The earth is flat and we never went to the moon

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JudgeRightly

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DFT_Dave said:
The purpose of these videos is so people can see and evaluate the evidence that is presented for flat earth and decide for themselves if it is valid or not.

Your purpose is to make the case that this evidence is fraudulent.

My goal is to evaluate and compare both sides of this argument. Flat earth is a growing movement and I believe we need to be informed about it and have a civil debate on the matter.

I've been educating myself on cosmology for the past couple of years, both from the past to the current models of the universe.

Planets don't look at all like what NASA shows us from a Nikon P900 camera.

View attachment 25410

See video.


--Dave
Click to expand...

Now, I'm no photographer, but I watched that video and could instantly see why you think that venus would look like the image you posted.

The camera is out of focus. That's why you're getting all that "interference" (for lack of a better word). It's simply not powerful enough to see something that's that far away.

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Clete

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DFT_Dave said:
I saw the link and it was informative. I certainly will compare it with all the other sites I can find, thanks.

Something I don't think you appreciate is that I studied Calvinism in order to reject it in favor of the free will of man. I studied the whole history of the nature of God which included Greek philosophy before I rejected the classic model for a free will open future theism/of God. I studied atheism and pantheism religions before I rejected both and also the pan-en-theism that is a synthesis of pantheism and monotheism which is the foundation of classical theism and Hinduism. For the past three years, much of which I was absent from theology on line, I have been studying cosmologies, all of them.

I studied evolution for the same reason. For me, all comments and arguments, other than those that show a violation of the laws of rational thought, are meaningless and show a weakness of understanding or reliability of the their position.

I consider all those who oppose my views to be wrong not insane. To say they are insane is more dangerous than the views they hold. You said insane views, that's pretty close, please don't cross the line. Make your case, if it's reality then it will prevail.

--Dave
Click to expand...

I think I've demonstrated, not only here in this thread, but over the decades that I've participated in this forum, that I make an argument when one is warranted and ridicule the stupid and insane when that is warranted. Not all ideas are equal and not all deserve our respect. Some ideas really do display a level of insanity that is unworthy of a serious response. I don't respect the degenerate, the insane, the silly and the stupid. My granting them unearned respect does not elevate them, it diminishes and insults those of us who think clearly. Making honest errors happens to everyone but divorcing once's self from all common sense, rational thought and reality in order to maintain a grasp on some obscure idea that doesn't make the slightest difference in how you live your life is not merely an error, it's intellectual suicide that those of us with minds that work should not enable nor encourage it by granting it the sort of respectability that comes with disciplined rational thought and investigation.

And doesn't your, "if it's reality then it will prevail" sentiment contradict the notion of a worldwide, multi-generational conspiracy designed to trick everyone into thinking the Earth is round instead of flat? Or where you saying that it'll prevail with you personally?

Clete
 
Caino

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Clete said:
I think I've demonstrated, not only here in this thread, but over the decades that I've participated in this forum, that I make an argument when one is warranted and ridicule the stupid and insane when that is warranted. Not all ideas are equal and not all deserve our respect. Some ideas really do display a level of insanity that is unworthy of a serious response. I don't respect the degenerate, the insane, the silly and the stupid. My granting them unearned respect does not elevate them, it diminishes and insults those of us who think clearly. Making honest errors happens to everyone but divorcing once's self from all common sense, rational thought and reality in order to maintain a grasp on some obscure idea that doesn't make the slightest difference in how you live your life is not merely an error, it's intellectual suicide that those of us with minds that work should not enable nor encourage it by granting it the sort of respectability that comes with disciplined rational thought and investigation.

And doesn't your, "if it's reality then it will prevail" sentiment contradict the notion of a worldwide, multi-generational conspiracy designed to trick everyone into thinking the Earth is round instead of flat? Or where you saying that it'll prevail with you personally?

Clete
Click to expand...

You are giving him the attention he craves. Never, NEVER argue with an idiot, someone watching may not be able to distinguish the one from the other. I've made the mistake myself arguing with the 9/11 conspiracy people. At some point you realize that their personal pride is so invested in a belief that to capitulate would mean they death of their obsession of the mind. When a person believes their own self delusion you are no longer interacting with someone acquainted with basic reality.
 
