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Thread: A Saviour unto Israel

  1. #91
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    Are made to be realized in the Church !
    Now even though they are ignored or twisted, there are many scriptures in the NT where OT Prophecies regarding Israel's restoration or regathering are made to be realized in the Church.

    The Church has not replaced Israel, but is the Clarification of who Israel [of God] has always been, never a Physical People, however comprised of spiritually reborn physical people.

    The Israel of God which was comprised in the OT with ethnic jews who had been circumcised in their hearts [born again] is now in the NT comprised of both circumcised in heart jews and gentiles [Phil 3:3 & Rom 2:29] or as another way Paul puts it the Olive Tree , which stands for the True Israel of God, which is now comprised of born again Natural Jews [branches] and Unnatural Branches Gentiles, but in any case believing Branches..

    With that in Mind we can begin to understand why prophecies and promises in the OT directed to Israel are fulfilled and applied to the Church..

    We will look at a couple of Illustrations for evidence of the same.

    In Acts 15:14-18 James interprets the prophecy of Amos 9:11-12, which is the rebuilding of Davids Tabernacle as finding its fulfillment in the calling out of the Gentiles a people for His names sake in a expanding formation of the Church, Christ is building His Church as the Son of David..

    This is another way of saying gentiles being grafted into the Olive Tree of Rom 11:17
    Last edited by beloved57; August 5th, 2012 at 07:45 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    The Preeminence of the Church !

    1 Cor 3:21-23


    21Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are your's;

    22Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are your's;

    23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.

    All things are yours Paul writes to the Church, so if by chance dispensationalism was true [which it is not] then the Church would reign over the ethnic jews, for the Church has a much higher position of Authority than the ethnic jews would, and the earthly millennium jews would belong to the Church, because of Her Union with Christ..

    Notice Paul says to the Church as to what is Hers, things to come so if there is a future earthly millennium, it belongs to the Church...
    Last edited by beloved57; August 5th, 2012 at 06:59 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Are made to be realized in the Church ! cont
    Another OT Prophecy about Israel finds its application to the Church by the inspired Apostle :

    In Romans 9:25-26:


    25As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

    26And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

    The Apostle is quoting scripture from Hosea 1:10

    10Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.

    Hos 2:23

    23And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

    These were actually being addressed to the Ten Apostate Northern tribes of Israel before the Assyrian captivity in 722 bc, for the rebellious manner of God's people [not my people / not beloved] and predicting her future restoration [my people/beloved/ sons of the Living God].

    And Paul under the direction of the Holy Ghost applies these to the calling or salvation of the elect gentiles, the church. Paul here without hesitation takes the two prophecies of Hosea regarding the future salvation of Israel and applies them to the Church, which consists of both the called jews and gentiles [rom 9:24], they both become the People of God Covenant Israel.

    Again the grafting in of the gentiles into the Olive Tree is being demonstrated, or the making of one new Man of Eph 2:12-19

    12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

    13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

    14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

    15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

    16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

    17And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

    18For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

    19Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

    Now, who were the Saints and Household of God in the OT under the Old Covenant People ? Was it not Israel ?
    Last edited by beloved57; August 5th, 2012 at 07:45 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Are made to be realized in the Church ! cont

    So Paul has shown how the prophecies of Hosea are fulfilled in the Church, the one Christ is building Matt 16:18. Many will scream that this is spiritualized hermeneutics, well if it is, so be it, for paul did it, an authorized messenger of Christ..

    Thats exactly what the NT does to the OT predictions, with this, the OT promises to Israel [The People not the Nation ] their restoration to God is being fulfilled in the salvation or conversion of believers in Christ, both of jews and gentiles in the church age, the Church Eph 2. The calling out of the gentiles from every tribe, tongue, people and nation is the prophesied restoration of Israel, the inclusion of Abraham's Gentile seed from among the Nations as per Gen 17:5, and hence the church is the continuation and perfection of Israels believing remnant Heb 11:40

    God having provided some better thing for us, that they[OT Saints] without us[NT Saints] should not be made perfect.
    Last edited by beloved57; August 5th, 2012 at 09:09 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    TOL Legend beloved57's Avatar
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    Are made to be realized in the Church ! cont

    John in Rev 2:17 which reads:


    17He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

    Is promising to the church which are overcomer's a new name. This is a clear reference to the prediction or prophecy in Isa 62:2

    2And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the LORD shall name.

