BT's PotD 1-30-04

Originally posted by SteveT

Gentlemen:

The best definition I have yet seen of the doctrine of the Trinity is that it consists of the simultaneous affirmation of 7 statements as true:

1. The Father is God
2. The Holy Spirit is God
3. Jesus is God
4. The Father is not Jesus
5. The Holy Spirit is not Jesus
6. The Father is not the Holy Spirit
7. There is only one God.

John 17:3 clearly affirms both statements #1 and #4. It also appears to deny statement #3. Were it the only passage relevant to the question, it would certainly be decisive against the Trinity. But of course it is not. There are numerous other passages, as well as the Patristic testimony of men who knew and learned their Christian theology from the Apostle John himself, supporting the truth of #3. Further, the entire context within which 17:3 is found emphasizes the eternal unity of Father and Son in glory and "name"

"I am the LORD, that is My name; I will not give My glory to another" Is 42:8

"For how can My name be profaned? And My glory I will not give to another." Is 48:11

"and now, Father, glorify thou me in thy own presence with the glory which I had with thee before the world was made." John 17:5

"Holy Father, keep them in thy name, which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are one." John 17:11

Are there any mere men who ever made statements remotely similar to these in the entire bible? Can anyone with even a passing familiarity with the OT imagine some mere man saying such things in Israel and not being stoned for blasphemy?

17:3, when isolated and taken out of context, seems to deny statement #3. But the passage as a whole from which it is taken, when considered in the light of the OT, fairly screams the deity of Christ.

Hmmm, maybe Athenasius, Jerome, Augustine, Aquinas, Luther, Calvin, Wesley, etc.,etc., weren't so stupid after all??? Maybe they just knew their OT too

Click to expand...