toldailytopic: Gays in the military.

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zoo22

Well-known member
The idiot here says he is not comparing discrimination against blacks by military personel to discrimination against behavior in the thread about homosexual behavior.

:thumb:

I can't help but notice that you didn't actually read my posts. But I can understand; it must be difficult focusing on the words with your head spinning around like that.

Thank you,

-- zoo "The idiot here" 22
 
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zoo22

Well-known member
Are you a troll, or really just this nuts?

Which just raises the questions: Can a troll just be nuts, and/or can nuts just be trolls? Is nuts just nuts, or can nuts also include trolls? Are trolls just trolls or can they be nuts?

Real questions. From my perspective, in this thread we've seen a nuttroll. A nuttroll that posts in blue. But that's only one simple man's opinion.

:plain:

On a larger scale, I myself think all combos can exist. Not necessarily peacefully. I think we can hope and we can work towards a coexistence. Troll. Nut. Nut, troll... Who's to say? But maybe that all better suited for a different "topic of the day."

The Lord turn his face toward you and give you peace. Including Nick M. Maybe especially in this thread.
 

zoo22

Well-known member
I've often thought of such things myself. When I was a young boy, in the 60's, I saw white 'auxiliary police' in our town, sitting on hoods of cars, in the street, on the border between our city and the next burg, which was mostly black, with shotguns prominently displayed. The first black I saw was in high school, and she was the first black to attend our school system.

Wow. I'm just too young to remember anything like that. Such a powerful image, (actually, imageS) and it must have been so strange for a kid to try to comprehend...

I'm sure everyone goes through changes. My dad got a Bronze Star for valor, when he threatened the life of his lieutenant, with a sidearm. Situation ethics comes into play very often in wartime.

Sounds like there's an intense and crazy story there. Wow. Would love to hear it. :plain:

My proudest moment in my life, of my dad, was in the South, while in a restaurant, on our summer trip to Florida, where a female black employee was being mistreated, for having dropped and broken a plate; my dad gathered us up and we left. It was shameful behavior, and I'll never forget that the longest day I live. Dad slipped her a tip before we left, and we didn't pay for our half-eaten food.

Something so simple but so crazy powerful. In an earlier post you'd mentioned you dad had problems with black people when he was young (as many people of that generation did). To have been able to make a real change within a lifetime is (I think) pretty amazing... And for a kid to witness that change I think is probably pretty profound.

Thanks for the sharing Aimiel. And also thanks for not taking my initial post the wrong way. Happy Memorial Day weekend. Hope the BBQ goes well. :)

-- zoo
 

MaryContrary

New member
Hall of Fame
Being gay has about as much to do with one's ability to serve their country as the colour of their hair.
Is it about one's ability to serve? I always thought there was some other reason gays were barred from the military. :idunno:

So far, to my understanding, homosexuals are barred from service because they pose an "unacceptable risk to the Armed Force’s standards of morale, good order, discipline, and unit cohesion." If you can't argue that, then don't argue something else instead. This is the military we are talking about here. The folks who fight and win wars on our behalf. How about we not play games with that, yeah?

There is no "right" to serve in the military. Rather, the military has the right to pick and chose who serves. And at those points when we draft, it can even forcibly pick and chose. Because it's kinda important.
 

Granite

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Is it about one's ability to serve? I always thought there was some other reason gays were barred from the military. :idunno:

So far, to my understanding, homosexuals are barred from service because they pose an "unacceptable risk to the Armed Force’s standards of morale, good order, discipline, and unit cohesion." If you can't argue that, then don't argue something else instead. This is the military we are talking about here. The folks who fight and win wars on our behalf. How about we not play games with that, yeah?

There is no "right" to serve in the military. Rather, the military has the right to pick and chose who serves. And at those points when we draft, it can even forcibly pick and chose. Because it's kinda important.

If push comes to shove would you rather have a straight coward or a gay hero in the foxhole with you?
 

MaryContrary

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If push comes to shove would you rather have a straight coward or a gay hero in the foxhole with you?
So far, to my understanding, homosexuals are barred from service because they pose an "unacceptable risk to the Armed Force’s standards of morale, good order, discipline, and unit cohesion." If you can't argue that, then don't argue something else instead. This is the military we are talking about here. The folks who fight and win wars on our behalf. How about we not play games with that, yeah?
 

Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
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If push comes to shove would you rather have a straight coward or a gay hero in the foxhole with you?

It isn't push comes to shove, and that is all there is. It is immoral and not that behavior is not allowed. And to answer the question, I would rather have the man that isn't looking at me like a snausage. If push comes to shove, you have to fight for yourself.
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
It isn't push comes to shove, and that is all there is. It is immoral and not that behavior is not allowed. And to answer the question, I would rather have the man that isn't looking at me like a snausage. If push comes to shove, you have to fight for yourself.

...because everyone knows each and every gay guy in the world wants to have sex with you.

Flatter yourself much?:chuckle:
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
Is it about one's ability to serve? I always thought there was some other reason gays were barred from the military. :idunno:

So far, to my understanding, homosexuals are barred from service because they pose an "unacceptable risk to the Armed Force’s standards of morale, good order, discipline, and unit cohesion." If you can't argue that, then don't argue something else instead. This is the military we are talking about here. The folks who fight and win wars on our behalf. How about we not play games with that, yeah?