    Also vs Isa 65:15

    15And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord GOD shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name:

    Israels future royal status and restoration to God, are being here applied to the Church, individual members of it..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 5th, 2012 at 10:15 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

  6. #96
    TOL Legend beloved57's Avatar
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    All jews are not Jews cp Rom 9:6

    Rev 3:9

    9Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

    Now this verse is enlightening, if we have eyes to see, Jesus assures the church in Philadelphia what He will make these pretended jews do, and it does not consult their so called freewill !

    There are two good points here being made, Jesus says about those "who say they are jews, but lie [also see Rev 2:9] It would appear that in one sense these people are jews, the physical descendants of the Patriarchs, who met in the synagouges to worship, remember Jesus addressed a similar crowd during His ministry Jn 8:37, but in another sense, inwardly and spiritually they are not jews, not believers in The True Messiah, and perhaps persecutors of those who do believe in Him as per 1 Thess 2:13-15.

    These Jews are said instead to be the synagogue of satan. True Jews belong to Christ, the seed of Abraham [see Gal 3:29] for you see paul writes:

    Rom 2:28-29


    28For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

    29But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    The word jew here is the greek word Ioudaios and its used in this sense:

    the word is used of ideal Jews, i.e., Jews in spiritual reality, believers, whether Jews or Gentiles by natural birth.

    This Judaism is of the heart, and it cannot be limited to believing jews but does graft in believing gentiles, this clear from Paul's statement to the Philippians Phil 3:3


    3For we [believers] are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

    Worshiping God in Spirit and rejoicing in Christ Jesus is not limited to ethnic jews.. So John in writing Rev 3:9 is giving us to understand that Jesus distinguishes between literal jews, and spiritual jews or Spiritual Israel, the Spiritual seed of Abraham. Thats why paul also writes Rom 9:6

    6Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
    Last edited by beloved57; August 6th, 2012 at 07:23 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Continuing from previous post as we look at how some OT predictions regarding God's Covenant People Israel, are Being applied to the NT Church, proving the Church existed in the OT, and that Israel, the True one, is the Church, just having been expanded to include some gentiles.

    We see how Rev 3:9 has its roots in OT prophecy , Isa 60:14

    14The sons also of them that afflicted thee shall come bending unto thee; and all they that despised thee shall bow themselves down at the soles of thy feet; and they shall call thee; The city of the LORD, The Zion of the Holy One of Israel.

    Isa 45:14

    14Thus saith the LORD, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, saying, Surely God is in thee; and there is none else, there is no God.

    Isa 49:23

    23And kings shall be thy nursing fathers, and their queens thy nursing mothers: they shall bow down to thee with their face toward the earth, and lick up the dust of thy feet; and thou shalt know that I am the LORD: for they shall not be ashamed that wait for me.

    Now in all these scriptures, its the gentiles who are to bow before Israel, whereas in Rev 3:9 its jews who will bow before the gentile Church

    Interestingly in Isa 60:14 they [the gentiles] will call them [Jews] the city of the Lord, the Zion of the Holy One of Israel ! Is not that what we see in Rev 3:12

    12Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

    And the title Jesus identifies Himself with to the Church of Philadelphia is the Holy One hence the link with Isa 60 !

    The words 'They will know that I have loved thee " can be compared to Isa 43:4

    4Since thou wast precious in my sight, thou hast been honourable, and I have loved thee: therefore will I give men for thee, and people for thy life.

    This gives us to understand, that John saw in the Church the realization and fulfillment of the Isaiah prophecies..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 6th, 2012 at 09:20 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    We are demonstrating how the promises to Israel are being applied to the Church, hence linking them as the same..

    Rev 7:15 states of the saints in The Heavenly Temple :


    15Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.

    This scripture clearly seems to be a reference to Ezk 37:26-28


    26Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

    27My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

    28And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.


    This connection appears to be true when we also look at Rev 21:3

    3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. cp with vs 27 of ezk 37

    And this is followed by Rev 21:4,6

    4And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

    6And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

    By the same OT references found Rev 7:16-17

    16They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.

    17For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

    So we have the innumerable multitude of the Church, redeemed by the Blood, as being the fulfillment of a Prophecy regarding Israel's latter day restoration, we have an application of ezk 37:27 to the redeemed Church.