CabinetMaker

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Caino said:
You are giving him the attention he craves. Never, NEVER argue with an idiot, someone watching may not be able to distinguish the one from the other. I've made the mistake myself arguing with the 9/11 conspiracy people. At some point you realize that their personal pride is so invested in a belief that to capitulate would mean they death of their obsession of the mind. When a person believes their own self delusion you are no longer interacting with someone acquainted with basic reality.
Click to expand...
It is one of my many character flaws but I do enjoy arguing with the 911ers. I like discussing things with the flat Earters as well. It is fascinating to explorer their mind set. They have so carefully constructed their arguments and compartmentalized them to make their "math" work. I love to ask them questions and see what they will answer and what they will not answer. It usually reveals a deeply disorganized approach to examining evidence that only works if you accept their assumptions.
 
DFT_Dave

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JudgeRightly said:
Now, I'm no photographer, but I watched that video and could instantly see why you think that venus would look like the image you posted.

The camera is out of focus. That's why you're getting all that "interference" (for lack of a better word). It's simply not powerful enough to see something that's that far away.

Sent from my Pixel XL using TheologyOnline mobile app
Click to expand...

All video and photos from every source for stars is acceptable evidence for either position. I will be comparing all of them and I will be open to arguments from both sides. I want to make up my own mind on this and want every one else to be able to do the same with out one side or the other calling any one crazy or insane. That only leads to deciding for the sake of acceptance and not wanting to be emotionally pressured.

Thanks for the view and the response.

--Dave
 
JudgeRightly

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DFT_Dave said:
All video and photos from every source for stars is acceptable evidence for either position. I will be comparing all of them and I will be open to arguments from both sides. I want to make up my own mind on this and want every one else to be able to do the same with out one side or the other calling any one crazy or insane. That only leads to deciding for the sake of acceptance and not wanting to be emotionally pressured.

Thanks for the view and the response.

--Dave
Click to expand...
Dave, I'm saying that the camera is out of focus.

You can't get a good idea of what anything looks like if you don't have a clear image of it. The images from that video are not clear enough to be used as evidence for either side. For all I know, the camera could be looking at someone on a tall building with a flashlight pointing at the camera. There's no way to determine if that is or is not the case because the image is not in focus.

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DFT_Dave

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Clete said:
I think I've demonstrated, not only here in this thread, but over the decades that I've participated in this forum, that I make an argument when one is warranted and ridicule the stupid and insane when that is warranted. Not all ideas are equal and not all deserve our respect. Some ideas really do display a level of insanity that is unworthy of a serious response. I don't respect the degenerate, the insane, the silly and the stupid. My granting them unearned respect does not elevate them, it diminishes and insults those of us who think clearly. Making honest errors happens to everyone but divorcing once's self from all common sense, rational thought and reality in order to maintain a grasp on some obscure idea that doesn't make the slightest difference in how you live your life is not merely an error, it's intellectual suicide that those of us with minds that work should not enable nor encourage it by granting it the sort of respectability that comes with disciplined rational thought and investigation.

And doesn't your, "if it's reality then it will prevail" sentiment contradict the notion of a worldwide, multi-generational conspiracy designed to trick everyone into thinking the Earth is round instead of flat? Or where you saying that it'll prevail with you personally?

Clete
Click to expand...

Yes for me personally, and for others as well I hope. But what ever I decide will not be based on your or any one else's charge of insanity or stupidity or...you get the point. I was asked by friends of mine when I was thinking about becoming a Christian if I had lost my mind. Their are lots of people who think all Bible believing Christians are nuts. I didn't care then and I don't now. I'll know more about this subject then all of you in time and my opinion will be well founded. I already think Einstein to be completely wrong and he said Newton was wrong, a geocentric universe was true for a long time until the heliocentric one replaced it. Now we have multi-universes and a revival of flat earth. So if you, or anyone thinks this is a simple thing to figure out, think again.

--Dave
 
PyramidHead

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If the earth is flat and we don't have a super dense core, where does our gravity come from?
How did our planet form flat when we see the process of planet creation creates spherical heavenly bodies?
Why don't the oceans spill off the edges of our planet?
 
DFT_Dave

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JudgeRightly said:
Dave, I'm saying that the camera is out of focus.