There is no "right" to serve in the military. Rather, the military has the right to pick and chose who serves. And at those points when we draft, it can even forcibly pick and chose. Because it's kinda important.

How do they pose the risks described? They function perfectly well, and openly, in numerous militaries around the world. We just happen to be playing catch up.
 

Aimiel

Well-known member
Wow. I'm just too young to remember anything like that. Such a powerful image, (actually, imageS) and it must have been so strange for a kid to try to comprehend...
I wondered why the blacks were destroying businesses and fighting against the police. I thought it was strange seeing men with shotguns sitting in the street in broad daylight, as if they were hoping for someone to shoot at. My parents didn't say much about it. The news was no help, simply reporting facts, without giving explanation as to why these things were taking place. It was confusing to see, but I didn't enjoy seeing men beaten or attacked by police dogs. When students were killed demonstrating at Kent State, I thought that we were at the turning point of a revolution. Turns out: it was a revolution. People revolting against morality and the 'norms' our culture had formed, which provided stability and safety which we have now sacrificed in the name of sexual 'freedom' which is actually bondage. We have queers who are 'out', pedophiles, adulterers and every sexual sin men can imagine as the 'norm' making our nation one of the most perverse on the earth. Children who've never heard the word, "No," or had any discipline at all running roughshod over their teachers and peers, growing up to be sick, twisted self-seeking clods, wandering after their own lusts their whole lives. It's pretty sad, really. We've let go that which was good and embraced lasciviousness and vanity.
Sounds like there's an intense and crazy story there. Wow. Would love to hear it.
Central Germany, near the end of the war... Dad was wounded by an artillery shell in a creekbed, along with the rest of his squad (some of whom were killed outright by the explosion, shrapnel wounds, some died on the way to the aid station). The lieutenant was groaning, due to his wounds, and a nearby machine-gun nest would fire in their direction (through the morning fog) aiming at the sounds of moaning. Dad had his kneecap removed by a piece of shrapnel, but still crawled over to the lieutenant, and put his sidearm to his head, and told him if he made one more sound, he'd blow his brains out. They were rescued by a tank platoon advance, and when they got to the aid station, the lieutenant sought dad's court martial. The doctor, a colonel, asked dad what happened. He told dad that he would have just shot him. He also recommended dad for an award for bravery. His fellow soldiers were glad that dad had made it safe for them, and the army gave him a Bronze Star for his actions that day. He treated the men's wounds and stopped bleeding until medics arrived. I've spoken with four other men who were there that day, who described the things that happened, in detail, and never tired of hearing the story. My dad's best friend from grade school, who later became a prominent attorney in Cincinnati, would tell me the story, almost every time I went to see him. I never stopped him from doing so. He knew I had heard the story, he just felt better telling me how dad had saved his life that day.
Something so simple but so crazy powerful. In an earlier post you'd mentioned you dad had problems with black people when he was young (as many people of that generation did). To have been able to make a real change within a lifetime is (I think) pretty amazing... And for a kid to witness that change I think is probably pretty profound.
Dad's friends and the integrity of the blacks that he became friends with is responsible for the change, as well as dad's demeanor. He always got along with most everyone. He was a practical joker, and loved by many folks. He still is remembered by me, every day; and I'm thankful and honored to be his son. :thumb:
 

zoo22

Well-known member
Is it about one's ability to serve?

Yes.

I always thought there was some other reason gays were barred from the military. :idunno:

So far, to my understanding, homosexuals are barred from service because they pose an "unacceptable risk to the Armed Force’s standards of morale, good order, discipline, and unit cohesion." If you can't argue that, then don't argue something else instead. This is the military we are talking about here. The folks who fight and win wars on our behalf. How about we not play games with that, yeah?

And that's why in this case, there's a very legitimate comparison to race (despite the "oooh nooo! No comparing homosexuals to race, because being homosexual is a choice and/or behavior, but race isn't!!) but whether one believes that homosexuality is born or not, blacks (and women) in the army were a risk to morale. That was the hold-up. Morale. ...Women??? Oh no way!!! Blacks, oh no way!!!!

WE GOT OVER IT right? These freaked-out putzes that have a problem with gays in the military ought to put their personal fears on hold and be soldiers.

When someone's covering your back, who cares who that person wants to have sex with, unless it's perhaps your wife or husband (which probably isn't a homosexual issue).

There is no "right" to serve in the military. Rather, the military has the right to pick and chose who serves. And at those points when we draft, it can even forcibly pick and chose. Because it's kinda important.

Sure. No "right" to serve. And do you really want to be turning down people who are willing to put their lives on the line to protect you?? Please. If you really have a problem with people who are willing to place their lives on the line to protect you, but you're upset if they're gay ... I really think that's just pathetic, Mary. You might as well hole up somewhere with Nick M, in some weird fantasy-America-land where there are weird marshmallow treats and special BBQ's for straight white men and their marshmallow-cooking wives. Jello treats. I'd expect better of you. though.
 

zoo22

Well-known member
Freedom for a Leftists means coercion--You are free to have :BRAVO: our wicked values crammed down your throat. (Lev. 18:22, 1 Kin. 14:24, Lev. 20:13, Rom. 1:24, 26, 27). :vomit:

Thanks, that's an interesting perspective for me to to think about. Also, well put.
 
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