    Rev 7:16 is a fulfillment of Isa 49:10

    10They shall not hunger nor thirst; neither shall the heat nor sun smite them: for he that hath mercy on them shall lead them, even by the springs of water shall he guide them.

    Also another prophetic promise to Israel's restoration is applied to the church i.e Isa 25:8

    8He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.


    Rev 7:17

    17For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

    All these are strong scriptural support for the Redeemed Church being the restored Israel..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 9th, 2012 at 09:48 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Luke 2:11 for today in the city of David there has been born for you a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.
    Bereishit - Genesis - Chapter 1

    1 In the beginning of God's creation of the heavens and the earth.
    :א בְּרֵאשִׁ֖ית בָּרָ֣א אֱלֹהִ֑ים אֵ֥ת הַשָּׁמַ֖יִם וְאֵ֥ת הָאָֽרֶץ

    In beginning He created God the heavens and the earth

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    The book of revelation is a good book to show the connection of Israel and the Church, that the promises to Israel in the OT are fulfilled by the Jew and Gentile Church ..

    In Rev 21:14


    14And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

    This is the wall of the city of the New Jerusalem, the city Abraham hoped for Heb 11:10

    10For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

    and had Twelve foundation stones, on which were written the names of the Twelve Apostles.

    And in vs 12 it speaks of the Twelve Gates :

    12And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:

    The number Twenty Four, which is the total of the Twelve Tribes and the Twelve Apostles, This number mentioned earlier in Rev 4:4


    4And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

    This could be alluding to Davids Kingdom organization of the Temple servants into 24 orders of Priest see 1 Chron 24:3-19, 24 Levitical gatekeepers 26:17-19; and 24 orders of priest 25:6-31

    The Prophesied City Temple structure in Ezk 40-48 finds it's fulfillment in the Twelve Tribe/ Twelve Apostle City Temple in Rev 21, all the redeemed Church of God..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 9th, 2012 at 11:19 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Israel's Future !

    Is there a future in God's Purpose for the People Israel ? Most certainly Yes ! What about National Israel ? Sorry No, remember Paul stated Rom 9:6

    6Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

    Has not God already fulfilled His Promise to that Nation ? Those called dispensationalist and premillenialist teach and believe [falsely] that God is yet to fulfill promises to this Nation in a coming 1000 yr Millennium Kingdom.

    Now the best way to begin to understand these things is by examining the promises made to Abraham, who is the Father of His Natural descendants of the Flesh [National Israel] and even more importantly the Father of His Spiritual Descendants, those that Believe ! Notice Rom 4:11

    And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

    This is extremely important, because what many fail to realize is that God promised Abraham a believing seed as well as a physical seed.

    Now are there promises made to Abraham that are fulfilled, and yet to be fulfilled ? As we look at the promises made to Him, we will notice two types, one which includes Abraham personally in the promise, as well as a promise that does not .

    Lets look at this one Gen 12:6-7



    6 And Abram passed through the land unto the place of Sichem, unto the plain of Moreh. And the Canaanite was then in the land.

    7 And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto thy seed will I give this land: and there builded he an altar unto the LORD, who appeared unto him.

    If noticed, this promise did not include Abram, but His seed, and it was not stipulated how long His seed would have this Land. This promise was made again Gen 15:18-21

    18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

    19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,

    20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,

    21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.

    And yet Again Abram is not included as a recipient of this land, and this is important, see also Gen 24:7

    7The LORD God of heaven, which took me from my father's house, and from the land of my kindred, and which spake unto me, and that sware unto me, saying, Unto thy seed will I give this land; he shall send his angel before thee, and thou shalt take a wife unto my son from thence.

    As before the promise to enter the land was not for Abraham personally and no definite time frame is given as to how long the land would belong to His seed. It should be noted that the promise of his seed obtaining the land was unconditionally made to Abraham at ther beginning and all He did was build an altar to worship Gen 12:7


    7And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto thy seed will I give this land: and there builded he an altar unto the LORD, who appeared unto him.
    Last edited by beloved57; August 10th, 2012 at 08:15 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

  12. #102
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    Israel's Future ! cont

    Now lets look at another covenant promise made to Abraham in the scripture, which did include Abraham personally:

    Gen 12:1-3

    1Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:

    2And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

    3And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

    Gen 13:15-17

    15For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

    16And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.

    17Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee.

    This promise was made to Abraham and His seed, and the continuance of this land grant is stated forever. This promise is spoken again Gen 17:5-8


    5Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

    6And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee.

