what happens when one is saved and gets the Holy Spirit.
How else do you think Paul says the saved uphold the law?
How else do you think Paul says the saved uphold the law?
God's Truth
New member
I don't always give scripture references unless someone asks because it is trouble for me and people don't believe anyway.
What reference would you like?
God's Truth
New member
When the saved receive the Holy Spirit, they have the new law written on their hearts and minds. That is the covenant that God said He would make with everyone who comes to Him through Jesus.
Romans 3:31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.
Romans 2:20 an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of infants, because you have in the Law the embodiment of knowledge and truth—
John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.
Romans 8:4 so that the righteous standard of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Romans 2:15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.)
Jeremiah 31:30 "This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
Romans 11:26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come from Zion, He will remove godlessness from Jacob. 27 And this is My covenant with them when I take away their sins.”
2 Corinthians 3:3 It is clear that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.