You can't get a good idea of what anything looks like if you don't have a clear image of it. The images from that video are not clear enough to be used as evidence for either side. For all I know, the camera could be looking at someone on a tall building with a flashlight pointing at the camera. There's no way to determine if that is or is not the case because the image is not in focus.

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Click to expand...

I know what you said, it was a good point. I don't know if it's decisive, but it's a good observation and when I view them now I keep that in mind, and that's helpful.

--Dave
 
JudgeRightly

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PyramidHead said:
If the earth is flat and we don't have a super dense core, where does our gravity come from?
How did our planet form flat when we see the process of planet creation creates spherical heavenly bodies?
Why don't the oceans spill off the edges of our planet?
Click to expand...

Flat Earther's inherently reject the concept of gravity, because it goes against their theory, their worldview.

They also say there's a wall of ice keeping the oceans from spilling over. and even then, they're not even sure how far the ice goes.

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PyramidHead

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So flat earth basically relies on rejecting the observable universe around them, and putting 100% faith into people with mental illness rambling on YouTube?

Astonishing.
 
DFT_Dave

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Caino said:
You are giving him the attention he craves. Never, NEVER argue with an idiot, someone watching may not be able to distinguish the one from the other. I've made the mistake myself arguing with the 9/11 conspiracy people. At some point you realize that their personal pride is so invested in a belief that to capitulate would mean they death of their obsession of the mind. When a person believes their own self delusion you are no longer interacting with someone acquainted with basic reality.
Click to expand...

I'm certainly not craving your attention. If that's you in the pic, you're ugly, get another pic.

You're also projecting, though I doubt you know what that means, :rotfl:

--Dave
 
DFT_Dave

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CabinetMaker said:
It is one of my many character flaws but I do enjoy arguing with the 911ers. I like discussing things with the flat Earters as well. It is fascinating to explorer their mind set. They have so carefully constructed their arguments and compartmentalized them to make their "math" work. I love to ask them questions and see what they will answer and what they will not answer. It usually reveals a deeply disorganized approach to examining evidence that only works if you accept their assumptions.
Click to expand...

And the same can be said of you, which is why your mind set argument is itself a logical fallacy.

--Dave
 
DFT_Dave

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PyramidHead said:
So flat earth basically relies on rejecting the observable universe around them, and putting 100% faith into people with mental illness rambling on YouTube?

Astonishing.
Click to expand...

No, that's not what flat earth is. The people with mental illness are the ones who think that is what flat earth is.

--Dave
 
PyramidHead

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DFT_Dave said:
No, that's not what flat earth is. The people with mental illness are the ones who think that is what flat earth is.

--Dave
Click to expand...

Oh, so you got some numbers and data for me? How did our planet form, if gravity did not help shape our planet? We can see the process of heavenly body creation leads to spherical objects. Why not us? How do we maintain our atmosphere without a core?
 
DFT_Dave

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PyramidHead said:
Oh, so you got some numbers and data for me? How did our planet form, if gravity did not help shape our planet? We can see the process of heavenly body creation leads to spherical objects. Why not us? How do we maintain our atmosphere without a core?
Click to expand...

Why don't you read what's already been posted on this thread? Most of your questions have already been addressed.

--Dave
 
Caino

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DFT_Dave said:
I'm certainly not craving your attention. If that's you in the pic, you're ugly, get another pic.

You're also projecting, though I doubt you know what that means, :rotfl:

--Dave
Click to expand...

Awwwww, poor Dave got his fragile ego dinged? Projection, or more accurately Psychological projection, is a theory in psychology in which humans defend themselves against their own unpleasant impulses by denying their existence while attributing them to others. For instance, a person who is habitually rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude. It can take the form of blame shifting.Paranoia would be the belief that NASA is involved in a conspiracy to make the earth look round when its flat.

See ya in the funny papers!
 
DFT_Dave

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Caino said:
Awwwww, poor Dave got his fragile ego dinged? Projection, or more accurately Psychological projection, is a theory in psychology in which humans defend themselves against their own unpleasant impulses by denying their existence while attributing them to others. For instance, a person who is habitually rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude. It can take the form of blame shifting.Paranoia would be the belief that NASA is involved in a conspiracy to make the earth look round when its flat.

See ya in the funny papers!
Click to expand...

--Dave :wave2:
 
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