    7And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

    8And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

    Here is the annunciation of it to the other heirs of promise Heb 11:8-9


    8By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

    9By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

    Gen 26:1-5 and Gen 28: 12-15

    Lets look at the noticeable difference, the covenant promises of the Land that excluded Abraham, these promises the scripture says have been fulfilled, but the promises of the Land that included Abraham have not been fulfilled..

    Now the land acquisition of Abraham's Physical seed, the Nation of Israel, of which no time frame was given expressly, that promise has been fulfilled to that seed of Abraham> Lets look at Josh 21:43-45

    43And the LORD gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein.

    44And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand.

    45There failed not ought of any good thing which the LORD had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass.

    Josh 23:14

    14And, behold, this day I am going the way of all the earth: and ye know in all your hearts and in all your souls, that not one thing hath failed of all the good things which the LORD your God spake concerning you; all are come to pass unto you, and not one thing hath failed thereof.

    Neh 9:7-8

    7Thou art the LORD the God, who didst choose Abram, and broughtest him forth out of Ur of the Chaldees, and gavest him the name of Abraham;

    8And foundest his heart faithful before thee, and madest a covenant with him to give the land of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Jebusites, and the Girgashites, to give it, I say, to his seed, and hast performed thy words; for thou art righteous:

    Now, from these scriptures, who can doubt that God has not already kept the land promise to Abraham's physical seed..It was a done deal centuries ago..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 10th, 2012 at 10:59 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Rom 9:6-8 Israel !

    Rom 9:6-8

    6Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

    7Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

    8That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

    In this passage Israel is defined in four titles

    In vs 6 Israel

    in vs 7 The seed of Abraham or Children of Abraham

    in vs 8 Children of God and The Children of promise

    So either of these titles can be Israel, that is Israel is the seed of Abraham or children of Abraham, the Children of God or children of promise as well as Israel is Israel.

    So then the Children of Abraham by Faith as per Gal 3:7

    7Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

    This is Israel ! The Children or Sons of God by Faith are Israel Gal 3:26

    26For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

    The seed of Abraham is Israel Gal 3:29

    29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

    The Children of Promise as in Gal 4:28

    28Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

    All of these Titles for Israel are found in Rom 9:6-8 as they define Israel of vs 6..

    And likewise those Titles define believers in Christ no matter their ethnicity..

    So their is a Israel that is not based upon ethnicity, but based on belonging to Christ..

    Thats the Israel of God to whom all the promises of God were made to in the OT.
    Last edited by beloved57; August 11th, 2012 at 05:07 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    The Children of Promise !

    As previously posted one of the titles given Israel in the passage Rom 9:6-8 is that of Children of Promise vs 8

    That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

    Now, each believer in Christ is as Isaac was a child of promise, that is a child of Abraham in the same manner as Isaac became a child of Abraham, we know this testimony is True from Gal 4:28-29

    28Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

    29But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

    This statement is huge, very huge. You see this means we become children of Abraham because of God's Promise to Abraham, and not because we willed to become Abraham's children.

    This is how Isaac became Abraham's Child..

    Gen 17:15-19

    15And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be.

    16 And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of people shall be of her.

    17 Then Abraham fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear?

    18And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee!

    19And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.




    Notice the promise here given to Abraham by God to give Him a Son by His wife even though they were very well advanced in age..

    Again Gen 18:9-14

    9And they said unto him, Where is Sarah thy wife? And he said, Behold, in the tent.

    10And he said, I will certainly return unto thee according to the time of life; and, lo, Sarah thy wife shall have a son. And Sarah heard it in the tent door, which was behind him.

    11Now Abraham and Sarah were old and well stricken in age; and it ceased to be with Sarah after the manner of women.

    By the laws of nature, Sarah was too old to have a child, her reproduction days were over with..


    12Therefore Sarah laughed within herself, saying, After I am waxed old shall I have pleasure, my lord being old also?

    13And the LORD said unto Abraham, Wherefore did Sarah laugh, saying, Shall I of a surety bear a child, which am old?

    14Is any thing too hard for the LORD? At the time appointed I will return unto thee, according to the time of life, and Sarah shall have a son.

    This Statement denotes that Sarah having Isaac was by God performing a promise by His Power and Ability, and not due to normal and natural causes and in spite of natural ability to have children !

    Gen 21:1-3

    1And the LORD visited Sarah as he had said, and the LORD did unto Sarah as he had spoken.

    This is important, The LORD did [performed His word] unto Sarah as He had spoken or promised. see 1 kg 8:20;

    2For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him.

    3And Abraham called the name of his son that was born unto him, whom Sarah bare to him, Isaac.

    Now Isaac before he was ever born was said he would be Abraham's Heir of Promise ! Gen 15:1-4

    1After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.

    2And Abram said, LORD God, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?

    3And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir.

    4And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This[eliezer] shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.

    So Isaac was by God the designated Heir of promise ! What Heir ? Heb 11:8-10,16

    8By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

    9By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

    10For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

    Heirs of that Blessed Land of Promise, the Eternal heavenly city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God !

    16But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

    So quite simply, the Heirship was of Heaven, that everlasting good land of Canaan Gen 17:7-8

    8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

    Notice, through this Promise, the seed that shall inherit this eternal land [heaven] God has promised to be their God, no matter what generation they will born in vs

    7And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

    So in essence, the Children of promise are all those of Abraham's seed that God unconditionally establishes His everlasting Covenant with, and Isaac was one of many..

    So it was not Isaac's Faith [though of course He would be given Faith], nor His repentance, or anything He did that constituted him an heir of heaven or promise, but it was because and according to God's unconditional Promise that he would be Heir, and consequently, an heir will be a believer; and so it is with all true Believers in Christ, for they are so [believers] in the same manner as Isaac was children of promise, and heirs of that everlasting Canaan promised to Abraham and His seed Gen 17:5-8.

    So all believers are in actuality Isaac's to Abraham, but in different ethnic groups, and generations of time..we are all His children of promise born out of the performance of God performing His word..

    And all these are Israel, the Israel of God, the Children of Promise..

    God told Abraham Rom 9:7

    Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

    And of course Isaac's natural seed is not meant here, because of the distinction later made between Jacob and Esau !
    Last edited by beloved57; August 25th, 2012 at 08:15 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    The Hope Of Israel !
    Acts 28:20

    20For this cause therefore have I called for you, to see you, and to speak with you: because that for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.

    Paul stated as the Chosen Apostle to the Gentiles, that He was in chains for or because of the Hope of Israel !

    Was this Hope a earthly kingdom for the ethnic jews ? Or was this hope, the hope of the Gospel as per Col 1:23

    If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

    Paul was in bonds or chains in Acts 20:21-25 for this:

    21Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

    22And now, behold, I go bound in the spirit unto Jerusalem, not knowing the things that shall befall me there:

    23Save that the Holy Ghost witnesseth in every city, saying that bonds and afflictions abide me.

    24But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

    25And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.

    No doubt the bonds He was yet in acts 28:20 are for the same cause spoken here in Acts 20 24-25 Preaching the Gospel of the Grace of God and Preaching the Kingdom of God.

    If we look back to chpt 26 when paul spake unto King Agrippa, we see as paul understood the scriptures [being now converted and taught of God and no longer in His former ignorance Phil 3:4-8] The Hope of the promise of God made to the Fathers [Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob] unto which promise all the Twelve Tribes [The Church of God or The Israel of God] hope to come, was realized in the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

    Acts 26:6-8;16-18

    6And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God, unto our fathers:

    7Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

    8Why should it be thought a thing incredible with you, that God should raise the dead?

    And to confirm this He [Paul] explained His encounter with the risen Lord on the damascus road, of which He was charged by Him to preach the Gospel to both Jews and Greeks vs

    16But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;

    17Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,

    18To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

    Note: This is still the hope of Israel !

    In Preaching the Hope of Israel, He preached also the Kingdom of God by the Cross of Christ to both Jews and Gentiles Acts 28:28-31

    28Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it.

    29And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves.

    30And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all [jew or gentile] that came in unto him,

    31Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.

    So we see the Kingdom of God and the Lord Jesus Christ go hand and hand, and there is no preaching Christ without Preaching His resurrection see 1 Cor 15:3-4..

    From what has been presented, the Hope of Israel is Spiritual and grounded in the Cross of Christ and His resurrection, and so thats why paul even as a apostle to the gentiles could say that God, in raising up Christ, raised a Saviour unto Israel, meaning Spiritual Israel Acts 13:23

    23 Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

    This is the Hope of Israel, even the Israel of God..
    Last edited by beloved57; August 25th, 2012 at 08:14 PM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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